They didn't attack the Swiss.

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dasmi

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While I disagree with some of the politics in the article, it's a good read. Unfortunately, it's too late for us to adopt a more Swiss approach.


http://www.strike-the-root.com/51/walker/walker1.html

They Didn't Attack Switzerland

by Bill Walker

Switzerland has not been in a war of any kind since 1815. It has not been in an official foreign war since 1515. This would be astounding, even miraculous, for any nation. But Switzerland borders Germany . And France . And Italy . And Austria . And Liechtenstein . Now the Prince of Liechtenstein has rarely lashed out in Blitzkrieg in a desperate bid to reign uber alles, but ALL of Switzerland 's other neighbors have devoted a lot of effort to invading other countries.

In addition to the encircling foreign marauders, Switzerland itself is composed of several different ethnic groups that get along as well as, e.g., Germans and French. But they haven’t ethnically cleansed each other for two centuries, either.

You would think that peacekeeping performance of this kind would make Switzerland an object of study in every political science and civics course worldwide. "WHY Didn't They Attack Switzerland ?" should be the title of many a textbook. This is not the case. Very few political scientists study Switzerland .

Switzerland is of no interest to politicians, because the features of the Swiss system that keep the peace are the same features that make Swiss politicians unimportant. Do you know the name of the Swiss President now serving out his nonrenewable one-year term? No, you do not (it’s Samuel Schmid, but you won’t remember tomorrow). His name doesn't matter, and he doesn't matter to the defense of Switzerland . There is no central location of Swiss defense, no Pentagon or NORAD into which you can crash a 757 or a black-market Kazakh nuclear weapon. The defense of Switzerland is the entire people of Switzerland itself.

The features of the Swiss system for keeping the peace are simple. They mind their own business, and they have very strict gun control. By which they mean that every Swiss male must have a gun, except for those who have to carry a mortar or missile launcher. Females are not subject to universal military training, but if you go to a Swiss rifle range, there are always girls blasting away too. After 9-11, the Swiss told passengers to carry their bayonets onto their airliners . . . somewhat different from the US response of panicked victim-disarmament. (You are aware that 99% of US pilots are STILL disarmed?)

As a final defense, the Swiss have rigged the vaults of their banks for demolition. Any dictator attacking Switzerland will find the gold in his numbered bank account buried in rubble hundreds of meters under a mountain. It is known that Hitler had a numbered account.

Switzerland has also provided for defense of the lives of its civilian population against nuclear terrorism. Realizing after World War Two that nuclear weapons in the hands of power-mad idiots posed a public health threat, the Swiss started a nationwide shelter-building program in 1960. By 1991, there was enough shelter space in Switzerland to protect everyone in their home or apartment, and also enough at their workplace and school. A Swiss citizen is generally never more than a few minutes from a fallout shelter with an air filter.

The entire Swiss shelter program was accomplished for somewhere on the order of $35 (1990 dollars) per year per capita. The US spends vastly more every year to achieve a military only capable of intervening in Third World nations that don’t have WMDs. The combined US armed forces are incapable of shooting down a single ballistic missile, or even intercepting low-flying propeller planes. Nor are there bunkers with filtered air supplies for the inhabitants of our glass cities or crackerbox suburbs. The only civil defense in the US is for the President and the bureaucrats under Iron Mountain . Everyone else is nuclear fodder, except for those provident few (such as the Mormons) who build their own shelters to protect their families.

Switzerland does not send troops to intervene in other nations. Switzerland does not spend tens of billions of dollars yearly to fund dictators around the world, nor did Switzerland donate hundreds of billions of dollars to the Warsaw Pact through bank "loans." Switzerland does not send billions of dollars worth of weaponry every year to the warring tribes in the Middle East . Switzerland has no enemies. Yet the Swiss are armed to the teeth and dug into every hill and under every building.

US policy is the evil-parallel-universe inverse of the Swiss. The US intervenes everywhere, spies on everyone, supports every faction in every dispute. We have as many enemies as there are disputatious people in the world. Yet we spend more effort on disarming our own airline pilots and other law-abiding citizens than on providing shelters for our children against nuclear, chemical, or biological attack. We have an expensive conventional army, and quite a few aging offensive nuclear weapons. But no defense for our children.

