The Best Bad Choice for Home Defense

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Every time I hear somebody that rattles on about their badass .410 Judge or whatever, I just cringe.

A slug out of a .410 is doing maybe 900 fps and weighs 88 grains. A lead bullet from a .38 Special is typically 158 grains at maybe 800 fps. I don't consider something that has 1/2 the power of a.38 to be a real hard core round.

Buckshot would be worse IMO. Worse yet are those goofy rounds with the discs. If they hit any way except directly on edge, there would be almost zero penetration.

A .22 would have better penetration and multiple rounds would be a distinct advantage in my world.

I would have no problem using a 410 shotgun for home defense. (and have in the past) A 3" 410 shotshell has five 000 buckshot. Each has a muzzle energy of 200 lb-ft. That is the equivalent of getting shot with a .380 ACP five times.

The problem with 410 revolvers is the incredible short barrel and light weight.
 
When I first moved out on my own at 19 years old, to about 27yrs old, I kept as my home defense gun, my Sears single shot 20 gauge that I received as a Christmas present when I was 12. I figured from my experience hunting with that shotgun up to that point in time, that it handled nicely, and that I could get off two good shots pretty quickly. Thankfully, I never had to test that theory.
 
Crap. Those two scenarios suck.

I've owned a single shot 12 gauge Winchester and grew up shooting my dad's Marlin 60. Even with practice and a butt cuff full of ammo, that Winchester wasn't exactly fast. At least it had an ejector instead of merely an extractor, but you still had to manually cock it after closing the breech. I'd have to pick the Marlin full of hyper velocity rounds and hope for the best for scenario 1.

For scenario 2, the only single shot .410 I ever had was a long barrel shotgun. I've never even seen a single shot pistol in .410. I also have a H&R Sportsman that is one round shy of that 10 round revolver. So between those two options, I'd have to pick the .22 revolver for scenario 2.

How about this. Let me upgrade to at least .22 WMR in either scenario and I'd feel better about it. :D
 
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When I was about 14 I was home alone and received a strange phone call that freaked me out. Some odd things had been going on in the area. We didn't own any firearms. I called my mom and she came home. Until she got there I had my 40lb compound bow with target points at the ready.
 
I would pick the single shot .12 gauge, as it is the closest to my home defense gun.
My H&R single shot .20 gauge which I use for grouse, has a 5 round cuff with #3 buck. I have 5 loose #3 buckshot cartridges on a book shelf by the gun.
This is my gun for "what goes bump in the night."
I do not feel that this is a bad choice for me. I know this shotgun very well and how it shoots.
Andy
 
I do not feel that this is a bad choice for me. I know this shotgun very well and how it shoots.
Andy

Like Clint Smith said "I don't need a thousand dollar shotgun, I need to know how to run the gun I got."

I'm glad people are enjoying this conversation, and am enjoying reading the comments
 
The first GSW of my career was from a 22 pistol to the face. while I wouldn't make the 22 my first choice, it ain't a bad option.
 
Scenario 1 (long guns)
2) An H&R single shot 12 ga with a nylon side saddle with 5rds of 00 buckshot (buckshot is downright devastating up close. It would make a much, much better club than the marlin as well)

Scenario 2 (hand guns)

1) A 10rd .22 revolver (Ive got a nine shot that I love, and that's a lot of little tumbled holes) Likely a bleed out scenario.
 
This is a fun idea.

Scenario 1:
12 guage single shot.

Scenario 2:
22. caliber revolver.

I am not sure why not the 410 single shot, but something about those options gravitated me toward the revolver with extra rounds.

Fun thread.
 
18 rounds from a .22 rifle would be my choice because home invasions with more than one individual seem to be a lot more common nowadays.

My feeling exactly. so long as you know the rifle works very reliably with something like CCI Stinger/Velocitor, etc.. I don't think may BGs are committed enough to a robbery to withstand a barrage of .22LR to the face and neck area.

Every time I hear somebody that rattles on about their badass .410 Judge or whatever, I just cringe.

With a handgun, yes I agree completely. I have an M500 in .410, and love that little booger. It sits next to my wife's side of the bed. Low recoil, fast handling, leight weight, fast followup shots are all major plusses. She loads it with 3" 000buck. That's a seriously nasty load. Five pellets of 000 at over 1100FPS is nothing to scoff at. That's a combined total of 350gr worth of lead flying out with every pull of the trigger, at 1100fps.

Again, from a handgun, it's obviously a different story though.
 
I don't think may BGs are committed enough to a robbery to withstand a barrage of .22LR to the face and neck area.

I doubt many robbers are committed enough to continue advancing into any gunfire.

I just make it a habit not to be involved with people that employ assassination squads. It is easier than preparing to survive an assault by one.
 
