Trans-Texas Corridor Toll road

[EghtySx]

I dont think the toll has anything to do with it. I know for me it doesn't. I just don't want this foreign monstrosity running through Texas. I don't care how rich it makes Rick Perry and his cohorts.

 

[Smoke]

I went to one of the meetings. One of the routes proposed cuts through Bosque County (actuallly two, depending how you look at it). Most of my land would be out of it.....but one parcel and possibly my home would not.

The idea stinks. I-35 (E or W) in the DFW metroples is not bad. WHen they join up just north of Hillsboro and points South is when it really goes to hell. From Georgetown to Sanantone is especially bad. I avoid this area like the plague.

Does something need to be done? Without question. I35 is wide open and could be widened North of Hillsboro...points to the south are more crowded and places it just couldn't happen. Skyway in Austin may be an idea for handling more traffic in the cities and just widen the roads in the more rural areas.

Art had the best idea though....everybody whose folks weren't here prior to the turn of the century (1900's not 2000's) just go home.

Smoke

 

[Art Eatman]

I don't claim to really have enough knowledge about this particular project to really be for or against, except it does seem a bit grandiose in format. I will say that the ownership/leaseback/fees and such offer a lot of opportunity for corruption.

It won't be much of an economic boon to local communities unless there are entry/exit ramps. That's a given. One thing I've never liked about the Florida turnpike is the limited access and the turnpike authority's monopoly on rest-stops and restaurants and gasoline sales. Higher prices than if there were competition.

As far as eminent domain purchases by government: If one is not pleased with the offered price, there is the option for a jury to hear the plea for a higher price. It is typical for juries to be sympathetic to those who protest the state's offer.

As far as diversion of monies from highway trust funds: Yeah, that's happened. But the taxes per gallon for both state and federal aren't a lot higher than when diesel fuel for dozers and turnpulls was $0.20 a gallon. In the spring of 1974, cement went from $4/bbl to $11/bbl and it ain't got cheaper. China used 53% of the world's supply of cement, last year, and 44% of the steel. Checked those prices, lately?

Highway capacity is a nationwide problem. I-75 from Lake City, FL, to the Ohio line is getting rebuilt to three lanes each way in the rural areas; six lanes each way on the north side of Hotlanta, GA. I see a lot of third-lane additions on I-10 in east Texas and in parts of Louisiana and Mississippi.

Art

 

[jsalcedo]

I drive 35 from San Antonio to Kansas city twice each year to visit family.
It is nice to be able to stay on one road the whole way but I always leave at
7pm and drive it at night to avoid all the congestion. The 35W that loops around Ft worth is a lifesaver as well.

IMO the toll road is a bad idea. Why not use the current infrastructure and
get 35 some upper decks for getting through congested areas.

The private property issues are enough to make me against the plan.

 

[Art Eatman]

The problem with double-decking, aside from cost per mile, is cleaing accidents. Anything really serious and you can have some folks who die who otherwise might have had an ambulance arrive in time...

Cloverleaf overpasses are bad enough. I still remember the ammonia tank-truck that fell off the I-610 overpass over US 59 in Houston. Lotsa dead.

For the money, odds are that a four- or six-lane parallelling I-35 from somewhere north of Georgetown to somewhere not far south of SanTone would solve most of the problems of north-south travel in Texas.

But this super-highway isn't the first Giant Boondoggle in Texas. At one time, there was a big push to make the Trinity River navigable all the way to DFW. I remember a railroad bigwig saying that if the feds would give him the same amount of money, he'd build a double track from DFW to Houston, invest the leftover money, and haul freight for free.

We've got more than our fair share of folks whose motto seems to be, "Think big, but think stoopid." As always, cui bono? Cherchez le $$$.

, Art

 

[Sergeant Bob]

Lawdog

The proponents of this monstrosity want to expand the number of courts in Texas who can hear eminent domain cases, because right now we don't have enough who can do it.

As if that's not bad enough, it's exercising eminent domain for the profit of a private business from another country.

Any Farm-to-Market raod, Ranch-to-Market road, county road or state road which bisects this thing will have to do so by way of an overpass which completely clears the right-of-way.

How expensive do you think an overpass a quarter-mile in length is going to be?

Let's say you own a section of land or so that they run this thing over. There will be no way to go from your land on one side of the Corridor to your land on the other side of the Corridor unless you build an over-pass, fly over, or drive to the next exchange, cross over and drive back.

Not only will a private company own the Corridor, this private company will own all of the services on, or along, the Corridor. Gas stations. Hotels. Food stores. Restaurants. Litter boxes.

As this road will probably be built along the route of some existing highway, any business which is situated along that route will be toast (unless it has an exit, even then survival is questionable).

Since more than a few Texans are getting their knickers in a knot over this, the same law that authorized this boondoggle, also authorizes the State to make any road into a toll road.

Little known fact.

Any bets on how long it will take for everyone else to have to do the same thing?

