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Titegroup problem

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by Ruger GP100 fan, Aug 21, 2010.

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  1. Ruger GP100 fan

    Ruger GP100 fan Member

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    I've started loading 38SP to shoot in my 357 to save money. Bought a jug of Titegroup,but the balance beam scale that came with the RCBS reload kit I bought gives me inconsistent charges every time. Is this typical for Titegroup or do I need a better scale or could the problem be the powder throw that came with the kit?? I loaded 50 rounds each with Hornady HP/XTP 110gr,125gr,and 158gr.,weighing every single charge and chasing the grains I wanted back and forth. Now I'm off to the range to try some out. Is there a better powder for 38Sp shot in a 6" GP100?
     
  2. mjyeagle

    mjyeagle Member

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    i shoot titegroup in my 357 none of the problems you mentoned i have a rcbs uniflow dispencer and a rcbs 5-0-2 scale mabey this helps
     
  3. Jesse Heywood

    Jesse Heywood Member

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    Titegroup is one of the better metering powders that I have. As far as better powders, there are always better ones. You just have to try them in your gun to find out.Other good one for 38/357 include W231, Unique, Red Dot, 700-X. There's a long list.
     
  4. Ruger GP100 fan

    Ruger GP100 fan Member

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    I'm using a 5-0-5 scale and a uniflow powder measure. The variations are not huge,one right on the line,next one may be just above the line,then one just below,etc. Titegroup leaves little room for error,according to the chart I used at this site: http://data.hodgdon.com/main_menu.asp . Only .3 grains with some bullets. Am I being too picky?
     
  5. CraigC
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    CraigC Member

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    Titegroup is very consistent running through my RCBS Uniflow. Meters much better than Unique with charges under 6.0gr.
     
  6. JoelSteinbach

    JoelSteinbach Member

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    Never had any problems with Tite Group, with RCBS, Redding or Dillon dispensers. My 38 spec rpouns are always consistent .
     
  7. Hondo 60
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    Hondo 60 Member

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    + 4 or 5 or whatever. I have no problems with titegroup.
    That's all I use for my 38 spl & 357 mag
    I use the Lee Pro auto disc and get very consistent throws.
     
  8. Ruger GP100 fan

    Ruger GP100 fan Member

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    Thanks guys,but that doesn't give me any idea where to start. Any ideas?
     
  9. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    Well, the first place to start is to rule out the scales being inconsistent.

    Just weigh the same powder charge, empty case, or whatever over and over again and see if it comes out the same weight every time.

    If it doesn't, you may not have a level workbench, or you may have a fan or A/C vent blowing on the scales. Or you might even have dust or oil on the knife-edge bearing surfaces.

    Scales have to be perfectly clean, and bubble-level level sideways, and zeroed with an empty pan endwise to work right.

    Powder measures have to be operated exactly the same way each time.

    If you bang the handle one time, then slowly ease it down the next time, you will get different charge weights.
    If you let it run almost dry, then re-fill the hopper, you will get different weights until the powder settles down again.

    rc
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2010
  10. Ruger GP100 fan

    Ruger GP100 fan Member

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    Level scale is not an option. You set zero by raising and lowering it via an adjustable foot on one end.....unless setting it to zero DOES level it.
     
  11. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

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    Read what I said again.

    rc
     
  12. Ruger GP100 fan

    Ruger GP100 fan Member

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    rcmodel "If you bang the handle one time, then slowly ease it down the next time, you will get different charge weights.
    If you re-fill the hopper, you will get different weights until the powder settles down again."

    This must be my problem. I'm new to reloading and I do try to operate the throw the same every time,but I could be losing concentration doing 50 rounds. I've checked and rechecked a charge several times with the same result.
    Is there a better balance beam scale than this one? I do not wish to shell out big bucks for a decent digital.
     
  13. Ruger GP100 fan

    Ruger GP100 fan Member

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    Thanks,rcmodel. I hadn't caught that. I'm headed for the reload bench right now to check this out.
     
  14. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

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    It is not reasonable to expect the exact same charge every time. A ball process powder like Titegroup will measure very well at +/- 0.1 grain and probably be closer than factory ammunition.
     
