vertical grip to AR/PLR-16 pistol

[Foxtrot427]

Is it legal to attach a vertical forward grip to a AR-15 pistol or to one of those Kel-Tec PLR-16 pistols? Seems like having one would make a much more balanced pistol.

 

[jlbraun]

I don't think it's legal, people have asked about putting VFGs on a 1911 and got the response that it's an AOW.

 

[MachIVshooter]

VFG on a handgun=AOW. Fill out form 4 and pay the $200, or don't do it.

 

[Foxtrot427]

$200 for an AOW? Screw, that Ill pay $200, make it an SBR and put on a stock too. Thats a shame. I guess Ill stick to the magwell.

 

[M2 Carbine]

It is not legal (without dealing with the Feds).

It is not legal to attach something that is otherwise a handle.
This was posted by a member on the KTOG site.
http://www.ktog.org/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=50;action=display;num=1160776289#lastmsg


Quote
"Had an ATF agent here at my office today and went over some ideas I had on the verticle fore grip. He ended up having to call the controller's office in WV for clarification.

My question was does the use of a rail mounted X26 Taser. As seen here:
http://www.taser.com/tasernet/index.htm in the WarFighter section constitue a VFG.

According to the powers to be, that is considered an AOW due to the fact that the Taser is mounted to the weapons rail and has a "handle".

Guess that rules out the need to design an "L" shaped flashlight with the batteries in one end and the light hardware in the other. Seems they will still consider it an AOW.

If the tax stamp was to give me the right to use the verticle fore grip on "any" pistol (similar to a surpressor) then I could see paying $200 for the tax stamp but the tax is only for that weapon. Not even sure it would transfer if I sold the weapon.

Just a word of warning. The controllers in WV are very serious about this crap. Kind of got a little uncomfortable there for a second while the agent was on the phone with the controller. Needless to say I "quickly" removed the Taser from the weapon!"

 

[noresttill]

I thought the AOW tax was $5. I admit I havent looked into it though.

Jesse

 

[steveracer]

Correct.

AOW is $5.
SBR or SBS is $200
Make it an SBR, and forget the problem.

 

[Foxtrot427]

Wait you onlly need $5 to make it an AOW. Thats way less than $200. Why not just do that?

 

[buzz_knox]

For an AOW, the cost isn't the problem. Getting on the NFA list and going through those hoops can be. Personally, I like being able to move and transfer property without worrying if I did/did not follow the latest guidelines, and thus became a felon.

 

[wdlsguy]

$200 to make an AOW, $5 to transfer an AOW.

 

[lurkersince03]

That's a vague and self-defeatist answer. If it takes about the same amount of hassle to get an AOW as it would an SBR/SBS... why NOT do it?

 

[GregGry]

Correct me if I am wrong, but wouldn't you have to pay the 200$ tax twice?

 

[lurkersince03]

No. If you want to make it into an SBR, you have to pay the $200 for that. But adding a vertical foregrip to a rifle, short barreled or not, doesn't require any sort of tax stamp.

Theoretically, you could end up paying twice by paying $5 for the AOW tax stamp, then decide to make it into an SBR later and pay $200 again.

 

[MachIVshooter]

Theoretically, you could end up paying twice by paying $5 for the AOW tax stamp, then decide to make it into an SBR later and pay $200 again.

I'm no lawyer, but wouldn't removing the stock (returning it to pistol configuration) and then adding the foregrip again still make it an AOW, even if it is a registered SBR? (I guess it could get really fuzzy here:banghead: )

 

[Waywatcher]

I'm sleepy but this thread still has me :banghead:

 

[wdlsguy]

wouldn't removing the stock (returning it to pistol configuration) and then adding the foregrip again still make it an AOW, even if it is a registered SBR?

No. An SBR can have a stock or no stock. An SBR can have a vertical foregrip or no vertical foregrip. An SBR is much more flexible than an AOW configuration wise.

The only way to turn an SBR into an AOW is to remove it from the NFA registry as an SBR, then re-register it as an AOW on a Form 1 with another $200 tax payment.

 

[Manedwolf]

How about if you put a .223 silencer on it as well? Is that another $200?

 

[wdlsguy]

You would need to pay the $200 transfer tax for a silencer, but you are free to move the silencer from one weapon to another.

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

I'm no lawyer, but wouldn't removing the stock (returning it to pistol configuration) and then adding the foregrip again still make it an AOW, even if it is a registered SBR? (I guess it could get really fuzzy here )

This is where the sheer brillance of those regs really shine. IIRC, and AOW can have NEVER had a stock attached, so it can never become an AOW and will always be a rifle (or SBR) once you attach a stock, even if you take it off (receiver is registered as a rifle in the NFA registry). I think you also have to engrave the serial number and stuff into the receiver if you go SBR. The laws make sense after a few brews and a nice frontal lobotomy. Somebody with more NFA experience correct me if this isn't true.
Gets expensive for a stupid little $50 plastic VFG!

 

[wdlsguy]

IIRC, and AOW can have NEVER had a stock attached

True (although there is a kind of AOW that can have a stock).

so it can never become an AOW and will always be a rifle (or SBR) once you attach a stock

True.

I think you also have to engrave the serial number and stuff into the receiver if you go SBR.

You need to engrave your name, city and state (or recognized abbreviations thereof).