But Who Would Attack Us? We’re Such Nice Guys…

What groups might think to benefit from a WMD strike on the US ? A partial list:

1. The US kleptocracy, which has reaped such vast increases in power from terrorism and war. “War is the health of the State,†and terrorism drives citizen support for war.

2. Angry relatives of the thousands of victims of “Shock and Awe.â€

3. Fundamentalist Muslim politicians.

4. Fundamentalist Israeli politicians.

5. Every emerging power on Earth. The more the US sinks into the Mideast quagmire, the more chance for new powers to rise to dominance.

6. Citizens of nations ruled by US-backed dictators and oligarchs, who are victims of our Aid To Dependent Dictators programs.

7. FOX News, always looking for higher ratings.

This would have been more concise if I had listed the groups that would NOT benefit from anonymous WMD attacks on the US , to wit, the world’s libertarians, capitalists, and peace lovers of all stripes. Unfortunately, the “non-aggression principle†won’t prevent anyone from being killed by terrorism and/or anti-terrorism. So, we must all determine the best risk management strategies within our budgets.

The Likely Attacks

There are two basic categories of attacks. One type is the Jerry Bruckheimer Movie attack, typified by 9-11. Spectacular attacks that kill only a few thousand people are great for raising the Homeland Security budget, but they don’t raise the individual’s risk level that much. For most people, it would be more worthwhile to put some effort into avoiding heart disease and cancer than to try to avoid random, low-level terrorism. However, it is prudent to avoid targets with high cinematic value, like the Statue of Liberty, the Golden Gate Bridge , Arnold Schwarzenegger, etc.

The second category of attack is the “anonymous warfare†strike, intended to seriously damage the US . While it might be hard for a minor power to inflict crippling physical damage on the US , anonymous attacks can rely on a high “Homeland Security Multiplier Effect.†For every dollar of damage done by the 9-11 attack, post-attack “security†measures have done ten more. And a nuclear attack would make the post-9-11 hysteria look orderly and rational by comparison. One anonymous strike could paralyze the US for decades.

Such an anonymous attack might be nuclear, using the leftover weapons from the Cold War that are available in various backwater marketplaces:

Or budget terrorism could be launched with poison gas, germs, or even conventional explosives planted in vulnerable areas such as dams, gasoline storage tanks, chemical transport trains, etc. etc. etc.

US: Strictly DIY Civil Defense

One might think that a Homeland Security budget of over $40 billion would provide a little bit of protection for US citizens. Governments are never efficient, but some of them at least spend some tax money on its putative purpose. Swiss, Israeli, and many other nations’ civil defense programs distribute gas masks, radiation meters, financial aid for constructing shelters, etc. However, US Homeland security has provided us with: free advice from Tom Ridge . According to Tom, all a US citizen needs for protection against WMD is some duct tape and enough food for three days. Personally, I don’t think that this advice, even in full-page ads, was worth $40 billion. In any case, American families will receive no help from Homeland Security’s new director, either. US civil defense is strictly DIY.

Balancing Risk

A DIY civil defense program is limited by the fact that the majority of our discretionary income has already been allocated to other uses by federal, state, and local tax authorities. Most of us can’t afford to protect our families and ourselves properly, because that money is in Iraq and a hundred other foreign-aid regimes.

Still, most of us can do better than duct tape. Contrary to media “wisdom,†one or even a thousand nuclear bombs won’t kill everyone. Nuclear fallout radiation intensity falls by a factor of a thousand over two weeks, so if you can hide in a well-stocked basement with a crude air filter for that long, you would probably survive . . . IF you knew what you were doing and had made some preparations. Germs and gas have their own limitations, and terrorists probably won’t have the biggest and best of anything. Of course the terrorists still have an advantage, because most Americans aren’t even up to Tom Ridge ’s suggested level of preparation.

There are several elements of civil defense:

1.

Location
2.

