Using shotgun plastic wad/cup in muzzle loader?

[kennedy]

Read both good and bad about using a standard plastic wad used in shotgun shell reloading in a muzzle loader shotgun, most of the bad is plastic fouling the barrel and hard to get out. Sooo since both a standard shotgun and muzzle loader send the plastic wad down the barrel, why fouling in a muzzle loader and not a standard?

 

[.38 Special]

Blackpowder, for whatever reason, tends to melt plastic fairly badly. (I have not tried plastic shot cups in BP shotguns so cannot comment on it directly. I do know that plastic hulls loaded with BP tend to have short, ugly lives.)

 

[4v50 Gary]

See .38 Special's comment. Plastic melts in the bore and needs to be pushed out. That's where inlines permit it b/c the breechplug can be removed and a wire brush with solvent pushed in to push it out. We had to do that with the inlines at Whittington to restore accuracy. You can do that with a conventional muzzleloader.

 

[hawg]

I haven't tried plastic shot cups but I have used plastic hulls and like .38 special said plastic hulls don't last long. The most I've gotten was two reloads. I do get melted plastic in the bore but it's easy to get out of a break open. I don't think it would be so easy out of a muzzleloader. I use fiber wads and when I do use a shot cup I make them out of paper.

 

[robhof]

I use 12 Ga shot cups in my .75 cal cannon to shoot 71 cal balls for better/ more consistant shots, never had a problem wit plastic, but do clean with Ballistol mix, which I've used to remove plastic fowling from my B/P sabot barrel.

 

[243winxb]

https://www.ballisticproducts.com/Bullets-Sabots/products/702/ Hoppes Benchrest Solvent will remove plastic.

Have not tried wads . May not be for BlackPowder?

 

[Jackrabbit1957]

I have used plastic wads in my CVA double barrel for years with no ill effects. Taken many limits on dove here in southern Az. Never experienced any problems with melted plastic. I also reload for my 1906 Parker 12 ga. I use those gay pink plastic shells, mostly so I can tell at a glance what they're for. I use Pyrodex or T7 in those with good results. I can get at least 5 or 6 reloads out of them. And again no issues with leaving plastic behind in the barrels.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

I use 12 Ga shot cups in my .75 cal cannon to shoot 71 cal balls for better/ more consistant shots, never had a problem wit plastic, but do clean with Ballistol mix, which I've used to remove plastic fowling from my B/P sabot barrel.

If you are speaking of the Brown Bess? In a .75" or 11 gauge bore, one can seat the plastic shot cup in a paper tube, and get the best of both worlds. I've never done that with ball, but it sure works good with shot. As mentioned before, if you make the tube longer than the shot cup, you can also use much more shot. My Turkey loads run about two ounces of #4. The paper tube completely "disappears" on firing. I cannot find any trace of it. 100 grains of 1fg Swiss. Not kidding when I say: "who needs a choke?"

In my shell gun, break-open double hammer gun, (pre-1914) I load ball (.690") directly in the 12 gauge shell with buffering compound. (with the appropriate amount of wads) Those are very accurate and consistent. 100-110 grains of Swiss 2fg.

 

[4v50 Gary]

https://www.ballisticproducts.com/Bullets-Sabots/products/702/ Hoppes Benchrest Solvent will remove plastic.

Have not tried wads . May not be for BlackPowder?

We used something like that (dedicated for removing plastic) as a solvent for the inlines at Whittington.

 

[Acorn Mush]

I have used plastic wads in my CVA double barrel for years with no ill effects. Taken many limits on dove here in southern Az. Never experienced any problems with melted plastic. I also reload for my 1906 Parker 12 ga. I use those gay pink plastic shells, mostly so I can tell at a glance what they're for. I use Pyrodex or T7 in those with good results. I can get at least 5 or 6 reloads out of them. And again no issues with leaving plastic behind in the barrels.

I have had the same experience with my CVA 12ga. SxS. Never had any melted plastic in the bore. I use Winchester AA wads.

