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The new 44spcl Bulldog's (what you think?)

Discussion in 'Handguns: Revolvers' started by Float Pilot, Sep 28, 2012.

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  1. Frank V

    Frank V Member

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    Float Pilot

    It sounds like you do reload. I've found some of the modern .44 Specials are zeroed at the factory for the newer 200gr .44 Special loads. I think Mike Venturino even called S&W & was told that after he found his .44 Special shot really high with 240 gr bullets.
    I found it to be true on some guns too. My soloution was easy. I used the 208gr .44-40 bullet & bingo the guns zeroed. I used the same old standard 7-1/2grs of Unique load under the lighter bullet & got a very good load.
    If yours shoot high with std wt bullets you might try a .44-40 bullet & get a good zero without having to fool with the fixed sights.
    Frank
     
  2. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    I have a 44 special thread running on the Hand-Loading sub-section.

    44 Special Loads for Taurus Model 445 Ultra Light. 2 inch BBL

    Target at 15 yards, temp 39 F, light rain. Chronograph at 10 feet.

    SUNDAY


    Factory Hornady 180gr XTP-JHP = 738 fps and a 3.5 inch group (Big muzzle flash)
    Shoots about 8 inches low.

    Factory Federal, 200gr LSCW-HP = 680 fps and a 1.1 inch group
    ( the shoulder of the lead SWC had to be shaved a little to chamber)
    Shoots 5 inches low.

    Hand loads

    200 grain Hornady XTP-HP, Star Line brass, Winchester Large Pistol Primer,
    heavy crimp at cannelure.

    7.0 grains Universal……… = 698 fps and a 2.5 inch group LOW
    6.9 grains HP-38 (ww231.) = 775 fps and a 1.5 inch group (clean brass) 2 inches LOW9.3 grains HS-6…………..= 700 fps and a 1.3 inch group 2 inches low
    7.0 grains IMR-800X……..= 620 fps and a 1.0 inch group (dirty) 2.5 inches low
    6.3 grains Trail Boss……..= 700 fps and a 5.0 inch group (clean brass) 8 inches low


    240 grain old Speer jacketed semi-wad-cutter solid. Star Line brass
    Winchester Large Pistol Primer, heavy crimp over jacket edge.

    6.5 grains IMR 800X…= 650 fps and a 1.0 inch group at point of aim. Noticeable recoil increase over 200 grain bullets.


    WEDNESDAY RANGE SESSION

    200 grain Hornady XTP-HP, Winchester Brass, WLP, heavy roll crimp 1.500 COL
    15 yards, high wind, fading sunlight

    5.0 grains RED DOT = 547 fps and a 1.0 inch group
    5.5 grains RED DOT = 685 fps and a 1.5 inch group
    5.5 grains GREEN DOT = 675 fps and a 2.0 inch group
    8.6 grains IMR SR4756 = 680 fps and a 1.5 inch group

    ALL Shot Low

    240 grain Keith Lead Semi-Wad-cutter, WW Brass, WLP,
    Heavy Roll crimp 1.490 COL

    5.3 grains GREEN DOT = 720 fps and a 0.60 inch group 1.5 inch low
    5.3 grains RED DOT….= 790 fps and a 2.0 inch group POINT OF AIM
    8.0 grains IMR-SR-4756= 715 fps and a 2.5 inch group
    3 inches low.
     
  3. JERRY

    JERRY Member

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    float pilot, seems that the 800 fps mark is about what is right for those to hit point of aim.
     
  4. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    Yeah I need to play around with Green Dot a little more and also try some 700x...
    The Red Dot load that was going 790 was probably much closer to 800fps at the muzzle. But it sure made my hand tingle.

    I have been working up of course so each range session is a couple hundred rounds. Not much fun with a light-weight snubby.
     
  5. JERRY

    JERRY Member

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    How about a 200 gr. @ 800 fps from the bulldog?
     
  6. the Black Spot

    the Black Spot Member

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    My bulldog shot 240 gr xtp with 5 gr of Bullseye to point if aim.
     
  7. voicomp

    voicomp Member

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    I have had a new one (2.5" DAO) for a couple of months. It replaced one I wore out after buying it used 15years ago. It chugs along nicely with factory JHP 180's from Hornady and PMC. For the reloads, I found it sensitive to inadequate primer seating depth (several rounds failed to fire with what looked like flush primers and they went bang just fine when retried in a .44 Spl from another maker); seating my primers until they are slight visibly recessed appears to have resolved the issue. I like it.
     
  8. Frank V

    Frank V Member

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    Sounds like there are some pretty good loads being tried.
    I keep coming back, this is an interesting thread.
    Frank
     
  9. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    Oct 14th SUNDAY, Range test: TAURUS M-445 ALLOY FRAME with 2.1 inch barrel15 yards, light rain, wind, 35 degrees.