Threat warning
3.

Protective gear
4.

Protective construction
5.

Networking

Location, Location, Location

The best location is: not in the US . If your work can be done in Costa Rica , Switzerland , or some other nation that hasn’t attacked anyone for decades, you could move. Unfortunately, most of us have sentimental or economic ties to US target zones.

Within the US : if you live downstream from one of those high dams in California , just stop reading this and get in the car. What were you thinking anyway?

Other places require trade-offs; small towns are safer in most scenarios, but may not have lucrative jobs. If you live in a smaller city, you’re likely to get some warning of fallout or disease outbreak. The safest locations are rural, but not everyone can afford to live well in the country. The general rule is to avoid large cities if you can, and especially Washington , DC and New York . These cities are self-terrorizing anyway, between the draconian victim disarmament laws and the crime.

Threat Warning

9-11 was our warning. Homeland Security has given us hundreds of useless “warnings†since then, but it would be sheer coincidence if any of these actually preceded an attack. The “Emergency Broadcasting System†isn’t going to know about a terrorist nuclear attack until after they see it on CNN. Warnings of biological threats may be subtler; sudden outbreaks of “flu-like†symptoms in odd patterns might be signs of biowarfare . . . or they might be signs of flu, which might kill you anyway since the FDA seems to be protecting us very efficiently from flu vaccine. Again, the best way to have warning is not to be in the immediate target area.

Protective Gear

Minimum: A small water and food stockpile (if you don’t have to leave your house for a month, you’ll make it through plague or fallout a lot more easily).

A HEPA filter in the living room would make Tom Ridge ’s “seal up your bedroom with duct tape†idea work much better . . . as long as the power stayed on. Ideally, you should be able to seal up your house and use a hand-cranked blower to provide filtered air, but now we’re getting into the “protective construction†area.

Cheap insurance would include a gas mask in car, and potassium iodide pills to give some protection against fallout (they also help against nuclear-power accidents, unlikely as those might be). Antibiotics are potentially useful but more expensive and perishable. A firearm (and some practice in its use) is a prudent investment for most people anyway, but is even more important in a scenario when you can’t afford to be looted or carjacked. A high-rate radiation meter doesn’t cost very much, and makes a great coffee-table decoration:

And yes, some duct tape is always a good thing (those two weeks in the fallout shelter might get boring otherwise).

Protective Construction

Optimally, everyone desiring to opt out of the ill effects of war and terrorism could live in a concrete dome, such as those produced by the good folks of Italy , Texas .

100 psi blast waves just slide off a concrete dome (especially if it’s partially buried), as do tornadoes, hurricanes, drive-by shootings, and blast waves from asteroid impacts. Other forms of underground (or hillside, like Bilbo Baggins’) construction can also be inherently attack-resistant. Anyone who is living in a probable target city for economic reasons should at least consider hobbit-style construction instead of Styrofoam and 2 x 4s . . . of course local building codes often practically forbid underground construction.

If you have a basement, only relatively little work is needed to make it into an effective fallout shelter. Terrorist bombs might well be more on the scale of 15-kiloton Hiroshima-killers than the 25-megaton Cold War monsters. A 15-kiloton bomb from an old tactical artillery shell or rocket warhead would have a lethal blast radius much smaller than even a small US city, but fallout could be lethal for 20 miles or more downwind.

The basement is usually easier to seal against chemicals and germs, too. Just remember that Swiss basements have hand-cranked filtered air blowers; if you succeed in sealing up a basement tight enough to keep out VX aerosols, you’re going to need an air supply. Don’t forget to invite Tom Ridge along to crank it for you; he’s not busy changing threat level colors anymore.

Networking

The whole subject of Civil Defense is about preparing for the failure of the normal system of economic specialization. But the more normal social ties that we can preserve, the more effective protective measures can be and the quicker civil society can recover. On a personal level, if all of your friends believe that “the best thing to do in a nuclear attack is go outside and die quickly,†then you should probably try to add a few acquaintances of a more practical bent.