 

[4v50 Gary]

I suspect there are different formulatons between the modern plastic shotgun wad and the inline wads.

 

[Gordon]

I have used BP Pattern drivers in my 10 gauge Pedersoli cut down to 14" heavy Duck gun . I had a bunch of them as I reload for 10 gauge Magnum for years . I have to lightly grease the wad sides just a bit to get them to slide down the bore. I feel much safer than shooting wads in dry weather in Oregon with them . No real problem with the plastic melting I can see . I use 65 grains of 2x powder and put in 2.0z of shot with an over card wad .

 

[PapaG]

Simple: don’t put the plastic wad directly over the REAL black powder.

 

[Danaidh]

I have successfully used plastic wads with lead shot and other in my .62 smoothbore with no residue from the plastic. For TSS shot, I use the plastic wad specifically made for the TSS. I also use an 1/8" nitro or hard card under the shot or plastic wad. The nitro card is edge lubed with olive oil before sending it down to sit on the powder. With both lead and TSS shot this works great for me leaving no plastic residue and leaving soft BP fouling.

 

[The old gunsmith]

Read both good and bad about using a standard plastic wad used in shotgun shell reloading in a muzzle loader shotgun, most of the bad is plastic fouling the barrel and hard to get out. Sooo since both a standard shotgun and muzzle loader send the plastic wad down the barrel, why fouling in a muzzle loader and not a standard?

I've used plastic wads in muzzleloaders as well as cartridge guns over real BP for 30 years (several thousand rounds) and have never had any issues with plastic residue in the bores. As far as I am concerned, this is just more of the internet wisdom that seems to get passed around as truth with no real experience.

 

[Jackrabbit1957]

We have several guys on the forums that have experienced plastic melting in muzzleloader barrels. My big question is how long ago was it that this happened. Plastics have come a long way since being first made into shotgun wads. I have big box of plastic and cardboard wads with some really old cork cushion wads thrown in that has plastics at least 50 years old. Even those old ones have never caused any grief. I don't shoot trap so my barrels aren't getting heated up but have had some hot and heavy times shooting dove with no issues. I don't doubt these guys word, I've just never had the problems described.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Some guys, yes they do exist, never clean their barrels, or guns. Would a dirty, crusty barrel add to the "problem"?

 

[Patocazador]

I use plastic wads/cups in my shotguns for two reasons - to control the spread of the shot as for making my IC cylinders into Full cylinders AND to protect my barrels from damage when using steel shot on ducks. I use real black powder and have not experienced plastic build-up.

 

[PapaG]

I have shot a fair amount of plastic out of muzzle loading and BP shotguns but learned early on not to seat the plastic on the powder. A card wad and or a fiber wad first. I've seen guys push long strings of plastic out the muzzle after a round of trap. Doesn't happen to everyone and might just be brand related. Years ago I tried some indoor Herters unslit wads out of my cylinder bore Navy Arms "magnum" 12 (that's what they called it"). Some patterns would be "blown" while, once in a while, there would be a 12 ga hole with a few, very few, pellet holes around it.
For the period from '68-'80, I shot almost exclusively black powder guns and shot literally hundreds of patterns and targets with rifle, shotgun and handgun. I learned never to say never (except never use smokeless) when talking muzzle loaders.
I shot with some of the best and soaked up their knowledge like a sponge.
Now, I only shoot enough to stay sharp for deer season. In '79, during the Cat strike, I'd hunt squirrels in the morning, doves from 12-3, and woodcock til dark at a state forest, all with that Navy or an old original Belgian double.

 

[Armored farmer]

I've not tried plastic wads in my BP sxs. It sounds like some do. They would improve your range if you do.
I tried to use some plastic sabot in my t/c Hawken years ago....it was a total failure. They fouled up my barrel real bad.....I broke my ramrod!. I don't recommend that at all! You're probably okay with a smoothbore..
I like @PapaG idea of an over-powder card first...then the wad.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Plastic wrapped in paper. The only way to fly. But, it helps to have an 11 gauge bore.