The dry firing myth

[MachIVshooter]

I make S&W owners wear latex gloves before touching my Rugers.

That's very thoughtful of you. It never occurred to me that I should be helping people to avoid getting any Ruger on them.

I'd suggest nitrile gloves, though. Latex allergies are common, and would probably be worse than Ruger contamination.

 

[Officers'Wife]

Well, myth or not... no clue... I do know of a gun shop that will ask you to leave if you dry fire a weapon. Don't bother to explain to the owner it doesn't hurt the weapon, he will just point to the 40 caliber hole in the floor next to the pistol case.

 

[herrwalther]

Well, myth or not... no clue... I do know of a gun shop that will ask you to leave if you dry fire a weapon. Don't bother to explain to the owner it doesn't hurt the weapon, he will just point to the 40 caliber hole in the floor next to the pistol case.

There is a local gun store near me that has a sign that says "If you dry fire it, you buy it." I am certain it cannot be enforced that well but it gives me a laugh and reminder when I go in.

Dry firing won't hurt most modern firearms. The rule of thumb I follow is not to dry fire anything rimfire if it can be avoided. I also don't dry fire any revolver where I can see the firing pin on the hammer. Other than those two rules I read the owner's manual to see if anything is mentioned about dry firing from the manufacturer. It is one of the few things I open the manual for.

 

[4v50 Gary]

I know someone who broke his Python's firing pin because of dry firing. Hint: use a snap cap.

 

[coloradokevin]

I think this thread would be better served in discussing the etiquette of handling a gun that does not belong to you as opposed to listing all the guns that can and cannot be dry fired.

Whether you know it to be safe or not, I believe a person should always ask permission from the owner to dry fire a weapon before doing so. I would not purchase a weapon that I have not thoroughly tested the trigger, but its up to the gun owner or store to decide if they will accommodate my request, provide snap caps or something to make them feel better, or send me on my way to buy elsewhere. You own it, you get to make the rules. I make S&W owners wear latex gloves before touching my Rugers.

Of course, and I don't disagree with you here. I always ask before dry firing at a store, even when I know the gun is perfectly safe to dry fire. But, I've been given the "lecture" upon asking before, and usually walk away rolling my eyes afterward. I also saw some poor customer get his butt chewed for doing something that would cause no harm to the firearm that he dry-fired.

Also, I fully understand the responses some people have posted about certain guns that are not safe to dry fire. Most guns can handle this practice, a few cannot. But, in a store that sells almost nothing other than 'black rifles' and polymer pistols, the whole thing seemed a bit laughable!

 

[george burns]

The owners manual will usually say "do not dry fire", if the gun is not designed for that. Some guns are not, just check the manual or call the manufacturer if you want to be sure.
Same goes for some shotguns.

 

[javjacob]

Quote: ...243winxb...
Q: Can I dry fire my Smith & Wesson?

A: Yes, except for the .22 caliber pistols which includes models 22A, 22S, 422, 2206, 2214, 2213 and 41.

.22 caliber revolvers such as models 17, 43, 63, 317 and 617 also should not be dry fired.

Q: Why can't I dry fire my .22 pistol or revolver?

A: Dry firing a S&W .22 pistol or revolver will cause damage to the firing pin.


Bingo! No rimfire should ever be dry fired no matter what anyone says. My advice to those who insist they must dry fire a gun is to use empty shell casings or snap caps. They do make snap caps for a reason. Some guns are OK to be dry fired by the MFG but that still doesn't mean its not hard on it.
Dry fire all you want though its not my gun. I also think its stupid to make a thread saying dry firing wont hurt and its a myth when you are clearly wrong.

 

[javjacob]

Henry is another one of many that say NO! to dry firing.

 

[coloradokevin]

OP calls it a myth, then admits it doesn't apply to every firearm.

Misapplied? Yes. Mythic? Obviously not.

It is absolutely a myth as far as the firearms I mentioned are concerned. Context is important here, and I admitted in my opening post that some firearms shouldn't be dry fired. But, for a salesperson to perpetuate a myth that it is harmful to all guns is silly.

There is a local gun store near me that has a sign that says "If you dry fire it, you buy it." I am certain it cannot be enforced that well but it gives me a laugh and reminder when I go in.

That's EXACTLY the kind of thing I was thinking of when I posted this thread, as I've seen such a sign at two or more gun stores over the years. Given that the majority of today's most popular firearms are completely safe to dry fire, I find that kind of stuff a bit ridiculous.

Now, I have seen a shop with a sign that said something along the lines of: "Please ask before dry-firing a firearm". This particular store sold a wide variety of firearms, and was totally cool with people dry firing guns that could be done so safely. They simply wanted people to ask before dry-firing so that they didn't harm guns that might not tolerate such a practice. I have no issue with that.