The Swiss have avoided war for 200 years by being mentally and physically prepared for it. Even if Switzerland were attacked by nuclear terrorists, their mental preparation (and their courage, another essential commodity that Americans have failed to stockpile) would save them from hysterically scrapping their Constitution and civil liberties.

We Americans have been at war throughout most of the same decades that Switzerland has been at peace. Now that America has mutated from Republic to Empire, we are at perpetual war with every nation that wants to be independent of the whims of the POTUS. At the very least, we must all recognize the fact, and be prepared for the shocks to come. Civil society can recover from a lot of destruction; it can’t recover from cowardice and refusal to prepare for trouble until chaos is already upon us.
 
Just off the top of my head...

I suspect the Swiss missed WWII because

(a) they're up in the mountains and have little military or strategic value, and

(b) more importantly, every German of any rank had a secret account where he stashed the loot. If Switzerland fell, he lost his loot.

I totally agree with the armament thing with one exception. I know nothing of Swiss law, but I suspect if you're a big time lawbreaker, you get whacked hard and quick. In European countries you can get 10 years for a first time DUI.

Here you can rape and murder someone and be out in a few years. The average sentence for killing a child in the US is 7 years and 8 months.
 
About the concrete dome houses, my sample size is small, but the experience begs investigation. One of these dwellings out by a relative's farm (only 1 I'd known of) had a fire, and fighters took hours and hours to put it out. Apparantly the 'dome' wasn't/isn't that stable - it collapsed. Maybe the fire weakened the rebar, or the cement couldn't take the heat, but the cement roof fell in (on an empty house) and the fire was then very difficult to extinguish.

Plus I'm not sure what consists of a 'cheap' gas mask, or radiation meter. Some big boxy yellow survey instruments are available on ebay, but anything new is $180 minimum - and usually they're only Gamma detectors.
 
I read a story where a German general wanted his command to cross through Switzerland to attack their neighboring country. He informed Switzerland officials that if they didn't give him permission to pass through they would take Switzerland by force.

First, it was explained to him that all Swiss men were a member of the military until age, IIRC, 60 and they all had their firearms at home with them where they could fight at a moments notice.

The general was then given a tour of the country, and as they showed him bridges, railway bridges, tunnels, steep cliffs by roadways, and canyons that had a road along the edge, they explained, that there were explosives in place so that if there were an attack, each time the enemy would approach an area the roads would be distroyed in front of them and the Swiss military would have them under fire at all times.

The general decided to go around Switzerland.
 
This guy should have quit before he started. If Switzerland didn't exist in Europe, they'd have created it, or Sweden would have substituted just fine. On a continent with that many neighbors in that many fights historically, a market for a neutral place is created, a niche that Switzerland filled mainly due to geopolitical accident rather than grand design.

In any event, people buy into a myth. Particularly to the Nazis, Switzerland was more valuable intact than as a part of the Reich. In exchange for not being molested too much, the Swiss certainly agreed to launder a bunch of loot, primarily Jewish in origin, for their Nazi paymasters. This is the cold, hard fact that underlay Swiss neutrality in WW2--they were fences.

Of course the sordid side of accomodating the world's nastiest folks is cloaked under a veneer of yeomanry defending it all. Would the Nazis had a particularly easy time taking out Switzerland in 1939 or 40? I don't think so. OTOH, it would've only taken a few months at worst, because of the added natural obstacles, not because of the superior Swiss bicycle soldier. I am also certain the German speaking Swiss of that era would have been easily co-opted by the Reich as puppets during an invasion.

It might be hokey, but events have transpired that make it impossible for the United States to be isolationist or neutral.
 
The reason the Swiss sat out WWII is because the Swiss banks were bankers of the Third Reich. No Swiss, no Cherman war machine. They also served as the focus of espionage by all sides. Even during wartime the participants must contact each other and work deals. The land of the Swiss was perfect.

They may well be well armed and that has some reason for their security. But I suspect the Swiss still serve as bankers to the world of terrorism.

I am not defaming the Swiss. I am merely establishing two points in time and extending a line into the future.
 
