Ten rounds of .44mag VS six rounds of .30/30

[JohnBT]

Bears? Charging bears? Have you ever seen how fast a bear can run?

I'd go with a Marlin 444. JT

"A big bore favorite that combines the power of the big 444 Marlin cartridge—which generates nearly 1.5 tons of muzzle energy—with the quick and super-smooth Marlin lever action system. Its 22" barrel makes the 444 a real joy to handle, no matter what the conditions."

 

[treeprof]

Alan - I have a 336M (the first model year's designation for the 336SS) and a 1894P, with my eye on an 1894SS as my next purchase. For your purposes, I'd take the 1894SS. The 44 mag is a very flexible cartridge w/respect to bullet types and wts, plus you can shoot .44 spcl's out of it. For bear, you want big, heavy bullets. Federal 300 gr Castcores cycle fine in my 1894, and it is abt the heaviest commercial loading you can find that's not too long to cycle in a lever gun (tho I've not tried the Buffalo Bores)

I gotta say, tho, that you are really overly concerned abt the whole Pa bear thing. A bear sighting, let alone a charge, is HIGHLY, HIGHLY unlikely while you're hanging about the woods. Because of the nature of my research, I have spent more than a few summers, or parts of them, with more outdoor time than indoor time all over the U.S. At times those were in places fairly thick with bears (like Denali NP, Yellowstone NP, Kodiak Isl., the Alaskan bush) and I have too seldom even seen bears. Shoot, one of my research sites in W. North Carolina was home to a problem bear from Shenandoah NP that had been relocated there, and in three years neither I nor my students ever saw him once (tho he did destroy some of my equipment). I've had research gear destroyed by griz in AK on more than one occasion, but again never saw a bear at that particular spot. Some of my AK friends have been bluff charged, but never attacked. And a bluff charge may end w/in feet, not yards - you just never know. Shooting would be a last resort, and only justified at very close range (a few yds) at a charging bear. If you read accounts of folks attacked by bears, lots of them never had (or if armed would have had) time to fire a shot anyway (attacked at dark, in thick brush, non-frontal attack, etc.)

Rather than bears, my most nerve-wracking encounters have been with other angry or jittery critters - specifically moose, bison, musk oxen and a stampeding herd of caribou I met head-on in a narrow gully while they were being chased by wolves one winter. Now THAT was frightening. Honestly, I almost never worry abt bears.

 

[Soap]

At my parent's house in PA I've seen coyote tracks in our upper grazing field. But never have I encountered one in living there for 18 years. That was on the far Western side of the state however.

Both rifles will do, you're thinking too hard Just get one, get a ton of ammo or reloading supplies and learn that gun like it is an extension of your body.

 

[TallPine]

Alan, if you ever have trouble with a (black) bear, chances are 99.999999 % it will be a mother with cubs that you stumble onto in thick trees and/or brush.

So you should practice shooting while lying on your back and feeding an extra arm or leg to mama bear for a diversion.

Actually, if you already have a 357 revolver, I would think about a lever rifle in 357. Otherwise, a 44 mag revolver / lever rifle combo.

Coyotes will not be a hazard unless you have livestock to defend (sheep, rabbits, chickens, etc).

The two legged varmits are always the most dangerous where ever you are.

 

[cratz2]

I tell ya... those durn coyotes are sneaky little devils. I know we have them, I've been told so by avid hunters (keep in mind we've only live in our new house for abotu 4 months) and I can hear them and the hunters take them all the time and I've seen the tracks in three places that I can confirm... but I've yet to see one. I stayed up all night on one of the decks waiting for one to come around to a squirrel I'd shot and left. Never saw any trace of one but in the morning, the squirrel was gone.

Did I doze off? Was the mut able to walk across many leaves without so much as a crackle? Am I deaf and blind?

As for killing coyote, I've said before the most prolific coyote hunter I personally know hunts them with a light weight Winchester .357 lever gun. There is a golf course no too far from Indy that I guess was over run with them for a while. Whe was hired to clean 'em up. He swears a 357 is more effective than a 223 or 22.250. For whatever that's worth. I've taken them with 22 Magnum, 223, 243, 25-06, 270 and 12 gauge. First time out was with buckshot at my friends suggestion. Only got one the first night be the buckshot flopped him around and he didn't get out of sight before he quit runnin'.

If you can hit one in anything close to a vital with one 357 or 45 handgun, you'll kill it.

 

[Redlg155]

I'd prefer the .44 because you can always get some special ammo for slithering creatures. I'd be more worried about rattlers than bears.

Good Shooting
Red

 

[Baba Louie]

I'd say if its good for gators, it's probably gonna be good for a bear or anything smaller.

Were I to move to PA, I'd worry more about being outdoors during the hunting season and having a stray bullet find its way towards me. I've got two friends who both lived in PA (born and raised) with scars from one of the those "To Whom It May Concern" type bullets.

Neither ever heard the shot, both were just floored (literally) when they were hit (left arm for one, lower right leg other). Each has two perfect little .30 caliber (we assume) scars, entrance and exit. Both had slight bone damage, both moved from PA soon thereafter. One to Texas, one to Nevada. Both still hunt but claim that the number of hunters where they now hunt is waaaaaaaayyyy lower than PA during deer season.

Fud, you really need one of each eventually.

Adios

 

[munk]

The 30/30 probably has more kinetic energy, per hornady, but the 44 would be better at stopping bears close. I think you should shoot a friend's and find out which round you want to spend time with.


on rattlesnakes; if you're close enough to need a gun with rattlers, it is already too late. If you have time to pick your shot, you don't need snake shot.


munk

 

[Dr.Rob]

You'll get far better ballistics at 150-200 yards with the 30-30, not to mention longe range knockdown power.

Besides the curved pistol grip is better.

 

[Marcus]

To muddy the waters a little more (heh heh ) why not also consider a Puma lever action (beefed up 1892 clone) in .454 Casull? I just handles one at my local gunshop and fell in love! The action`s as smooth as a well worn vintage 1894 and it looks to be very nicely made. If they`re all that good (and they shoot that good too) they`re a bargain at the $399 asking price. WHich would you rather have 10rds. of .44 mag., 6 of .30-30 or 9 of .454 Casull? As for bear defense in Pa. I`ve lived here all my life and spent a good deal of time off the beaten path. I`ve never even seen a track let alone a bear (although I`d love to!). All my close calls have been with Eastern Diamondbacks. I carry an NAA Mini revolver in .22mag. loaded with 2rds. of CCI snakeshot and the rest MaximagVs for them. Marcus

 

[Crimper-D]

Got a Marlin .44Mag = Like it!

If it'll do for close up pigs in California, it'll do for bears, wolves, whatever wherever... the round fits my Redhawk too Don't see a lot of 30-30 handguns except for a Thompson Contender

 

[Edward429451]

I'd go with the 44 mag given the parameters of use. More frontal area, plenty of weight, extremely similar ballistics to the 30/30, compatable ammo with wheelguns, more versatility than the 30/30, more ammo capacity, cheaper ammo, need I go on?

 

[larryw]

Get the '94 in 44Mag. In addition to all the reasons stated above, staring down that big-ol pipe of a 44 mag rifle will discourage anybody with an IQ over the wind-chill temp.

 

[thisaway]

What about a Ruger .44mag. "Deerfield" carbine ? That should give you plenty of "firepower" for just about anything.
Thisaway