W231+MBC= smoky!! Ideas?

[1KPerDay]

I assume 98% of the smoke from lubed lead bullets is the lube, right? My current combo of W231 under MBC smallball with the blue lube is so smoky it looks like I'm shooting black powder. It actually obscures the targets if I shoot fast enough and the wind is right.

I need to load a bunch of MBC IDPA 140 grain TCFP in .40 and wondered if there's a powder/lead combo that produces less smoke?

I doubt it but just thought I'd ask. Any good loads for these bullets welcome. Last time I used Red Dot which worked fine. Still smoky though.

 

[Tilos]

The smoke is from the lube
Switch to a Hi-Tek coated bullet and the smoke will be gone...
http://missouribullet.com/details.php?prodId=219&category=20&secondary=11

 

[longdayjake]

Yep, lead cast bullets without any kind of coating will smoke no matter what powder you use. Some are worse than others but you're going to get smoke with lead cast bullets.

 

[Blue68f100]

Powders that burn at a lower temp generate less smoke. Higher the nitro content hotter it burns.

 

[1KPerDay]

Such as?

 

[Blue68f100]

I use WST for this main reason, it burns cooler and cleaner throughout the whole load range. I've shot next to different people at a indoor gun range for many years. With WST I had very little smoke while the others looked like they were shooting black powder guns. Some were using Unique, BE, TG and few I don't remember. TG runs extremely hot and should not be used for lead unless gas checked. Also I could put 100 rounds through my SS gun and it was cleaner than theirs after 1 magazine. I use it in my mouse fart loads for my 357 mag and BE loads in my 1911. WST is a very strange powder in that it burns extremely clean at very reduced loads (0.5gr below starting on 45acp). It was originally developed as a shot gun powder, which run less pressure than most handguns. It's also reverse temp sensitive, meaning it gets slower as the temp goes up. According to Winchester/Olin this powder it has a higher waste for disposal during manufacturing. One of the reasons it was one of the last to come back during the last shortage. How long they are going to continue making it I have no idea. But I have a good supply that hopefully will last the rest of my life.

 

[1KPerDay]

I wish I could say the same. I love WST and have gone through 16 pounds of it but I'm out, and I have like 35 lbs of other pistol powders and can't really justify getting more WST for now.

A list for those who want to consider my alternatives:
W231/HP-38
Longshot
Clays
Red Dot/Promo (both)
Blue Dot
Unique
Power Pistol
CFE Pistol
BE-86
Autocomp
HS-6
800X
Silhouette
International
Universal
Bullseye
Herco
Titegroup
(2400)
(trail boss)

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Silhouette is probably the one I would try from that extensive list.

 

[1KPerDay]

Will do, thanks.

 

[Dudedog]

Universal worked well for me in 9mm with a MBC 125gr Cone type lubed lead bullets.
I don't recall it being super smoky but then I never really stopped to think about it.
Was just starting to load handgun then.
3.7gr of Universal seemed a little light, 4.3 a little stout and 4.0 just right.
(I choose to try Universal first because I had a lee disk measure and it gave me a 3 charges in the load range with the fixed disks according to listed VMDs, maybe not the best reason to chose a powder but seemed logical at the time)
4.0gr shot really well
Then I read
1 9mm is a pain to load
2 Don't start with lead bullets
3 Lee equipment is junk
To bad I already had a good shooting 9mm load created on my "Deluxe" 3 hole Lee Turret that I was happy with.
Before I read that, I never would have realized I was doing everything wrong and it wouldn't work

Shot really well in my Taraus PT99, wasn't counting but maybe shot 5-8K of this load.
No choro when I first started so no vels on that load.
Since you have some already it might be worth a try,

 

[1KPerDay]

Thanks!

 

[Dudedog]

Your welcome!

Checking old notes,
9mm MBC lubed lead 125 cones
I didn't care for Titegroup with lead, very detailed comment "yuck" (ok some of my early and for that matter later notes are less than stellar quality)
Noted that Promo worked well, with load 3.8 to allow for the charge swing. (Promo actually metered better for me than Unique in my Lee disk measure)
(I had a smaple of Promo to try thanks to a member here so I didn't have to buy an 8lb jug)
Bullseye and Unique notes say I liked Universal better
Noted that Universal metered much better than Unique which I noted didn't meter well for me at all. + or -.2 load for swing on high side.
Power Pistol notes said I liked Universal better, but even though I wasn't using a chrono or concerned with PF at the time things in the middle were just more pleasant to shoot for practice so that's what I was looking for.
My feelings would probably have been different if I was after full power stuff.
Of course this is 9mm .40 is a different animal, but maybe my 9mm impressions will be helpful.