Warning shots?

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Thanks, Loosedhorse, for the link. Good grief, almost 20 years ago now. I agree, a very sad situation for all involved.

Prosser, if bear claws were the original open carry, were cat paws the original concealed carry?
 
If you are attacked, as they were, yet the attacker is bringing a knife, or screwdriver to a gunfight, how do you sell that your life was endangered, when you have the gun?


Ummmmmmm.................because a knife is a deadly weapon maybe? Since when does a gun protect you against being stabbed. Is the knife any less deadly because you have a gun?

What if they have a .22 and you have a .357 mag? Are you in danger then? After all, yours is much bigger than theirs. :rolleyes:
 
Specific reference, to the fish case. We don't know what the knife was for on entry, but it probably wasn't good.
The problem is selling your actions to a jury soccer mom with no violent crime experience, in some little city in Arizona. I shouldn't say that. Knowing soccer, the mom's are involved in one of the worst behaved, violent fan group in the world.
 
It doesn't matter what I think its what the LAW says.

Are you going to shoot everyone who wants to fight? Like I said you avoid confrontation but having a firearm isn't a get out of a fight free card and can't be used as such.

If a jealous boyfriend wants to punch you in the face for staring at his girlfriends fine fine booty you can't pull your gun or much less shoot the dude simply because you're armed and don't wanna fight.

Someone wanting to FIGHT you is NOT the same as someone wanting to KILL YOU

What are you saying? That the law requires that I fight him just because he wants to fight? Not any law I have read, at least not in Texas. Actually, the law in Texas says I CAN pull a gun and threaten him, and if necessary, I can shoot him to stop his unlawful use of deadly force. (If he continues to advance in the face of a gun, the deadly force I am stopping him from using is my gun which I may reasonably assume he intends to take from me).
 
My 'warning shot' consists of the "Snick!" of the Fire Control Group being set to Operate.

I have been the victim of what is now popularly called home invasion, and even now, 32 years later, I STILL do not sleep well. Briefly, having to witness the gang rape of your loved one, and not being able to do anything about it is NOT a happy time. The ex has not fully recovered from that event, and neither have I.

I can't even being to imagine what those 2 sub-humans in Oklahoma had in mind for the 18-year old single mom/widow
 
Shoot a guy who wants to fistfight and let us know how that works out for you.

This shooting took place about one-half mile from our home. It worked out well for this shooter:

http://www.tulsaworld.com/site/printerfriendlystory.aspx?articleid=071028_1_A27_hApro53278

Comanche County District Attorney Robert Schulte said he plans to take no action against Jeffrey David Dorrell, 40, who shot and killed Frederick Stuever, 17.

Dorrell arrived at his father's home Tuesday afternoon to find Stuever leaving the home with the family's property. The back door had been kicked in, and officials believe the teen was attempting to take things from the home.

Items belonging to the homeowner were later found in Stuever's vehicle, police said.

Dorrell, who has a permit to carry a concealed weapon, held Stuever at gunpoint while he called the police.

While on the phone with dispatchers, Dorrell ordered Stuever to lie on the ground until the police could come. When Stuever would not comply, Dorrell fired five shots in his direction, but did not hit Stuever.

Dorrell told police that he shot Stuever when the teen charged at him. Stuever died at the scene.
 
What are you saying? That the law requires that I fight him just because he wants to fight? Not any law I have read, at least not in Texas. Actually, the law in Texas says I CAN pull a gun and threaten him, and if necessary, I can shoot him to stop his unlawful use of deadly force. (If he continues to advance in the face of a gun, the deadly force I am stopping him from using is my gun which I may reasonably assume he intends to take from me).

Then I suggest you study up on THE LAW what rises to the justification of the use of deadly force.

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In Arkansas you absolutely cannot do what Dorrel did and use deadly force to defend property.

And the fact that the teen was in commission of a felony in Dorrels home likely kept him from procecution as per Oklahoma law.

But neither case changes the fact that you cannot meet someone unarmed merely wanting to fight with deadly force. YOU WILL GO TO PRISON

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I agree, a very sad situation for all involved
My strong feeling is that only Hattori's family was sadder than Peairs himself. And I don't think it was the monetary cost--I think it was his certainty that he killed someone he shouldn't have, someone he could have avoided shooting in a hundred ways.

We hear often that in a gun-fight, you have no time to think: you've got to ACT NOW. OODA loop, don't you know. Me? I want to decide.

I have a template in my head of the (highly unlikely) scenario that would cause me to choose a warning shot, and I describe all the elements in post 26. The guy's drunk--for all I know he's been sober for 10 years and just fell off the wagon today; everyone in his church will line up at my trial to say he shouldn't have been shot.