The Swiss (as a nation not individually) are vulterous criminals and thieves who will make money off anyone and have no compuction from stealing from the dead.

Their citizen army is a farce in the face of modern warfare, and has been since 1939. They kept out of the war by being financial whores for the Nazis.

WildwewouldrollovertheminamonthAlaska
 
you never get on the wrong side of your banker....and if everything you have and value is in the bank...then you protect the bank. the swiss hold an important position in the finance world of yesterday and today... if anyone thinks they did not get into the mix, of WW II because they were a totally armed country.... your kidding yourself....they just knew how to sleep with everyone....and did...and do.
 
'In war it might be prudent to take the enemy into account'

-Churchill

It was an absolute necessity for them to play both sides during WWII, if they gave the finger to the Germans they would have invited an invasion that the Germans would have ultimately been successful at. If not outright invasion the Germans could have also opted to cut the Swiss off from oil and coal, which they were externally dependant on, and they would have had a lot of difficulty making it through 1 winter.

A Nazi occupied would then have unobstructed passage of Military trains through the Alps and we would not have had a plot of land to extract covert operatives from out of Europe. Many refugees, including Jews, escaped Nazi controlled Europe through Switzerland.

While I know that Swiss bashing has become stylish of late I wish someone would consider real world politics and not idealized fantasies of what should be.
 
we would roll over them in a month!??

WildwewouldrollovertheminamonthAlaska

In two years we haven't been able to complete the conquest of Iraq, a country with few natural barriers to armor, and you claim Switzerland could be taken in a month?? The US has spent 3 years unsuccessfully trying to pacify Afghanistan, and the USSR spent 5 or so - doesn't that tell you something about conquering mountainous terrain?

So with no mobility for armor, are you counting on air strikes? (Surely the Swiss wouldn't be so rude as to keep modern anti-aircraft missiles in those caves??)

We could certainly hurt them a lot, but hurting ain't holding. I'm surprised at people who didn't learn military lessons from Vietnam, but I'm #%$&* astonished at people who won't learn from our military failures in Afghanistan and Iraq.
 
Their citizen army is a farce in the face of modern warfare, and has been since 1939. They kept out of the war by being financial whores for the Nazis.

Having met and worked with a number of Swiss Army folks, I disagree with the first statement. Yea, they were very much in bed with the Nazis. We didn't discuss that aspect very much, probably because the Bundeswehr soldiers were trying rather hard to be polite to everyone. I was specifically ordered not to taunt certain foreign militaries about their previous uhm tail-kicking delivered by the US Army.

As soldiers go, they're strong in some aspects and weak in others. They have mountain warfare techniques down fairly strong. They'd give our 10th Mountain folks a run for their money. Their cold weather training is slightly better than our's. Their LAV units need some work. I didn't have a chance to see their artillery or aviation. I suspect we could seize their country easily enough, but occupation wouldn't be pleasant. Their soldiers on average shot better than our soldiers.

For a defense-only military, it's not bad. I don't think they'd make a good offensive military, but that was not their intention.
 
Reprinted from here: http://www.stephenhalbrook.com/ts-speech.html

Americans have been known to confuse the Swiss flag--white cross, red background--with the Red Cross banner, which is the opposite. In World War II, Swiss fighter planes, painted with the Swiss flag, attempted to intercept all foreign planes in Swiss air space and to order them to land. An American pilot, asked whether he thought about firing on the fighters which instructed him to land, responded: "I would never fire on a Red Cross plane!"

Almost 1700 American pilots found refuge in Switzerland after their planes were damaged in bombing raids over Germany. However, the Nazis were not amused by Switzerland's armed neutrality. Hitler was livid that the Swiss used fighters bought from Germany to shoot down 11 German Luftwaffe planes; the saboteurs he sent to blow up Swiss airfields were captured (they aroused suspicion because they were all dressed in the same odd outfits!).

