Marshall
Member
Gee, it took long enough. Kind of like when they announced a new food study that showed fat causes fat. Who would've thunk?
UK: Muslims face extra checks in new travel crackdown
- Thread starter Desertdog
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trueblue1776
Member
sounds ok to me, teenage boys pay alot for car insurance because they wreck the most, so it seems fair that Muz's get searched more because they blow up more planes than anyone else.
PS, everyone tries to explain the religeon of peace thing to me, I understand what they are saying, I just read to much to believe them. Why if I wrote a book saying I was all about love and peace and harmony then went out and captured a elementry school in Beslan? Would I be a peaceful man? If I went to any country that was predominantly run by the religeon of peace, what are my chances of being beheaded?
PS, everyone tries to explain the religeon of peace thing to me, I understand what they are saying, I just read to much to believe them. Why if I wrote a book saying I was all about love and peace and harmony then went out and captured a elementry school in Beslan? Would I be a peaceful man? If I went to any country that was predominantly run by the religeon of peace, what are my chances of being beheaded?
The fear-mongering cry of "They want to convert or kill us all!" is simple minded propaganda that serves only those who revel in death and destruction, or think they can make Jesus hurry up with the whole second coming thing.
For some reason I do not understand, we Americans tend to completely ignore (or remain ignorant of) our .gov's meddlesome behavior, and expect people (i.e. wogs, fuzzy-wuzzies, ragheads, and any other weird people who are different and therefore obviously not proper enlightened "western" actual humans) to put up with manipulation, interference, and extortion of their governments and economies, bombings, coups, US trained death squads (School of the Americas, anyone?) that we would consider outrageous provocations and acts of war, and then we want to claim they "Hate us for our freedoms".
I guess that's why so many people want to do away with those freedoms. Those 40% who support making Muslims carry special IDs, those who support the ironically named PATRIOT Act, or that we "put them through a bit of *****" or any other violation of what remains of American liberty must be subconciously trying to appease the terrorists. After all, if they hate us for our freedoms, maybe if we divest ourselves of those freedoms, they will leave us alone, right?
Marshall
Member
I believe that came strait from Iran and Al Qaeda. Far be it from us to believe them. But thanks anyway.
longeyes
member
Valid point. But neither we nor "the West" originated oppressive meddling with others. Surely you're not suggesting that there was no "meddling" in old Araby?
No, but that is pretty much irrelevant. Just because we didn't invent "oppressive meddling" does not change the fact that it is a bad idea, and that people dislike it and will tend to react badly to it.
And Marshall, you are mistaken. All these assorted groups have been pretty forthcoming about why they do what they do, and "convert or die" just isn't it. And if it is, how do you explain, for example, the Hezbollah suicide bombers who were communists, socialists (both generally atheistic, even in the ME) and Christians?
Marshall
Member
My point is not to "convert and kill", it's to just plain old "kill". Actually I don't give a rats patooie what reason they want to kill us. Point is, they do, have said so countless times, and have. We do what we have to do to protect ourselves as best we can. If that means profiling, we profile.
If you tell me you're going to kill my innocent family, my neighbors and I, in cold blood, I'm not worried about discussing why and trying to understand your point of view so I can change my ways. I'm going to protect myself, maybe with offense.
It's a tough ass world.
If another country or group wants to wage war conventionally, I'll go along with diplomatic and traditional means. If you're going to purposely target our innocents, the gloves come off. Some will get offended, tough crap. The minute we try to not offend anyone, we've taken the road to Looserville because, it can't be done.
Logic and reason dictate that we profile, period. You'll always be able to point out exceptions, there are to everything. However, in these cases, you never "do not act" because of the exceptions, if so, everyone looses.
One day people will wake up and understand we are in a war with people that want you dead and quit whining about why. You'll never change their mind, you can't reason with insane, evil people that will kill themselves in order to kill innocent men, women and children. Actually, if I understood their reasons, I would be very worried with myself, there is no understanding of this by sane, moral people. This may be complicated, but not so complicated.