    207 grain cast Lead Semi-Wadcutter Hollow Point with Gas Check.
    Winchester Brass, Winchester Large Pistol Primer, 1.500 col w/roll crimp


    7.0 Grains of Unique = Hi-827, Lo-762 and a 2.0 inch group 1 inch low, dirty
    6.0 Grains Green Dot = Hi-814, Lo-805 and a 1.5 inch group, 1.5 inch low, clean
    7.0 Grains of HP-38 = Hi 865, Lo 842, and a 0.75 inch group, ¾ inch low, clean
    7.2 Grains of HP-38 = Hi 906, Lo 869, and a 2.0 inch group, 1 inch left, clean

    240 grain cast lead Keith style, semi-wadcutter.
    Winchester Brass, Winchester Large Pistol, 1.490 col w/roll crimp

    5.5 Grains Green Dot = Hi-750, Lo-713, and a 1.25 inch group ¾ inch low, clean
    6.2 Grains HP-38 = ….Hi-812, Lo-790, and a 1.35 inch group ¾ inch left, clean
     
  10. the Black Spot

    the Black Spot Member

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    Ever use Bullseye or bluedot with that 240 gr keith bullet?
     
  11. Float Pilot

    Float Pilot Member

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    I have been playing with Blue Dot as well, but I am only posting loads that did not make huge groups or that did not seem like they were going to blow-up...
    So I am going to have to get back to you on that....
    This time of year is pretty busy withy me pulling the plane out of the water, doing aircraft maintenance and getting to house ready for deep snow.. It is snowing right now as I type this....

    Bullseye is pretty fast stuff.... Red Dot was pretty snappy,,,, Bullseye,,,, hmmm.......
     
  12. the Black Spot

    the Black Spot Member

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    I am with you on the busy part. Tween family, work, and getting traps/gear ready for trapping season seems not much time left for load testing.

    Wow! Snow! Its in the high 70's here.
     
  13. lobo9er

    lobo9er Member

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    charter arms was a big let down for me with a MAG PUG. I wouldn't buy another.
     
  14. Frank V

    Frank V Member

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    Float Pilot
    Thanks for the range test. Sounds like you are getting some nice loads. One of my favorite powders is HP38/aka WW231! HP38 tends to be about $2/ can cheaper than WW231 in my area,,,, go figure?

    Who made your mould for the 207gr SWC HP GC?

    If you try going up just a bit with your Unique powder charge, it may clean up for you.
    Frank
     
  15. farm23

    farm23 Member

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    The smallest 44 I have is a 3" S&W 629 at 44 oz loaded and it goes with me in the woods. For going to town my EDC is a 1911 and a NAA black widow. I perfer big holes and would like to get a lighter 44. At this point I am leaning to the USA made Charter but will keep reading.

    Thanks for the great info.
     
  16. azgsmith

    azgsmith Member

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    Bulldog

    It seams that the new CA Bulldog has some problems. We sold them at a shop I worked at and they were nothing but problems and many had to be returned to CA. I had an old one as my off duty gun years ago and it was a great little carry gun with lots of punch.
     
  17. JERRY

    JERRY Member

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    azgsmith, back in the bridgeport days C.A. could make a descent revolver and spend a little more ensuring it was actually worthy of carry and still make a profit.

    today they are selling them for as much as other brands but still have the same frail design that the other brands dont.

    taurus makes a small 5 shot 2" bbl .44spl ight weight. look at its lock work and frame design compared to the C.A. bullgod....the bulldog is weaker where it counts, thats not good.
     
  18. Eb1

    Eb1 Member

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    I didn't get a Bulldog, but found my favorite .44 SPC for carry. A Rossi M720 fixed sight model. I am shooting 200 grain XTP around 910 fps @ 12'.

    I'll get some targets up on the reloading thread.
     
  19. the Black Spot

    the Black Spot Member

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    Eb1, yes please post the pics! I love those rossi 720! Wish I could find one.
     
  20. Eb1

    Eb1 Member

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    I had it bead blasted, and had a target barrel reshaped to fit the profile of the fixed sight model.

    [​IMG]


    My desktop background image. :)

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2012
  21. the Black Spot

    the Black Spot Member

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    Sweet! Really nice!
     
  22. farm23

    farm23 Member

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    EB1 What is the weight of the 720 and how is the trigger action? Also have you had a chance to do any range work with your new toy? I have found one online but have no idea what is weighs. My 629 is 44 oz so most anything will be less but I would like something under 30 oz.

    Thanks
     
  23. Eb1

    Eb1 Member

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    1 lb. 14 oz. empty is the weight. I have to carry it IWB. It isn't a light gun, but shoots good.
    Trigger is as good as any S&W I have tried. I just have an itch for these Rossi M720's. I looked for one for three years. Moved to a new town, and found it in a pawn shop about a mile from the house.
     
  24. Frank V

    Frank V Member

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    I have used a 208gr .428 RNFP cast bullet lubed with SPG over Skelton's charge of Unique in a Bulldog. It's pretty snappy, but shoots to the sights. It is listed as a pretty light load in the manuals for a 208gr bullet.
    I don't carry handloads for defense, but use this load for practice. I think it's a heavier load than most you can buy over the counter for the .44 Special. The Bulldog is a pretty good carry gun, it's light, compact, & relatvely powerful.
    Frank
     
  25. jfh

    jfh Member

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    You know, this is a really good thread for reloading information--yes, I've been following the post Float Pilot did on .44 Special loads over in reloading--and I hope it would encourage some of you to reload the .44 Special.

    For an alternative, don't forget to include S&W's Night Guard 396--5 shot L frame. I worked up some loads this year for that, but have not gotten out to test them--looks like next spring, maybe.

    Jim H.
     
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