It is a pleasure to have Sarpedon, a first-rate military publisher, fill the void in World War II history by publishing my book on the Nazi plans to eradicate the Swiss democracy and the Swiss plans to resist to the end. Over 200 years ago, America's Founding Fathers like Patrick Henry and John Adams were inspired by the example of Switzerland--a democracy in a sea of monarchial despotism. Having devoted much of my career to American constitutional law, publishing books and arguing in the Supreme Court, I was intrigued to know how the Swiss institutions which influenced our Constitution proved their worthiness in the darkest years of European history: Hitler's Third Reich, 1933-45.

In 1940, after the rest of central Europe collapsed before the German army, Swiss Commander in Chief Henri Guisan assembled his officers at the Rotli meadow near the Lake of Lucerne. He reminded them that, at this sacred spot, in the year 1291, the Swiss Confederation was born as an alliance against despotism. Guisan admonished that the Swiss would always stand up to any invader. One has only to recall the medieval battle of Morgarten, where 1400 Swiss peasants ambushed and defeated 20,000 Austrian knights.

In World War II, the Swiss had defenses no other country had. Let's begin with the rifle in every home combined with the Alpine terrain. When the German Kaiser asked in 1912 what the quarter of a million Swiss militiamen would do if invaded by a half million German soldiers, a Swiss replied: shoot twice and go home. Switzerland also had a decentralized, direct democracy which could not be surrendered to a foreign enemy by a political elite. Some governments surrendered to Hitler without resistance based on the decision of a king or dictator; this was institutionally impossible in Switzerland. If an ordinary Swiss citizen was told that the Federal President--a relatively powerless official--had surrendered the country, the citizen might not even know the president's name, and would have held any "surrender" order in contempt.

When Hitler came to power in 1933, the Swiss feared an invasion and began military preparations like no other European nation. On Hitler's 1938 "Anchluss" or annexation of Austria, the Swiss Parliament declared that the Swiss were prepared to defend themselves "to the last drop of their blood."

When the Fuehrer attacked Poland in 1939, General Guisan ordered the citizen army to resist any attack to the last cartridge. After Denmark and Norway fell in 1940, Guisan and the Federal Council gave the order to the populace: Aggressively attack invaders; act on your own initiative; regard any surrender broadcast or announcement as enemy propaganda; resist to the end. This was published as a message to the Swiss and a warning to the Germans; surrender was impossible, even if ordered by the government, for the prior order mandated that it be treated as an enemy lie.

When the Germany army, the Wehrmacht, attacked Belgium and Holland, it feigned preparations for attack through Switzerland. Like a giant movie set, divisions moved toward the Swiss border by day, only to sneak back again by night and repeat the ruse the next day. Both the Swiss and the French were tricked into thinking that concentrations of troops were massing to attack through Switzerland and into France. Swiss border troops nervously awaited an assault each time the clock approached the hour, for the Germans were punctual in lauching attacks on the hour.

When France collapsed, detailed Nazi invasion plans with names like "Case Switzerland" and "Operation Tannenbaum" were prepared for the German General Staff. They only awaited the Fuehrer's nod.

Threatened with attack from German and Italian forces from all sides, General Guisan devised the strategy of a delaying stand at the border, and a concentration of Swiss forces in the rugged and impassable Alps. This chosen place of engagement was called the R‚duit national, meaning a national fort within a fort. German tanks and planes, Panzers and Luftwaffe, would be ineffective there.

A fifth of the Swiss people, 850,000 out of the 4.2 million population, was under arms and mobilized. Most men were in the citizens army, and boys and old men with rifles constituted the Home Guard. Many women served in the civil defense and the anti-aircraft defense.

Nazi invasion plans for 1941 were postponed to devote all forces to Operation Barbarossa, the attack on Russia. The Swiss would have their turn in due time. Hitler banned the play William Tell. He called the Swiss "the most despicable and wretched people, mortal enemies of the new Germany"; in the same breath he fumed that all Jews must be expelled from Europe. His plan to annihilate the Jews would have faced a special obstacle in Switzerland, where every Swiss Jew (like every other citizen) had a rifle in his home. In the heroic Warsaw ghetto uprising of 1943, Jews demonstrated how genocide could be resisted with only a few pistols and rifles. Hitler boasted that he would liquidate "the rubbish of small nations" and would be "the Butcher of the Swiss." But the dictator was more comfortable with liquidating unarmed peoples and was dissuaded from invading Switzerland. There was no Holocaust on Swiss soil.