  15. LRS_Ranger

    LRS_Ranger Member

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    I am using a RCBS uniflow with titegroup and haven't noticed much variation. It's always within .1 grains, usually a lot less than that. I slightly tap the charge handle at the bottom and top of each throw, just for consistancy. I charge 200 cases at a time too, just so I can stay consistant.
     
  16. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    After filling the measure, run at least 10 charges through the measure before weighing charges and using them. Some powders settle down much faster than that, but some take quite a few throws.

    Work the handle the same every time.

    Keep the powder level close to the same all the time. I use a baffle to do this. It keeps the weight of the powder on the insert very stable.
     
  17. Jesse Heywood

    Jesse Heywood Member

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    Also, do you have a baffle in the measure? One makes a huge difference. There are instructions on this board for making one. And, which meter are you using? I had problems getting the large meter to work with charges this small.
     
  18. mjyeagle

    mjyeagle Member

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    i try to keep the uniflow as full as i can for accuracy other than that everybody used up my ideas plus some
     
  19. Ruger GP100 fan

    Ruger GP100 fan Member

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    As Jim Watson mentioned...+/- .1gr. I can hold that,but at just 3.5 grains .1gr. seems like a lot.
     
  20. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    Not really a big deal. Many good powders suitable to .38 Spl do +/- .1 Gr.

    If you want something that meters almost dead on every time, get some AA #2. It meters superbly, gives great ES & SD numbers, and has proven accurate for loading .38 Spl for many people.
     
  21. PO2Hammer

    PO2Hammer Member

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    My Redding 10X (pistol and small rifle only) does real well with Titegroup, +/- .1 grain, whether it sits or not, and whether or not I just filled it. (use your baffle) But the 10X has a small diameter chamber. The tiny charges of Titegroup might not do as well in a general purpose, large diameter measure.
    .1 grain of Titegroup in .38/.357 is not a big deal. My loads are match accurate to 100 yards in the .357 using thrown charges of Titegroup, tested with a scoped single shot and rest.
     
  22. bds

    bds Member

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    Also, check to make sure your A/C vent or fan is not on because air movement from them will move the sensitive powder scales (I actually reload early in the morning like 5-10 AM so I don't have A/C vent blowing when I am checking my powder charges). How do you check? Put a clear bowl over your scale/charge and see if they deviate - if they don't with the bowl, you found your problem.

    I used to reload on my garage reloading bench with the garage doors open for ventilation. Well, I got frustrated because my beam balance scale kept deviating. After much cussing and bad name calling my scale, I called my reloading mentor. He asked if I closed "ALL" the doors to my reloading area and if A/C and fans were all off - I said of course not. He laughed his *** off on my account. I now weigh all of my powder charges indoors.

    FYI, if you have digital powder scales, they specify operational temperature ranges - mine says 59F - 95F and another reason why I do all my weighing indoors. Exceed those temperature ranges and you'll be cussing too because the scales will act "funky" :D

    I hope this helps ;)
     
  23. Ruger GP100 fan

    Ruger GP100 fan Member

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    Thanks. I'll give AA #2 a try.
    And,yes,I have an air conditioner vent right above the bench. When the air comes on it's break time until it shuts off. Also checked the bench and it's perfectly level front to back.
     
  24. bds

    bds Member

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    Just for the heck of it, try the clear bowl test and see if the reading is consistent - if it is, then you may have "other" atmospheric disturbances :D

    If you still have inconsistent readings from same powder charge even though your bench is level and your scale is under the clear bowl, you may need to call the manufacturer and pick their brain.

    FWIW, as Walkalong posted, I consider < 0.1 gr variance charge-to-charge good enough for match shooting. 0.2-0.3 gr good enough for plinking/range practice. My Pro Auto Disk meters W231/HP38 with less than 0.1 gr variance.
     
  25. Ruger GP100 fan

    Ruger GP100 fan Member

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    Well,maybe I'm worrying over nothing at all because the variations I'm experiencing are .1gr or less,but I'll still give AA #2 a try.
    Thank you all for your input.
     
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