The guy says he has a knife, but he hasn't produced one. He doesn't think the gun is real. Well, we know that one of the first things that goes with drink is judgment. Maybe he "judges" that it's a great idea to pretend he has a weapon, and that he's a connaisseur of fake guns that look absolutely real.

It is a given that by not shooting him immediately, I put myself at risk. It is a given that a warning shot increases the risk to bystanders, and my legal exposure.

But there are some things I am willing to risk to avoid shooting someone who, like Hattori, should not be shot; in fact, there are things I'm willing to risk to avoid shooting someone who "should" be shot (is presenting an immediate illegal lethal threat), but can be stopped without gunfire.

So, pattern recognition: if I'm ever attacked, is it more like my warning shot template, or more like my aim COM template? Some will say options are bad, they slow you down.

Well, some of us need options anyway. :eek:
 
Prosser said:
Western civilization can't figure out what it's like to train your entire life to identify the feeling people put out when they are about to kill or maim you.

How do you explain that to a jury?
I wouldn't even bother. Maybe it wouldn't get you into hot water, but it's easy to see a situation where a prosecutor might tear a person apart for trying to explain that he used any level of physical force on a person "because he was getting bad vibes." That may be a simplification, but it's essentially the same thing.

As far as warning shots go, there may be situations where they might not result in a tactical disadvantage, but personally, I wouldn't (and won't) ever count on that, because it's an unnecessary risk. If you have sufficient reason to fire your weapon at all, you have sufficient reason to use deadly force.

There's always going to be the possibility of injustice in our legal system. There is the chance that a prosecutor could successfully convince a jury that while it would have been justified for you to warn a burglar/rapist/whatever with a warning shot, it was not justified for you to shoot him. That's a fallacy, both logically and legally; but yes, it could happen, and probably has. That's a risk you need to decide for yourself whether you want to take or not.

The bottom line is this: There is never going to be a situation where a warning shot is justified, but a "kill shot" (pardon the expression) is not justified. Anyone who tells you otherwise cares nothing for your safety, or your right to protect yourself or your family.

Prosser said:
The problem is selling your actions to a jury soccer mom with no violent crime experience, in some little city in Arizona.
It sounds like you're much more concerned about trying to explain your actions in court, than in actually doing what's within the spirit of the law. If you aren't an attorney, I wouldn't worry about that too much. What I would worry about is ensuring you establish contact with an attorney who deals with self-defense cases regularly. Alternatively, there's a well-known organization (which I forget the name of at the moment) that deals specifically with these situations, and offers members legal services in the event they need to use deadly force to protect themselves. Several THR members are members of the organization. Ask around if you want more info. You may also want to read this interview (taken from this thread).
 
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i will say again: If you find yourself in court being tried for murder, you have failed three tests:

1. The police did not believe you.
2. The prosecutor did not believe you.
3. The grand jury did not believe you.

There's a very good chance the jury will not believe you.
 
It appears that in most jurisdictions, defendants in clear or typical self-defense (SD) cases are not arrested by the police, not charged by the district attorney, not true billed by a grand jury, nor sent to trial.

So SD news reports and case law are based on unclear, unusual cases, where the defender is arrested or otherwise adjudicated by the criminal and/or civil justice system (unlike the 18 yr old young woman and mother in Oklahoma).

What we hear about are the SD cases that went wrong. While it is probably a good idea to be aware of what can go wrong, that seems to ignore all the cases that went right, which is what good strategy ought to be based on.

In a self-defense situation where a "reasonable person" would be in fear of imminent death or greivous bodily harm from a person perceived to have the ability and opportunity to put life or limb in jeopardy right now, use of a deadly weapon is usually justifiable. Theoretically, if lethal force is justified (shoot-to-kill), then non-lethal use of a deadly should also be justified: verbal threat, brandishing, warning shot, shoot-to-wound.

The well-known 1994 National Self Defense Survey NSDS focussed on defensive gun use questions; ten prior national surveys and the subsequent NSPOF survey included DGU questions, but within larger surveys on multiple subjects, and found 764,000 to 4,700,000 DGU per year. The majority of DGU did not involve firing the gun and most firings were not woundings or killings.

Statisically, most DGU end up brandishment, warning shots, misses or non-lethal wounding, and they do not end up in either criminal or civil court. However, in criminal or civil court deliberate less-than-lethal use of a deadly weapon by verbal threat, brandishing, warning shot, shoot-to-wound has been used to contest whether the person claiming self-defense was truly in fear of loss of life or limb.