As a neutral, the Swiss represented American interests before the Axis powers, such as by inspecting German prison camps holding American POWs. When Vichy France was occupied, German soldiers with submachineguns took over the American embassy. The Swiss minister, brandishing his Swiss army knife, drove them out.

A Nazi SS invasion plan, recommended for execution in 1944, warned the German general staff that the Swiss fighting spirit was high and shooting instruction good; German loses would be heavy, and a conquered Switzerland would require a strong occupation force. D-Day put the plan on hold, but new dangers threatened Switzerland as the Allies pushed the Nazis back. In 1944, the Wehrmacht's counter-offensive in the Ardennes, leading to the Battle of the Bulge, proved that the Nazi Beast was still strong and full of suprises. The Swiss prepared for an attack from Germans retreating from Italy. The Swiss resolve remained high, for, as the US State Dept. declared, "no people in Europe are more profoundly attached to democratic principles than the Swiss."

Switzerland saved a half million refugees who came there in the war. Restrictive policies by government officials, often secret, were ignored by Swiss who helped refugees. Let it be remembered that Switzerland took in more Jewish refugees than the United States took in refugees of all kinds.

America's great journalist Walter Lippmann wrote that the Swiss proved their honor by surviving the dark days of 1940-41, they proved that diverse peoples and language groups can live peacefully together, they repudiated Nazism. "It must never be forgotten," he wrote, "how the Swiss served the cause of freedom."

In the American Revolution, a Swiss leader wrote to Benjamin Franklin calling America and Switzerland the "Sister Republics." After two centuries of mutual respect, today a media frenzy falsely depicts the Swiss as Nazi collaborators. It was the opposite. Nazi Propaganda Minister Goebbels called Switzerland "this stinking little state" and ranted that the Swiss press was "either bought or Jewish." The Swiss bashing seen in the New York Times today could use a reality check by reference to the Times issues of the war period--such as a 1939 issue with a map showing Switzerland as a possible invasion route, or a 1942 issue calling Switzerland an "Oasis of Democracy." Our new "Ugly Americanism" will never have the credibility of Winston Churchill, who observed near the end of the war: "Of all the neutrals Switzerland has the greatest right to distinction. . . . She has been a democratic State, standing for freedom in self-defence among her mountains, and in thought, in spite of race, largely on our side."

LawDog
 
I'm surprised at people who didn't learn military lessons from Vietnam, but I'm #%$&* astonished at people who won't learn from our military failures in Afghanistan and Iraq.
Ah, the sour stench of historical revisionism.

By any standard, our military won amazing victories in both Afganistan and Iraq. And Vietnam too by the way, but that victory was thrown away by the politicians.

Learn a little history about the defeat of German in 1945, and the subsequent occupation. Unless you're claiming that wasn't a victory either?
 
Our military also suffered humiliating defeats in Vietnam and WWII.

Switzerland wouldn't be a month campaign. We would win, but it would cost us dearly. The Swiss are our equals in many respects. The rifle in nearly every home is one of the reasons they are that good.

Admiral Yamamoto said the same thing in regards to an invasion of the US in WWII. "There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass."
 
Boats

"This guy should have quit before he started. If Switzerland didn't exist in Europe, they'd have created it, or Sweden would have substituted just fine. On a continent with that many neighbors in that many fights historically, a market for a neutral place is created, a niche that Switzerland filled mainly due to geopolitical accident rather than grand design.

In any event, people buy into a myth. Particularly to the Nazis, Switzerland was more valuable intact than as a part of the Reich. In exchange for not being molested too much, the Swiss certainly agreed to launder a bunch of loot, primarily Jewish in origin, for their Nazi paymasters. This is the cold, hard fact that underlay Swiss neutrality in WW2--they were fences.