Once other politicians see an opportunity to milk that cash cow, they will squeeze it until it's dry.

The expected cost right ow is in excess of 180 billion dollars. Never mind that these things never finish under budget, that's 180 billion dollars that's going to have to be paid...by the citizens of Texas. One way or another.

Does anyone think the tolls will go away once the road is paid for? Highly unlikely. Once the Pols get to shaking that money tree, it's awfully hard to get them to stop(see Illinois: I-294 where the truck tolls have gone up over 350%. The trip went from $7.15 to $23.50). Before the increase the Illinois Toll Road Authority was bringing in (IIRC) about a million dollars a day (follow the money). The only places I know of where the tolls were actually removed once a road was paid for is Kentucky and West (by God) Virginia.

Going to be a big housecleaning in Texas Government next election, if I have anythig to say about it.

Even if you're not from Texas, you'd better be paying attention because it could be happening near you.

 

[TheDutchman]

Email a Rep's Chief of Staff and received this reply

oh yes. we're preparing for the worst.

on the subject of TTC-35. We need wider roads yes but, a whole new road does not need to be built that we will regret 10 years later and have to end up pay for with Tax money. Check out the Big dig in Boston yeah.

 

[Selfdfenz]

They can't widen I35 but they can buy a 1/4 mile swath from San Antonio to Dallas and build a super hi-way. And 35 stays unimproved because...?

ANS-The more 35 sux in the minds of our gov and hi-way profiteers the better is their justification for the hi-way robbery scheme. Boondoggel (sp?) does not begin to define this. Worse even than the Superconducter Supercollider.

Come on guys, let's put on those thinking caps.

TX citizens deserve and should demand better roads, and not toll roads, and either get them or clean out that that bunch in Austin next time they belly up to the vote-a-matic.



S-

 

[Daniel T]

Little known fact.

Not so little known in Austin anymore. We're in the midst on an attempted recall on the mayor and half the city council. If you live in Austin, get yer butt to the polls on May 7th.

 

[Cool Hand Luke 22:36]

As far as diversion of monies from highway trust funds: Yeah, that's happened. But the taxes per gallon for both state and federal aren't a lot higher than when diesel fuel for dozers and turnpulls was $0.20 a gallon

Under provisions of the Omnibus Budget Revenue Reconciliation Act of 1990 (OBRA90) (24) the tax rate on highway and motorboat fuels was increased by five cents per gallon. Thus, the tax increased from 9 to 14 cents per gallon of gasoline. Half of the increase in revenues from the gasoline tax imposed on highway use vehicles was dedicated as additional funding for the Highway Trust Fund. The remaining half in revenues was deposited in the General Fund and dedicated for federal deficit reduction. Of the 2.5-cents increase dedicated to the Highway Trust Fund, one-half cent was dedicated to the Mass Transit Account in that trust fund.

As a percentage of the cost of a gallon of gas the tax has more than doubled over the years, and with the vast expansion of the number of miles driven, the revenue has increased proportionately. Unfortunately about a third of the money was diverted to other uses up till 1997 such as deficit reduction. That's where our current problems stem from IMO.

http://www.ncseonline.org/NLE/CRSreports/Transportation/trans-24.cfm?&CFID=8539261&CFTOKEN=71797464

 

[Deavis]

If you live in Austin, get yer butt to the polls on May 7th.

Another good reason to hit the polls in Austin is the smoking ban they want to enact. I don't like second hand smoke but I REALLY can't stand some busy body activist telling a business who they can and cannot cater to simply because that activist thinks they have the right not to breath smoke. If you don't want to breathe the smoke, don't go to a bar that allows smoking. GAH! My blood pressure is rising already.

 

[Art Eatman]

CHL, the problem is that the rate of increase in construction and ROW costs has notably exceeded the rate of income from the tax. Diesel has gone from 20¢ to over two bucks. ROW that once cost not-much per acre is now over $1,000 and on up well beyond that. Just since 1990 I've seen land costs rise from $300/$400/acre to $3,000/acre. The world price of steel doubled in the last couple of years. My 1978 Case backhoe sold new for about $20K. I can get a new one for $44K. I don't even want to think about what Mr. Caterpillar is charging, these days.

As I look as these various numbers and look at highway project bid costs, I just don't see how the present fuel tax structure can support our needs. But, as usual, TANSTAAFL. If ya wanna play, you're gonna pay.

I dunno. I don't have an answer for all these problems. I occasionally can figure out when somebody else's answer ain't worth listening to. The more I hear of El Camino Gigantico, the less I like it.

Just to pay lip service to THR, I remember when a Model 70 retailed for $54.00 and no sales tax.

Art

 

[Cool Hand Luke 22:36]

Just since 1990 I've seen land costs rise from $300/$400/acre to $3,000/acre

I have priced land around Texas over the years and I don't dispute what you're saying about about runaway costs. It looks like land and material costs all skyrocketed at the same time the taxes were being increased and then diverted.