Want to start reloading MATCH GRADE .223. Advice please!

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Lr_athlete32

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Hi, new guy here,

I'm interested in reloading MATCH GRADE .223 and have bought some manuals but don't know where to start in terms of machinery and tools except that I want a single stage press and the best match grade components I can find. (Redding type s match fl dies maybe?)

I've read that the rcbs rock chucker supreme master kit is hard to beat but want your opinions.

I will be reloading for an AR with a 16" 1:9 twist barrel (labled 5.56)and want to make the best possible ammo for the best possible accuracy.

Any suggestions on cartridge materials (powder, bullets, etc.) Is greatly appreciated. Thinking lake city or lapua brass, varget powder, federal match primers, and sierra matching bullets to start.

Thanks!
 
This page will give some good info. You will get some much info online that information overload will set in.

If you have never reloaded anything, buy a couple of manuals to start off with and research before buying anything,

Consistency is the name of the game.

Any big name single stage will do the job, depends on you budget.

http://www.6mmbr.com/223rem.HTML
 
1st - You will probably want an 1:8 twist if you shooting longer distance and longer bullets.
I have 2 Rock Chucker presses. You can't wear them out. RCBS has excellent service to go with it.
I usually get my best loads from 69 grain SMK's and IMR4895. The powder choice is something you just have to work with. My .02 says stick with a bullet and try several powders before you move on to another bullet.
I picked up some Lapua brass off the range in .308 and it's excellent brass. I suspect that's true with all their brass.
 
Thanks for the reply carbine85, I would like to stick with my 1:9 if I can. I'll only be shooting medium range 600yds tops and want something that will print exc3dingly good at 100yds and hopefully retain some of that accuracy out to 300 and 400yds.

My main delema with (quality) factory ammunition is that I get about 1 moa at 100yds and about 4-5" groups at 300. I would like more accuracy to be retained at longer distances.
 
Before spending on a reloading setup, I'd try a couple boxes of factory ammunition with 69 gr. match bullets. Since you have a 1/9 twist, I wouldn't go heavier. Federal, Remington and Winchester make 223 Rem. 69 gr. match ammo.

Your rifle barrel may only be capable of 1 MOA. You might be spinning your wheels. You need to find out if your barrel will do better. You didn't post what barrel and barrel profile you have in your rifle.
 
Buy good brass. Lapua is expensive but you won't be able to blame brass it you shoot poorly. Buy accurate bullets. Varmint bullets usually shoot well, or buy some match bullets. All the bullet makers offer some.

I bought some BlackGun Industries brass from Midway on sale and it turned out to be pretty good brass, and much cheaper than Lapua. I wanted good accuracy, but didn't need match winning accuracy. It's just for more serious plinking, not match shooting.
 
FLIGHT762 said:
Before spending on a reloading setup, I'd try a couple boxes of factory ammunition with 69 gr. match bullets. Since you have a 1/9 twist, I wouldn't go heavier. Federal, Remington and Winchester make 223 Rem. 69 gr. match ammo.

Your rifle barrel may only be capable of 1 MOA. You might be spinning your wheels. You need to find out if your barrel will do better. You didn't post what barrel and barrel profile you have in your rifle.
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Very good advice.
 
I guess it depends on the definition of "Match" grade. Is your rifle capable of match grad groups. There are AR's and than AR's:)

When I think match grade I think bolt action unless you have a really tricked out AR.

Mainly the barrel and trigger department. You can have the best ammo made but if the trigger is so so, then it will not matter.

Regardless you want the best that your rifle can do, On that link look at how well Hornady brass was rated, right up there and half the price of Lapua

Stick with quality components (bullets and brass and that is most of the battle. You have to find what bullets your rifle does best with so sample a few different types,makes. Powders are a whole other decision. Do your homework!:D
 
I agree with all the responses so far, and here is my .02.

First and foremost good bullets and good barrels are what make ARs shoot. Sounds like you have a good handle on what quality presses and handloading components are.

If you are getting MOA at 100 and 1.25-1.5 MOA at 300, you are already well on your way. The next thing I would do is look at optics, a free float handguard, and an improved trigger. IME those three things shrink groups even more once a good barrel and a good load is found.