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Bad choice? Heck, my grandpa has MY marlin 60 beside his bed
For years he relied on a baby browning, but at 86 years young he has lost the ability to grasp that tiny little joker and operate it so he was back to a single shot bolt action 22. We swapped my model 60 for his single shot...which was given to him at age 4 by his grandfather who had it before paw was born.

I also know of at least one guy who thinks that a bolt action scoped rifle is sufficient...

The least armed I have ever been was in college when I relied on a Henry 22 carbine with large loop.
 
Obviously whatever gun(s) and ammunition have to be reliable. If all four, including their ammo, are highly reliable, then there is another important consideration: Would it/they be kept loaded or unloaded?

If kept loaded, the Marlin and/or the revolver. The best shot in the world may need more than one shot, as from what I have read about carefully document incidents of this sort, sometimes more than one shot is needed by the defender. If so, that next shot is virtually guaranteed needed immediately! For that matter more than two shots may be required. The fastest man in the world would not be able to reliably reload under such conditions if things go worse than most people choose to expect. There actually have been a few instances where an attacker was not stopped by a 12 gauge slug to the chest. Rare? Ultra rare! Not what I'd expect either, but I'd still rather have multiple .22LRs over a single 12 or .410 round. Of course there may be more than one attacker and even stopping the first does not guarantee the others will quit.

Yet there is a much more common likelihood: The defender may miss or only get a marginal hit and this does not stop the attack. You think you can't miss at such short range? Please consider the attacker is moving and not always as you might expect; the light will be bad; you did not expect this specifically (unlike getting ready to fire on the range); you may have been sleepy and now you're probably shaking, especially since you don't know exactly what to expect.

OTOH, if the gun(s) is/are to be kept unloaded, then the breakopens are the fastest to load.

Oh, someone touched on this previously, but I'll expand. If the defender is just going to wait for the attacker to come through a locked door or otherwise past a certain point, then a long gun is better, space preventing an immediate grab by the attacker(s). If the defender has to go through the house, handguns are better.
 
I'm not Clint Smith, so forget the single shot 12 gauge. A .22 can be a wicked self defense round if you grind (or belt sand, whatever) the nose of the bullet at an angle, thereby guaranteeing the bullet will tumble when it hits. This is more effective than a hollow point which doesn't expand half the time anyway. Accuracy is not an issue in an inside the home scenario.

These modified bullets don't always feed well in an auto-loader. Therefor, under the rules of the OP, I would take the ten shot revolver.
 
If I can modify that 12 gauge single shot, I might change my choice on scenario 1 back in post 28.

Fer instance, let me cut the barrel back to 18.5" and let me mount a knife bayonet somehow. That would make me feel better about not having an immediate second shot. ;)
 
Best Bad Choice (or Worst Choice?) for HD

Liberator .45 single shot pistol, and trying reloads !:uhoh:
Maybe you get 'em on the first shot ? :confused: Maybe not !:eek:
 
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On the long gun one a henry 22lr lever action, don't have to worry about bad ammo or feeding and a fair number of rounds on hand,

on the hand gun the 22lr revolver I have a 9 shot Iver Johnson that would work in a pinch can't really reload it on the fly but il take those 9 rounds of mini mag over a short barrel 410 any day of the week
 
Every time I hear somebody that rattles on about their badass .410 Judge or whatever, I just cringe.

+1 on that. Having grown up with 2 .410 shotguns and watching squirrels keep right on running after being shot by them I lost respect for that round many, many years ago. They were the first guns my brothers were given when we were young. They were both older than me. By the time it came time for me to start shooting I never even bothered picking up those .410's.

BTW I've seen lots of single shot .410 pistols. They were popular in the late 50's and early 60's but for what I'm not sure. They also fired a .45 LC obviously. They were basically Derringers with too much power to hold but not enough to really defend in the case of the .410.

One other thing. You can use hyper velocity ammo in a Marlin 60 as some have suggested. That level of power will bust the recoil buffer sometimes within just a very few shots. If that happens your rifle won't work until you get another buffer.
 
Five pellets of 000 at over 1100FPS is nothing to scoff at. That's a combined total of 350gr worth of lead flying out with every pull of the trigger, at 1100fps.
. Uhhhhh.......I'd have to see that out of a pistol to believe it.

My .40 S&W operates at maybe 40k PSI and launches a 180 at maybe 1,200 fps. A shotgun operates at about 1/3rd of that pressure and is gonna push 2x the weight just as fast?

Laws of physics say otherwise. Maybe I' wrong. Don't think so.
 
Had that "bad" choice to make 40 years ago, it was the best available to me at the time.

Marlin 60 with a dozen and a half rounds seemed better to me than Stevens 16 ga with one round,

My thoughts on that haven't really changed.
edit: I just wish the average thug victim was armed as well today as a lot of us were decades ago.
 
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