Of course the sordid side of accomodating the world's nastiest folks is cloaked under a veneer of yeomanry defending it all. Would the Nazis had a particularly easy time taking out Switzerland in 1939 or 40? I don't think so. OTOH, it would've only taken a few months at worst, because of the added natural obstacles, not because of the superior Swiss bicycle soldier. I am also certain the German speaking Swiss of that era would have been easily co-opted by the Reich as puppets during an invasion."


Wildalaska

"The Swiss (as a nation not individually) are vulterous criminals and thieves who will make money off anyone and have no compuction from stealing from the dead.

Their citizen army is a farce in the face of modern warfare, and has been since 1939. They kept out of the war by being financial whores for the Nazis.

WildwewouldrollovertheminamonthAlaska"


umm
Belgium was so neutral that they had troops on both the German and French borders. Swedish neutrality under pressure is about as maintainable as Norweigan, and Both Germany and Britain violated theirs. If a country has French, German, and Italian demographics, it's conceivable that problems could arise if it took sides in a conflict involving France Germany and Italy.

As for Swiss banking and Nazis, come on wake up. Do you realize that banking trancends borders? NAZI Germany continued to pay it's Versailles duties throughout the war! Hitler humiliates France by accepting their surrender in the same train car the Versailles treaty was signed, then continues payments to bankers! America was supplying Germany with materiel and money long after war broke out, hell G.H.W.Bush's grandfather was shipping Germany critical aviation fuel chemicals in the early 40's. A main reason America took so long to go to war with Germany is because it had lent Germany a LOT of money, and you won't get it back if you go to war with them. Every nation has fiscal factors which shape or control their policies, every single one. When we point a finger 4 more point back at us.

For conquering them militarily, Germany never ever would have succeeded. Want to see overwhelming WW2 military might VS. defensive line in rugged terrain, look at the Italian campaign. Let's see,

As for Swiss policy to the Holocaust, they put all the other Allies to shame. As mentioned by Glock they facilitated Jewish salvation, while Allied nations refused Jewish immigration (!!!), took no actions at all to thwart or slow the slaughter of Untermenschen, and deliberately concealed the existence of a holocaust from their populations (until their soldiers physically over-ran the camps).
 
By any standard, our military won amazing victories in both Afganistan and Iraq.

The question isn't victories, but victory. Most losers win a few victories. One of the lessons from Vietnam was that you can "win" the body count and lose the war.
 
Switzerland wasnt invaded because the country offers no strategic value whatsoever. Being nestled in some rough terrain doesnt hurt either. And of course lets not forget that the Swiss were quite happy to fully cooperate with the Nazis in virtually every way they could and still claim some kind of neutrality.
 
I thought the lesson was that the enemy is much more capable of undermining support back home to end the war than to win by killing.

That's another one - there are many lessons to be learned from Vietnam, and the services spent a lot of time thinking about them. (It's the spooks and politicos, who didn't pay the price in Vietnam, who don't seem to have learned.) Note the lack of independent media in Iraq - that lesson, at least, was understood.
 
Swiss politics

Neutrality in war/politics.
I suppose there is a benefit to staying out of the frey. Those who don't stir the crododile will just be eaten last. The same goes for those that pacify the enemy/crocodile.
How to avoid being eaten by a bear? Answer: Always bring a slower friend.
Not a very noble position. Evil will always strike against the righteous/Defenders of freedom. Evil will save the neutral ones for last.....its called "STRATEGY."
 
I read a scholarly book on the neutrals in WWII. Book is at home, so I don't remember the name. About Switzerland:

1. The Swiss did cooperate with the Nazis on financial and logisitic matters to such an extent that there was no need to invade them. The Swiss weren't that sympathetic to refugees and some actually committed suicide at the border when they were denied entry.

2. The real military threat was to blow the tunnels that the Germans were using to communicate with Italy.

I'm not playing down the role of the milita and resistance. However, the Swiss military had troubles with Nazi sympathizers and Quislings would have arisen. It makes a nice story for us gun guys but Switzerland has instituted gun laws recently.
 
So what have the Swiss actually accomplished in the last 2,000 years? Shady banking and the cuckoo clock?

:neener:
 
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