Just my .02,
LeonCarr
 
You'll need a good match grade or National Match trigger if your rifle has a standard trigger. Free floated handguard too. Not bad accuracy already with a 5.56 barrel. You may have trouble getting 1 moa accuracy to 600 yards? Better bullets for 600 yards are 77 and 80 grain bullets that probably won't stabilize in a 1/9 twist.
 
I will be reloading for an AR with a 16" 1:9 twist barrel (labled 5.56)and want to make the best possible ammo for the best possible accuracy.
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Greetings from the lovely Cleveland suburbs.

Keep in mind from the onset there is no sense or merit to making ammunition more accurate than your rifle can shoot. Keep in mind what was mentioned about the trigger!

With the above in mind look for accurate bullets that will stabilize in the 1:9 barrel you have. The 1:9 is a general nice compromise between the faster 1:7 which work well for really heavy bullets and the slower twist which work well for the real light bullets. My AR rifles in 223 happen to be 1:7 and while they shoot the heavy bullets very well they do not seem to fare as well with the light bullets like 55 grain or lighter. My 1:12 bolt gun does well there.

As to building accurate ammunition? No magic, it's like baking a cake or preparing a fine meal, it's all about the ingredients. You start with good and uniform brass, Lapau isn't cheap but it is uniform and some of the best you can buy. Bullets? I like Sierra Match King stuff but Hornady and Speer also market excellent match bullets. Trim your brass so it is uniform and make sure you keep your powder charges uniform. Good quality match ammunition is consistent! Powder? The 223 is one of those cartridges that offers a wide range of loading. Generally speaking when loading for service rifle (not my bolt gun) the powders I like were VihtaVouri N-140 and N-135, I also like AA 2495. Good bullets you may want to try in your 1:9 are the Hornady 68 grain BTHP and the Sierra 69 grain BTHP Match King. It will take time to see what works for you in your rifles.

So for what it's worth in my opinion really accurate ammunition is made using really high quality ingredients. As to specific loads? Matter of trial and error for your rifle.

Just My Take....
Ron
 
lake city or lapua brass, varget powder, federal match primers, and sierra matching bullets
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Use those components, get a good set of dies, and dial in an accurate charge of Varget, and you will be making match grade ammo.

As others have said, 69 SMK's aren't the best in the wind at long ranges (400+) but might be all your 1:9 will stabilize.

Laphroaig
 
If you are already shooting MOA with an AR you are doing better than the vast majority of AR owners (it is common for a generic AR to shoot 2-3 MOA). ARs were never really designed to be precision rifles and in general auto-loading rifles are not synonymous with sub-moa accuracy.

You've already got some great advise on where to start with the rifle- getting a crisp, lighter trigger is usually the best place to start (most "run of the mill" AR triggers feel like metal being dragged on concrete). Next, having the barrel floated on any rifle aids accuracy.

When you start to load your own rounds, regardless of brass manufacturer, case preparation is really important. Be sure to trim all cases to the same length (and in spec), always FL size your cases. Varget is a great powder but there are others that work really well (H335 comes to mind). You also need to find a bullet weight that your rifle likes (I would stick to the 55 grain range when starting out). Bullet seating depth also makes a difference and hold back on crimping the case necks. I strongly suggest that you perform an internet search and look up "Ladder Method" - its a great way to establish what your particular rifle likes.

I have spent considerable time reloading for AR rifles and honestly some of them have made me want to pull my hair out. I fully support your desire to get into reloading (its a great hobby) and I have never regretting my investment in equipment but don't be disappointed if you don't get the results that you are after with your AR. Shoot me a PM with your email address and I will send you a spreadsheet containing some of the "most accurate" .223 reloads (great starting point).

Blessings,

Paul
 
I think you wil find that someone's load may not work in yourr rifle, I have 1/7, 1/8, 1/9 and a 1/12 twist barrels. The 1/7 colt only likes nosler 69 gr. The 1/8 only likes 77 gr Sierra. 1/9 like 62 SS109 and the 1/12 like 55 gr FMJ. It takes a lot of time to develope accurate loads.
 
Consistency consistency consistency.