You don't, they're insane, evil people. I know of no sane people that are suicide bombers. I know of no sane people that strap bombs to 10 yr old childred so they can walk into a crowd of innocent people and blow them up. As far as being Christians, no they're not, no matter what they claim. Christian don't become suicide bombes. If they do, they're not Christians or they're insane. I pray you can't explain it either.
If you tell me you're going to kill my innocent family, my neighbors and I, in cold blood, I'm not worried about discussing why and trying to understand your point of view so I can change my ways. I'm going to protect myself, maybe with offense.
It's a tough ass world.
If another country or group wants to wage war conventionally, I'll go along with diplomatic and traditional means. If you're going to purposely target our innocents, the gloves come off. Some will get offended, tough crap. The minute we try to not offend anyone, we've taken the road to Looserville because, it can't be done.
Logic and reason dictate that we profile, period. You'll always be able to point out exceptions, there are to everything. However, in these cases, you never "do not act" because of the exceptions, if so, everyone looses.
One day people will wake up and understand we are in a war with people that want you dead and quit whining about why. You'll never change their mind, you can't reason with insane, evil people that will kill themselves in order to kill innocent men, women and children. Actually, if I understood their reasons, I would be very worried with myself, there is no understanding of this by sane, moral people. This may be complicated, but not so complicated.
You don't, they're insane, evil people. I know of no sane people that are suicide bombers. I know of no sane people that strap bombs to 10 yr old childred so they can walk into a crowd of innocent people and blow them up. As far as being Christians, no they're not, no matter what they claim. Christian don't become suicide bombes. If they do, they're not Christians or they're insane. I pray you can't explain it either.
johnsonrlp
Member
He probably didn't look Mormon enough.
Or perhaps they will become the radical sects of Islam. Hezbollah seems to be recruiting well. Seriously segregateing and disenfranchising millions of people that are already inside our borders is a bad idea.
Profiling is like putting an extra lock on the door. If someone really wants to they will pick the lock go through the window or bulldoze the wall. Or shoot through the window. There's just way to many variables. Personaly I think I should be able to breeze through security with my security clearance.
Robert Hairless
Member
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The point of profiling in this situation isn't to identify all muslims in the world and only them. This isn't a census. It's an attempt to focus available resources on those people who evidently are most likely to engage in undesirable behavior. I don't think that any sane person in authority is suggesting that all muslims--or people who appear to be of middle eastern origin--should be slammed against cars, beaten, shot, or otherwise maltreated.
Of course it will be impossible to identify all potential murderers through profiling. Equally of course, it is foolish not to employ all possible techniques that might prevent unnecessary deaths. You know you've won when you die of natural causes.
Survival is the art of the possible. Adapt, improvise, overcome.
Of course it will be impossible to identify all potential murderers through profiling. Equally of course, it is foolish not to employ all possible techniques that might prevent unnecessary deaths. You know you've won when you die of natural causes.
Survival is the art of the possible. Adapt, improvise, overcome.
cassandrasdaddy
Member
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- Jul 1, 2006
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4th time
same question so far no viable answers how to you determine a muslim by looking?
we had a profiler out here that killed a sikh after 9/11 guess they all look alike. and after oklahoma city we had a few other "profilers" do other things to add to our hall of american shame
same question so far no viable answers how to you determine a muslim by looking?
we had a profiler out here that killed a sikh after 9/11 guess they all look alike. and after oklahoma city we had a few other "profilers" do other things to add to our hall of american shame
carebear
Member
Again, I don't care what religion they are. I care if they are from, or first generation immigrants from, the few known primary terrorist (from prior arrests) supplying countrys.
If that forces the terrs to start using book-larned locals and 2nd gen immigrants (who would escape the EXTRA screening) who are already within my security cordon and who, therefore, I have a legal and Constitutional right to investigate more fully based on conventional type tips and intel, so much the better.