 

[Jesse H]

I've got a 16 year old MK2 22/45 that I've always dry fired. Wasn't until this year when a buddy told me why I shouldn't. Firing pin and breech still look ok. I've stopped though.

 

[ku4hx]

I think the OP makes an excellent point. Reminds me of that other internet myth about never firing lead bullets in a Glock.

 

[Theohazard]

Dry fire all you want though its not my gun. I also think its stupid to make a thread saying dry firing wont hurt and its a myth when you are clearly wrong.

No, he's not wrong; did you even read the first post? He never once said it was always safe to dry fire, he said it was usually safe with modern firearms. He's completely right: It's a myth that you shouldn't EVER dry fire, because with the vast majority of modern guns it's completely fine.

No rimfire should ever be dry fired no matter what anyone says. My advice to those who insist they must dry fire a gun is to use empty shell casings or snap caps. They do make snap caps for a reason.

Some rimfires have firing pin stops that protect them from damage when dry firing. Sure, those blocks can eventually wear down, but it takes a long time and they're usually easy to replace. So saying you should never dry fire any .22 is ridiculous. And the primary use for snap caps these days is for training and stoppage practice. Heck, most .22 snap caps specifically tell you on the package not to use them for dry firing.

Some guns are OK to be dry fired by the MFG but that still doesn't mean its not hard on it.

No, it's not hard on many guns. Guns like ARs and Glocks can be dry fired all you want with no damage.

Coloradokevin, I think responses like these are a perfect example of why you decided to make this thread, huh?

 

[Theohazard]

I've got a 16 year old MK2 22/45 that I've always dry fired. Wasn't until this year when a buddy told me why I shouldn't. Firing pin and breech still look ok. I've stopped though.

It's fine to dry fire a Ruger Mk-series .22. This is from a Ruger FAQ and is their answer to the question if they're safe to dry fire:

"Yes. The Mark III has a firing pin stop that prevents the firing pin from contacting the rear of the barrel and damaging the edge of the chamber. If you are going to dry fire the pistol extensively, the stop pin and firing pin will eventually wear and contact could occur, and we recommend replacing both the firing pin and the firing pin stop from time to time. You should also monitor the contact of the firing pin with the rear of the barrel."

 

[Theohazard]

I think the OP makes an excellent point. Reminds me of that other internet myth about never firing lead bullets in a Glock.

That one is NOT a myth: It can be extremely dangerous to fire lead bullets in a Glock. And the problem is that it's not consistant; some people get away with it and other experience kabooms rather quickly.

Here's a quote from a mod on THR's sister forum regarding the issue:

The Glock in Competition has a chapter written by Mark Passamaneck, a mechanical engineer with a forensics background that covers it thoroughly.

It's not that every Glock will have a problem shooting lead, it's that some will have a serious problem and it's not possible to come up with a rule of thumb that will insure safety. It's also important not to assume that because you've been doing it and haven't had a problem that you're home free. One documented incident involved a Glock with over 20,000 rounds of lead bullet loads through it. In one range session the owner unknowingly pushed just a little too far and ended up with a gun in pieces.
[...]
Just to be clear, I am NOT suggesting that every single person who shoots lead in a Glock barrel is doomed to blow up his pistol. But there is an associated risk which is hard to quantify because small changes and differences can have a significant effect on the outcome. Testing, in one case, showed that the identical load in two apparently identical pistols had radically different effects. One of the pistols, after shooting 300 rounds showed minimal effect due to leading. The other apparently identical pistol, shooting the identical load showed twice the effect due to leading after only 75 rounds.

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

Well, if you are running a retail establishment, and say 90% of firearms can be dryfired safely and 10% cannot, what is the easiest, safest, lowest-cost way to train your employees? Try and teach them every variation and hope they don't screw it up? Or just tell them "No dryfiring period"?

And even with firearms that are perfectly safeto dryfire, like the AR15, you get peopledoing stupid things like dryfiring the lower separated from the upper (which can damage the lower) because "It is OK to dryfire ARs."

Having said all that, I'm not laying down $300+ for a firearm without trying the trigger.

 

[Deaf Smith]

Some guns firing pin mechanism will break if you dry fire a lot.

Older ones that use a pin to keep the firing pin in have a notch in the firing pin. Dry firing will force the firing pin against that and after awhile break it.

.22 rimfires (and actually most rimfires) will have the firing pin or hammer nose strike the chamber wall where the rim would be and either damage the firing pin or the chamber.

Make sure your gun is made so you can dry fire it.

Deaf

 

[coloradokevin]

Coloradokevin, I think responses like these are a perfect example of why you decided to make this thread, huh?

Lol, yeah… pretty much.