When you go to shoot your workup for your match loads, use a minimum of 200yd. If you're getting sub-MOA at 100yd, more than likely it's not going to fare well at 600yd and here's why I say that. At 100yd, you're not giving your bullet enough time to settle in.

With your 1:9 twist, check out the 69gr Sierra Tipped Match King bullets and some others around that weight. Never know what your rifle might like.

As far as brass, make sure the case capacities are the same or at least within .2gr of each other. Case weight doesn't mean a hill of beans. Case capacity is where it's at.

When doing your workup for mid-range match loads, I've noticed a ladder test works best. That 1 round at each charge shot at 300yd or further and looking for the node. I've noticed it works better than the OCW workup or a variation of such.

As said, it does take awhile to workup a great match load.

Check several powders as well. It took me right around a year to find a match load for shooting F-Class, but once I did, how sweet it was.
 
Thanks for all the great info guys. I neglected to say what my barrel was earlier, it is a RRA (believe these to start out as wilson blanks, any info on that would be appreciated) stainless steel (finish as well) m4 profile that is free floated. With winchester match 69g smk's, I'm getting about moa at 100 and plan on trying some hornady amax's and DRT 55g frangable hpbt (anyone heard of this?).

As for the trigger suggestions, I never put much thought into mine (just enough to know it sucks) and will definitely get a better one.

As for the barrel suggestions, I know for sure that I will be getting into reloading and wanted to buil a good load around my barrel rather than replace it.

Also, I should have said that I dont do any shooting matches but would just like to get about moa groups at 200-400 of that's not asking too much.

As for shooting groups at 100yds and not giving the bullet enough time to stabilize in flight vs. Shooting at say 200yds, I understand what you are saying. Back in my m193 days, I noticed I got about 2.5" at 100 and 1.5 at 150 but did not think much of it untill now.

As for optics, I'm using a leupold mark AR mod 1 1.5-4 with spr reticle and am very confident with that power (actually replaced my leupy 2-7 with it)

When I shoot, I use a bipod and lay prone using a sand bag (if I don't forget the darn thing) for the buttstock.
 
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Do you have a "match grade" capable gun? No matter how consistent the ammunition, if the gun doesn't do its part, you'll never get "match" accuracy.
 
Which RRAs do you have?

They make excellent rifles and "guarantee" different MOA. 3/4 to 1"

Most of their triggers are 2 stage and pretty decent, so if it is one of the many LAR 15"s they can shoot pretty damn well.
 
With all the good advice being handed out, I wanted to add one thing. I have made some good ammo and some that really sucked. The good ammo always shot better. Moral of the story, test, test, and test and only load what is good. Enjoy.

PS: I had a RRA factory rifle with a bull barrel. Most accurate semi I have ever owned.
 
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Accuracy is the sum total of all your components. If you don't have an excellent barrel and ammo components, everything else is usually an excercise in futility

If you're happy with a low power scope, have at it. Just know that precision bench rest shooter typically favor higher magnification.

This is from my AR. Great (factory original) barrel and trigger. Scope is 6.5-20x40 Leupold. 1-9 twist.

I have a friend that was quite discouraged with his AR. Best groups were 2" and sometimes quite a bit bigger. These hand loads shrunk that to about 1" immediately

Gunpix-1.jpg
 
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First off, wow redneck that's some great shooting!

Secondly, my AR is an all rock river LAR15 with a chrome bcg (best gas port staking I've ever seen). I've since free floated and converted to an adjustable stock with an adjustable cheek riser. The trigger is a single stage witch will be replaced with their varmint trigger (for those interested, I emailed RRA and they said the only difference between the national match and varmint trigger is that the varmint is lighter, other than that, they are identical).
 
Having a stainless barrel lends itself to better accuracy so that's a plus. RRA rifles typically shoot well. Get a better trigger installed and see what that does. You have a good rig, not a generic frankengun. Good place to start.

Paul
 
Redding full length S dies are the best choice for an AR15 imo. Get the right tools to measure shoulder bump. I like the Redding competition shell holder sets, but you can get by without them.

I'd select a better metering powder. H335, TAC, or XBR8208, 748, BLC2, etc. etc. Too many good metering powders out there.

Nosler bullets can be had cheaper and are comparable to the SMKs.
 
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