The whole "do nothing with extra emphasis" or "abuse the rights of citizens" dichotomy is a patently false one.
If that forces the terrs to start using book-larned locals and 2nd gen immigrants (who would escape the EXTRA screening) who are already within my security cordon and who, therefore, I have a legal and Constitutional right to investigate more fully based on conventional type tips and intel, so much the better.
The whole "do nothing with extra emphasis" or "abuse the rights of citizens" dichotomy is a patently false one.
Robert Hairless
Member
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- Messages
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Same answer: "The point of profiling in this situation isn't to identify all muslims in the world and only them. This isn't a census. It's an attempt to focus available resources on those people who evidently are most likely to engage in undesirable behavior."
I have some difficulty in believing that profilers roam the streets killing Sikhs or doing much of anything except developing and applying profiles. Maybe you're using the word profiler in some way I don't understand, so I'd be grateful if you would define it. I'd also be grateful if you can provide links to a verifiable report of the profiler you said killed a Sikh. The closest I've found are reports of some outrages against Sikhs by stupid, bigoted people--not by profilers. Here's one such report: http://www.paloaltoonline.com/weekly/morgue/2001/2001_09_26.sikh.html If that's the kind of thing you're talking about, you might be misusing the term profiler to mean something like the word bigot, which is not useful thinking.
Autolycus
Member
Has anyone here honestly read the entire Koran from front to back? You may have read some other book such as "The Politically INcorrect guide to Islam" or something along those clearly biased lines but by no means are you an expert. Remember that next time you start quoting the Koran or saying that Muslim holy books say that tehy have to destroy others.
Oleg Volk
Moderator Emeritus
Speaking of recent immigrants. One of my Persian friends, in the US for almost twenty years, was afraid to admit to wanting to learn to shoot beause of fear that it would be reported as terrorist activity. We harm RKBA and we harm the integration and assimilation into the American culture by casting the net too wide.
crazed_ss
Member
Here's the problem I see with profiling Arabs and Muslims in this manner.
Everyone uses the argument that says, "If the cops had a report of a 20-25yr old black male dealing drugs on a city street, then what sense would it make to focus on 60yr old white ladies?" Ok.. in that situation where a crime has been committed, it makes sense to focus on black males since there is a basic description of the suspect.
For innocent Arabs and Muslims getting on the plane, no crime has been comitted. Singling them out for extra attention would be like singling out all black males because a number of other black males have been convicted of drug dealing. It's a fishing expedition and it isnt right.
Everyone uses the argument that says, "If the cops had a report of a 20-25yr old black male dealing drugs on a city street, then what sense would it make to focus on 60yr old white ladies?" Ok.. in that situation where a crime has been committed, it makes sense to focus on black males since there is a basic description of the suspect.
For innocent Arabs and Muslims getting on the plane, no crime has been comitted. Singling them out for extra attention would be like singling out all black males because a number of other black males have been convicted of drug dealing. It's a fishing expedition and it isnt right.
Marshall
Member
Be it right or be it wrong, it makes sense to do it.
I would happily be checked before every single flight if it helps protect innocent people from being murdered. Saying, "don't pay extra attention to my race or origin" to me, is a little selfish in this instance.
I would happily be checked before every single flight if it helps protect innocent people from being murdered. Saying, "don't pay extra attention to my race or origin" to me, is a little selfish in this instance.
grampster
Member
If TSA had remained private and trained their people to look for "tells" profiling can be done successfully. Gooberment took it over and now it's lockstep stupid. One looks for behavior. Immigration folks in airports and border checkpoints do that all the time. (That's because they learned how to do that before PC ruled the day) The Israeli's wrote the book on it at airports.
Just_a_dude_with_a_gun
Member
Keeping it simple is a lost art. Homosexual Lithuanian butchers with hairlips are not attack western nations because of religious beliefs. Muslims, however, are.
