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The Guardian pepper spray

Discussion in 'Non-Firearm Weapons' started by Unclesam1776, Aug 1, 2008.

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  1. Unclesam1776

    Unclesam1776 Member

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  2. ray_ray

    ray_ray Member

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  3. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    Unclesam1776,

    Welcome to THR.

    We've discussed the product extensively here. If you perform a search you'll find those discussions, including first hand impressions.
     
  4. Loosedhorse

    Loosedhorse member

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    If the training unit is any guide...

    ...then the Kimber LifeAct Guardian Angel (marketing--sheesh!)--what's the word? Oh, yeah--SUCKS!

    (I am a new member and I hope the above does not violate THR decorum).

    I am non-LE. I've been a big fan of chemical sprays since the old tear gas (CN/CS) days. I was happy to graduate to pepperspray (OC) around 1995.

    I keep OC at the house for the non-firearm inclined in my family. I recently noticed (OOPS!) that the ones I placed years ago during a local crime scare were all expired. So I decided to see if I could switch to Kimber. I ordered their tester units (dispenses blue dye, not OC).

    Problem 1: Kimber says that use within 2 ft is "unsafe." I emailed them and was told that was because the high-speed (90MPH) stream directed at the eyes at close range can cause permanent eye injury (i.e., crippling injury). So, you need to ask the guy to let go of you and step back so you can spray 'm. Or, he sues you for injury in civil court after the attack, calling the Kimber techies as his experts, testifying to your gross negligence.

    Problem 2: A technique I was taught with CN/CS was if the eyes weren't available, spray the attacker's pants (yes, right THERE) as irritants in that area will likely change the attacker's behavior. Seemed like a reasonable tactic if within two feet with the Kimber, to avoid the personal injury brigade. So, I put some swimming trunks on an IPSC silhouette, and asked my (obviously long-suffering) wife to take the Kimber trainer and hit 'm where it hurts, contact distance. An unimpressive "pffft" of blue goo bounced off the trunks, with no stain on the cardboard.

    Problem 3: Asked the wife (who was looking at me more worriedly than usual by now) to back up a couple steps (muzzle to target maybe 4 ft now) and let loose a blast in the face area (which I had covered with sunglasses--the ads say the spray is SO POWERFUL it shoots around glasses). Pffft. I watched a big blue glob sail over the target. Target inspection reveals maybe 40 pin-point (literally) blue marks in the face area, and maybe 8 drops as wide as a tooth pick. So aim is not intuitive with the Kimber.

    Problem 4: Now you're out of shots.

    Don't get me wrong: I love OC! (Never been sprayed-- unless you count VERY minor wind-shift blow-back one day when I was practicing outside with an "expired" fogger that got me coughing for about five minutes--and never planning on volunteering!)

    Some may argue that the microscopic amounts of dye I found on the target, were it OC, would have instantly incapacitated even a PCP-smoking Shrek. But when I compare the amount of OC I could deliver on the target out to 6 or 8 feet using a traditional (expired) fogger (and with lots of shots available, no less!) to the Kimber's unimpressive performance....

    I'll stick with foggers for now. I understand (well!) that some will prefer gels or foams, concerned about indoor fumes or outdoor winds, but the foggers seem to saturate targets with no need for extreme accuracy, and that's what I'm looking for.

    (Currently using Wildfire 18% foggers.)

    YMMV. Yuh puts down yuh money, and yuh takes yuh chances . Good luck!
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2008
  5. NorestRDS

    NorestRDS member

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    you are using wildfire and talking about chances? that stuff is garbage.


    Kimber Life Act is a risky thing to carry. you get two shots and thats it . A women who has maybe never even used the practice cartridge with her adrenaline pumping will be lucky at best to get a shot on target . also dont forget multiple attackers. Its a powerful formula at 2.0% capcaicinoids but thats the only thing it has going for it.

    Get a 2oz canister of Fox labs where you can get 20 shots off and its smaller more powerful.

    Kimber Life act as big as a nextel phone.
     
  6. Loosedhorse

    Loosedhorse member

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    Gosh, I wasn't sure...

    how Norest knew that Wildfire was garbage--then I looked at the label and, sure enough, it says "garbage" right there. At least they're honest about it!

    Slightly more seriously: I note from Norest's other pepper-posts that he tends to ignore the SHUs and uses the "hoagie-puke test": if Vexor makes you puke a hoagie in 3 seconds, that's good; if Wildfire takes 6 seconds, it stinks--have I got it right? (Also, didn't he previously say that Wildfire would "surely do the job"?)

    If he or anyone here got sprayed with Wildfire and continued calmly doing what you were doing before, then I agree, it's garbage. In contrast to on-person-effects experience, the SHU, refinement, and capsaicinoid "data" just sound like so many theories.

    I do however appreciate those of you who volunteer to get doused with this stuff--not something I'm planning on. By the way, my PERSONAL idea of a less-lethal weapon is a 9 mm pistol, and no, I won't be volunteering to have anyone shoot me with different calibers to test that theory, either--though surely I appreciate learning from those who have been shot.
     
  7. ArfinGreebly

    ArfinGreebly Moderator Emeritus

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    Personal Remarks Removed

    You guys can discuss the product.

    You start discussing each other and we'll see if my less-lethal ban stick works.
     
  8. CWL

    CWL Member

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    Back on subject: I was intrigued with the Kimber LifeAct discussions here on THR so I bought one to examine.

    I didn't like it for the same reasons discussed above: only 2 shots, and it is WAY WAY too big to carry -far too inconvenient for easy carry, especially if you are running out the door. I also don't think that it is inherently accurate; at least with a canister-type spray, you can "walk" the stream to the BG, but not the Kimber.

    Decent concept, but needs improvement. Mine remains in the box.
     
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