Titegroup or W231?

[eddiememphis]

I am getting low on Titegroup.

Midsouth is having a sale where they will eat the hazmat or shipping but they don't have any Titegroup.

They do have W231. I see a lot of guys rave about it across a variety of calibers.

I load 9mm, .45 Colt, .38 Special and maybe .380 if I can find some inexpensive dies. I am always changing bullets to find the most accurate combination.

Other than a tiny bit of velocity in certain loads, will I be giving up anything if I make the switch?

 

[MWC1974]

This thread might help. I had the same question a while back.

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/win-231-vs-titegroup-in-9mm.913804/

 

[Walkalong]

I would choose W-231 over Titegroup any day, more forgiving, accurate in many calibers, fills the case better, lightly colored and easy to see in the case……

But many people like Titegroup a lot.

 

[1KPerDay]

231 works well in all those calibers and is a very good powder generally. If the price is the same you might get a few more loads out of a pound of titegroup. But it smells weird

 

[Rule3]

HP 38 /Win 231 is pretty much all I use for handgun calibers. For a faster powder I use BE.

 

[Targa]

I’ve never used Titegroup but I will say that I will never stop using 231. It is good stuff.

 

[derek45]

I like win231/HP-38 more than Titegroup

for
380
9mm
38sp
44sp
45acp
45LC

it's an excellent 'all around" pistol powder, and doesn't heat the gun up as much as titegroup

 

[dannyd]

If your switching check the price of Winchester 244 it maybe cheaper because it's probably going to become the new Powder for Winchester 231 with rules changing manufacturing standards.

 

[rsrocket1]

I load 9mm, .45 Colt, .38 Special and maybe .380 if I can find some inexpensive dies. I am always changing bullets to find the most accurate combination.

Other than a tiny bit of velocity in certain loads, will I be giving up anything if I make the switch?

You'll be missing partially scorched cases in just about every load, you'll gain more latitude between min and max loads. I find no gain in position insensitivity that Titegroup claims. You might experience a little less discoloration or melting of certain powder hoppers with W231 compared to Titegroup. Other than that, Titegroup tended to be a little less expensive.

 

[Jim Watson]

All I can say is that I have shot several kegs of 231/HP38 in those calibers and one pound of Titegroup.

I load .45 Minor with Bullseye.

There are others that would fill the bill but these days availability is down, prices are up, and I just don't care enough to experiment.

 

[.38 Special]

I prefer 231 over Titegroup for all of the OP's cartridges.

 

[Riomouse911]

I had bad luck with Titegroup and light .38 Spl loads in a rifle several years ago so I stay away from it.

HP-38 / W231 is a great, versatile powder, my go-to if Unique is not available.

I have a few pounds of W244, I haven’t tried it yet.

Stay safe.

 

[eddiememphis]

Allright.

I ordered 4 pounds of W231. If it doesn't work out I am holding each of you personally responsible.

 

[Dudedog]

I think you will be happy with it.
Please let us know how it works out for you.

 

[dannyd]

W231 will definitely work I used 8 pounds last year and been using W231 for 34 years. Have fun with it.

 

[westernrover]

I've loaded both for 357. They're both consistent in terms of producing some of the lowest SD's of more than a dozen powders. They have similar ballistic performance, though more 231 is needed than Titegroup to produce a similar load. So Titegroup is more economical, but that is hardly a consideration for me since I load in the thousands not hundreds of thousands or millions (the difference would really add up). Titegroup burns cleaner. Titegroup meters better, more easily, more consistently.

I would say Titegroup is better for me because of the cleanliness and metering. I can't think of anything that makes 231 better, but there is not anything that truly makes it worse.

 

[Walkalong]

…….. I find no gain in position insensitivity that Titegroup claims……..

Me either, position sensitivity as far as fps goes was average.

 

[Walkalong]

Allright.

I ordered 4 pounds of W231. If it doesn't work out I am holding each of you personally responsible.

You won’t regret it, and in the small possibility you do, you could easily sell it. It’s in demand.

 

[JeffG]

Titegroup or W231?

Yes.

I keep both on hand.

 

[irishlad]

I would choose W-231 over Titegroup any day, more forgiving, accurate in many calibers, fills the case better, lightly colored and easy to see in the case……

But many people like Titegroup a lot.