When 30 year old white guys in suits, pushing baby stollers begin committing mass murders,
I'll gladly take my turn getting frisked.
When 30 year old white guys in suits, pushing baby stollers begin committing mass murders,
I'll gladly take my turn getting frisked.
Autolycus
Member
Those white guys are blowing buildings up.
What about Tim McVeigh? He blew up a building for his pro-gun racist beliefs. Should we forget about the white professor sending out little care packages of anthrax? Or the Olympic bomber? He was a white guy.
What about Tim McVeigh? He blew up a building for his pro-gun racist beliefs. Should we forget about the white professor sending out little care packages of anthrax? Or the Olympic bomber? He was a white guy.
Marshall
Member
It's an e-mail that's been around a while.
Do you remember?
1. 1968 Bobby Kennedy was shot and killed by?
a. Superman?
B. Jay Leno?
c. Harry Potter?
d. a Muslim male extremist between the ages of 17 and 40?
2. In 1972 at the Munich Olympics, athletes were kidnapped and massacred by?
a. Olga Corbett?
B. Sitting Bull?
c. Arnold Schwarzenegger?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40 ?
3. In 1979, the US embassy in Iran was taken over by:?
a. Lost Norwegians?
B. Elvis?
c. A tour bus full of 80-year-old women?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
4. During the 1980's a number of Americans were kidnapped in Lebanon by:?
a. John Dillinger?
B. The King of Sweden?
c. The Boy Scouts?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
5. In 1983, the US Marine barracks in Beirut was blown up by:?
a. A pizza delivery boy?
B. Pee Wee Herman?
c. Geraldo Rivera?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
6. In 1985 the cruise ship Achille Lauro was hijacked and a 70 year old
American passenger was murdered and thrown overboard in his wheelchair by:?
a. The Smurfs?
B. Davey Jones?
c. The Little Mermaid?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
7. In 1985 TWA flight 847 was hijacked at Athens, and a US Navy diver
trying to rescue passengers was murdered by:?
a. Captain Kidd?
B. Charles Lindberg?
c. Mother Teresa?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
8. In 1988, Pan Am Flight 103 was bombed by:?
a. Scooby Doo?
B. The Tooth Fairy and The Sundance Kid?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
9. In 1993 the World Trade Center was bombed the first time by:?
a. Richard Simmons?
B. Grandma Moses?
c. Michael Jordan?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
10. In 1998, the US embassies in Kenya and Tanzania were bombed by:?
a. Mr. Rogers?
B. Hillary Clinton, to distract attention from Wild Bill's women problems?
c. The World Wrestling Federation?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
11. On 9/11/01, four airliners were hijacked; two were used as missiles
to take out the World Trade Centers and of the remaining two, one crashed into the US Pentagon
and the other was diverted and crashed by the passengers. Thousands of people were killed by:?
a. Bugs Bunny, Wiley E. Coyote, Daffy Duck and Elmer Fudd?
B. The Supreme Court of Florida?
c. Mr. Bean?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
12. In 2002 the United States fought
a war in Afghanistan against:?
a. Enron?
B. The Lutheran Church?
c. The NFL?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
13. In 2002 reporter Daniel Pearl was kidnapped and murdered by:?
a. Bonnie and Clyde?
B. Captain Kangaroo?
c. Billy Graham?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
Do you remember?
1. 1968 Bobby Kennedy was shot and killed by?
a. Superman?
B. Jay Leno?
c. Harry Potter?
d. a Muslim male extremist between the ages of 17 and 40?
2. In 1972 at the Munich Olympics, athletes were kidnapped and massacred by?
a. Olga Corbett?
B. Sitting Bull?
c. Arnold Schwarzenegger?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40 ?
3. In 1979, the US embassy in Iran was taken over by:?
a. Lost Norwegians?