In general I think a lot of folks like black and white answers to questions. Even if I say (as I did) that it is safe with most modern firearms, someone else will interpret that statement as me saying that it is safe to dry fire every single gun ever created. Similarly, the guy who hears that dry firing some antique revolver is bad from a gun store employee suddenly assumes that it isn't safe to dry fire any gun. Few things in life are that clear cut.

 

[Skribs]

I think its still a good rule of thumb if you're not sure. I'd rather not dry fire than risk needing to repair my firearm.

 

[DHJenkins]

Simple question - has *not* dry firing a weapon ever caused damage?

No, it hasn't. So even if it is a myth, which it isn't (because some guns are not meant to be dry fired) it's a myth that has never hurt anything other than someone's feelings.

A more accurate question would be "Why do people think that dry firing (specific type or brand of guns) isn't OK when the manufacturer says it is?".

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

My personal rule (as a guy who has broken two firing pins (a Stevens .22 and a KDF 7mm Rem Mag) on personally owned guns) is you always ask before dry-firing a gun you don't own.

Again though, if I ask to dryfire your Glock and you tell me "No." I'm going to assume bad things about you; but that's your right as the owner.

 

[Malamute]

Dry firing probably doesnt hurt most guns, though some that the manufacturer specifically says is safe to dry fire can break parts. Its already been mentioned, but Ruger single actions can break transfer bars. I've broken 3 in two different guns, a local gunsmith said hed replaced several, and it comes up on the cowboy action forums fairly regularly from what I've heard. If one chooses to dry fire them, great. I choose not to.

Winchester 94s tend to break firing pins of dry fired.

I've seen several pics of Glocks with a cone fracture in the breech face, in the pattern of an impact from the firing pin side. Its generally said that they were dry fired a lot when its happened. It may be so rare as to be easily disregarded, though knowing it has happened, would tend to make me err on the side of caution.

Snap caps, home made or store bought are cheap. I choose to use them when dry firing now.

Empty cases dont work as snap caps very well/for long in my experience, but for a half dozen times or so per primer are better than nothing.

I used to dry fire a LOT. I dont unless I have snap caps now. Not to be construed in any way as telling anyone else what to do with their guns.

If its a recreational gun, and doesnt have any serious consequences if it doesnt work at any given moment, it isnt really a big deal if it breaks. Many of mine are counted on as defensive items. I am now more careful about taking chances of my defensive arms not working when desired.

 

[coloradokevin]

I've seen several pics of Glocks with a cone fracture in the breech face, in the pattern of an impact from the firing pin side. Its generally said that they were dry fired a lot when its happened. It may be so rare as to be easily disregarded, though knowing it has happened, would tend to make me err on the side of caution.

I can't speak to those specific cases, but I do know some guys who have dry fired their Glocks more times than I've probably fired all of my guns combined. One guy I know (an IPSC Production Class Grand Master) was doing around 4 hours of dry fire practice per day at one point… I'm not sure how many pin drops that comes out to, but I'm guessing it's in the high hundred-thousand range after a couple of years of this practice!

Even allegedly "unbreakable" guns can have problems, and ultimately I think live fire puts more stress on a Glock than dry-fire practice. I once had an extractor break on my Glock 22… obviously not dry-fire related, but a stoppage in that gun regardless.

Someone mentioned that not dry firing causes no harm, and dry firing might. While this could be true in certain cases, the truth also tells us that nearly all competitive shooters (including every one I've known) dry fires extensively. It makes you a better shooter.

 

[MICHAEL T]

I make S&W owners wear latex gloves before touching my Rugers.

My self I don't allow those trailer park Ruger's even in my house. I don't need my S&W and Colts contaminated Lower class Rugers.

 

[Nickel Plated]

I would say it's a case by case basis. Most firearms made in recent years will likely dry fire just fine all you want. Some won't.
My Winchester SXP shot the tip of it's firing pin across the room when I dry fired it once. And it was only about maybe the 30th time I did it. Granted, I DID buy it used so who knows what kind of history it had that may or may not have been a contributing factor to that more than the dry firing. But it was a 28" barreled, walnut stocked, field model and looked practically brand new. So I'm guessing it probably didn't see much abuse.
Some guy might have just bought it as a hunting gun, shot maybe a handful of rounds through it over a few seasons and decided to sell it off.

 

[herrwalther]

Now, I have seen a shop with a sign that said something along the lines of: "Please ask before dry-firing a firearm". This particular store sold a wide variety of firearms, and was totally cool with people dry firing guns that could be done so safely. They simply wanted people to ask before dry-firing so that they didn't harm guns that might not tolerate such a practice. I have no issue with that.

I understand this one. A competent gunsmith or salesperson should know which firearms are safe to dry fire, such as the modern striker fired and which aren't such as an older Smith or Colt revolver. Like most things related to firearms the blanket statement of ALL firearms shouldn't be dry fired or ALL are safe just doesn't hold water.