HP 38 /Win 231 is pretty much all I use for handgun calibers. For a faster powder I use BE.

I've posted before W231 reminds of the Frank's Hot Sauce commercials "I use that stuff on everything!"
380,38 spl,9mm,45acp and 45lc

 

[Hugger-4641]

Allright.

I ordered 4 pounds of W231. If it doesn't work out I am holding each of you personally responsible.

I have 4lbs of Tite Group and the only thing I'm using it for is 9mm and .380. Honestly, I like HS6 better in 9mm. If you just hate the w231, I'd trade you a couple lbs.

 

[LiveLife]

9mm, .45 Colt, .38 Special and maybe .380 ... Midsouth don't have any Titegroup ... They do have W231

... will I be giving up anything if I make the switch?

You will be giving up Titegroup that burns hot and violent for slight reduction in accuracy from W231, especially noticeable in 9mm due to small internal case volume that expresses even small change in reloading variables. For other calibers you listed, you likely won't notice the difference in accuracy. It is temperature sensitive (Slower when cold) so if you are loading for match shooting power factor, you will need to add more powder to produce the same velocities.

BTW, Titegroup is preferred by many match shooters as indicated by this USPSA equipment survey - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...-and-discussions.778197/page-11#post-12415502

• Limited/L10 (40S&W 88%/9mm 12%) - N320 23%, Titegroup 22%, Sport Pistol 11%, WST 5%
• Production (9mm) - Titegroup 35%, N320 23%, Sport Pistol 16%
• PCC (9mm) - Titegroup 31%, Sport Pistol 18%, N320 16%, Clean Shot 11%

But some bullseye match shooters still prefer W231/HP-38.

• Bullseye matches - Bullseye/N310/N320/700-X/Clays/Titegroup/WST/W231(HP-38)

And FYI, HP-38 is same exact powder as W231 so if you can't find W231 but find HP-38, you can use it as same.

Here's close up of W231/HP-38

Both Titegroup and W231/HP-38 are flattened ball powder and meters well with around .12 gr variance for me. Titegroup has surface crinkles that may induce slight "bridging" while W231/HP-38 flows more readily so that may be a consideration when loading smaller charges for 380Auto.

9mm 115 gr FMJ/RN with 4.8 gr of W231 loaded to 1.130"-1.135" is my 9mm reference load that is fairly comparable to Winchester White box and produces decent accuracy (BTW, Titegroup, Bullseye, WST, N320, Sport Pistol, BE-86 produce smaller groups in comparison) - https://reloadingdata.speer.com/downloads/speer/reloading-pdfs/handgun/9mm_Luger__115_rev1.pdf

I am always changing bullets to find the most accurate combination

RMR in-house jacketed bullets have produced smaller groups than many other commercial/match grade bullets and when compared to Hornady HAP (XTP without expansion cuts), produced slightly smaller groups in my testing. RMR FP/FN "Match Winner" has greater accuracy potential than FMJ. BTW, ELEY uses RMR bullets for their centerfire match ammunition so you are buying "ELEY match grade" bullets with 5% THR discount.

FWIW, during my .45Colt comparison test using Cowboy Loads, Bullseye, W231/HP-38 produced smaller groups than Red Dot/Promo, Herco.

BTW, W231/HP-38 is my powder of choice for 45ACP followed closely by Bullseye/Red Dot/Promo.

 

[gwpercle]

In this day and age of shortages .... the correct answer is buy BOTH and buy plenty because tomorrow it will be gone ... and the next day , twice the price + hazmat fees !
Titegroup fills in nicely for Bullseye and HP38 / W231 is a good overall powder with a wide range of uses , there is plenty data for both powders . Invest what you can ... I think the future holds higher prices and still limited supplies .
Gary

 

[Walkalong]

So many folks are buying so muck more than they need it’s extending the shortage/high prices.

It’s showing signs of getting better, let’s let it.

 

[DMW1116]

I’ve tried both with HBWC in 357 cases and accuracy is basically the same. Titegroup is much dirtier.

In 9mm I haven’t shot enough Titegroup to tell but it seems to be accurate pushing 147 grain RMR Heavy Match Winners. It matches my HS-6 loads for accuracy, though I only have a small sample of Titegroup loads.

HS-6 at 25 ^