B. Elvis?
c. A tour bus full of 80-year-old women?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
4. During the 1980's a number of Americans were kidnapped in Lebanon by:?
a. John Dillinger?
B. The King of Sweden?
c. The Boy Scouts?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
5. In 1983, the US Marine barracks in Beirut was blown up by:?
a. A pizza delivery boy?
B. Pee Wee Herman?
c. Geraldo Rivera?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
6. In 1985 the cruise ship Achille Lauro was hijacked and a 70 year old
American passenger was murdered and thrown overboard in his wheelchair by:?
a. The Smurfs?
B. Davey Jones?
c. The Little Mermaid?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
7. In 1985 TWA flight 847 was hijacked at Athens, and a US Navy diver
trying to rescue passengers was murdered by:?
a. Captain Kidd?
B. Charles Lindberg?
c. Mother Teresa?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
8. In 1988, Pan Am Flight 103 was bombed by:?
a. Scooby Doo?
B. The Tooth Fairy and The Sundance Kid?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
9. In 1993 the World Trade Center was bombed the first time by:?
a. Richard Simmons?
B. Grandma Moses?
c. Michael Jordan?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
10. In 1998, the US embassies in Kenya and Tanzania were bombed by:?
a. Mr. Rogers?
B. Hillary Clinton, to distract attention from Wild Bill's women problems?
c. The World Wrestling Federation?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
11. On 9/11/01, four airliners were hijacked; two were used as missiles
to take out the World Trade Centers and of the remaining two, one crashed into the US Pentagon
and the other was diverted and crashed by the passengers. Thousands of people were killed by:?
a. Bugs Bunny, Wiley E. Coyote, Daffy Duck and Elmer Fudd?
B. The Supreme Court of Florida?
c. Mr. Bean?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
12. In 2002 the United States fought
a war in Afghanistan against:?
a. Enron?
B. The Lutheran Church?
c. The NFL?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
13. In 2002 reporter Daniel Pearl was kidnapped and murdered by:?
a. Bonnie and Clyde?
B. Captain Kangaroo?
c. Billy Graham?
d. Muslim male extremists mostly between the ages of 17 and 40?
Autolycus
Member
So Muslims and White people should be checked at the airport, when renting cars, taking flying lessons, or buying fertilizer. I agree. Its fair.
Marshall
Member
When we're at war with millions of white guys you'll have your wish and I'll be first in line. 
cassandrasdaddy
Member
- Joined
- Jul 1, 2006
- Messages
- 4,206
a rose by anyother name
the profiler who killed the sikh(the guy with the wife and kids) was in fact an ignorant pos. who profiled this innocent man by looking at him and how he dressed and coming to the conclusion erroneously that he was muslim. and then slaughtering an unarmed amily man.
still waiting for an explanation of how to determine religous affiliation by looking.... and i don't expect any answers soon. profiling folks from certain countries is only slightly more viable and all we gotta do is that national id card and have a block on it for country of origin.
and then of course we set ourselves up for our own rendition of the red armies collaborative attack on the israelis. there are plenty of european whack job groups who would love a shot at us. as well as some asian groups.
hey the profiling worked great in england isn't that how they wasted the innocent guy from brazil? you know they all look alike to some folks
the profiler who killed the sikh(the guy with the wife and kids) was in fact an ignorant pos. who profiled this innocent man by looking at him and how he dressed and coming to the conclusion erroneously that he was muslim. and then slaughtering an unarmed amily man.
still waiting for an explanation of how to determine religous affiliation by looking.... and i don't expect any answers soon. profiling folks from certain countries is only slightly more viable and all we gotta do is that national id card and have a block on it for country of origin.
and then of course we set ourselves up for our own rendition of the red armies collaborative attack on the israelis. there are plenty of european whack job groups who would love a shot at us. as well as some asian groups.
hey the profiling worked great in england isn't that how they wasted the innocent guy from brazil? you know they all look alike to some folks
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