Some bad defensive shooting cases like the Peairs-Hattori or Fish cases are worth pondering. The Hattori-Peairs shooting is mentioned in the first 1 or 2 pages in both the John Lott & David Mustard 1997 "Crime, Deterrence and Right-To-Carry Concealed Handguns" article and the Lott 1998 More Guns, Less Crime book as an example of how self-defense can go wrong.

College exchange student Hattori and companions had been seeking a Halloween night party and approached the wrong address; Peairs' wife panicked when they came to the door and Peairs armed himself and opened the garage door. The rest is tragedy.

Peairs was found not guilty in criminal court. Apparently the criminal court felt that a "reasonable" person in that situation would have been in fear of death or harm from a trespasser who advanced after being told to "Freeze". At the civil trial, a big point was made that Peairs' gun was "unusual" (a magnum with a laser sight) and not the sort of handgun usually kept in Louisiana homes for protection.

In the Fish case, at criminal trial the caliber and type of ammunition (10 mm hollowpoint) was painted as aggressive rather than defensive:
from Wikipedia article on "Stopping Power":

Since 2006, after the conviction of retired school teacher Harold Fish in Arizona for second degree murder during a self-defense shooting, some CCW holders in the United States have elected to switch from carrying hollow-point bullets, and especially 10mm Auto caliber weapons with perceived higher one-shot stopping power, to carrying smaller caliber weapons (Citation needed|date=March 2009).

Fish's conviction for killing a homeless man with a history of dangerous violent behavior and mental instability who attacked Fish while hiking on a remote trail, was obtained through a jury trial by stressing that Fish overreacted, through choosing to use the increased stopping power of 10 mm hollow point bullets.

State law in Arizona has subsequently been changed, such that the state now has the burden to prove that a self defense shooting was not in self defense, whereas the burden previously, before the Fish incident, was that the shooter on trial had to prove that the shooting was in fact, done in self defense.

The conviction has since been thrown out by the Arizona Court of Appeals. CCW training classes often advise the use of bullets that are identical to those used by local police, in type (FMJ or hollow point) and caliber, to prevent an overreaction prosecution.

refs
Michael Maresh, "Governor vetoes hope for Harold Fish", Payson Roundup, 6 Mar 2007 (dead link)

Larry Hendricks, "Trailside Shooter Guilty", Payson Roundup, 16 Jun 2006 (dead link)

from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stopping_power
 
That said, if it was me, and I saw no gun, I would shot to stop, like legs, etc.

What are you wasting ammuition for?
And 'shooting to wound' can be construed that you are NOT in fear for your life (or grave injury when that is allowed).

In Virginia fists are NOT considered lethal weapons a priori.

Using lethal force in response (absent other circumstances) can get you in a bad spot.

moving from mutual combat with fists to lethal force is NOT going to be well received.
 
At the civil trial, a big point was made that Peairs' gun was "unusual" (a magnum with a laser sight) and not the sort of handgun usually kept in Louisiana homes for protection.
If you have reviewed the civil trial transcript, then you know more than I. However, I think absent juror interviews immediately after verdict, it is hard to know why jurors decide what they do. Prosecutors (as in the Fish case) and plaintiff's attorneys often "throw everting against the wall, and see what sticks." Just because a gun is argued to be too powerful does not mean that that argument led to conviction, or was even contributory. However, the fact that it has been (and therefore presumably will be again, in future trials) brought up is worth noting, and being prepared for.

Robert Ressler, a former FBI profiler who fancies himself the inventor of the term "serial killer" :)rolleyes:) was involved in the Peairs civil trial (I forget if simply a consultant for the plaintiff's team or an actual expert witness), and he writes about his efforts in I Have Lived In the Monster. He writes that Peairs is a murderer (was "waiting for a chance" to blast someone); I think--like many other things he writes--that is clearly untrue.

He states that the .44 Mag pistol was "overkill" for SD. He glosses over the fact that Peairs owned no other handgun, and had bought the gun for hunting (with a thought to using it for SD in an emergency). After noting that the pistol was too powerful for SD, Ressler then says what Peairs should have done was get the 12 gauge shotgun he also owned! One reason for preferring the shotgun: the pistol was probably too small for Hattori to notice...:rolleyes::banghead:

If I'd been a juror, what would have stuck to the wall was not the handgun, but the apparent failure to consider any other tactics than yelling "Freeze!" and shooting. YMMV. Similarly, I think if Fish had testified (and brought experts in to testify), he could have established that the 10mm is not just a reasonable but an excellent choice for wilderness defense.

I know it is now lore that "Fish got convicted because of the 10mm", and some "experts" have even advised against the use of "extra-deadly" hollow-points because Fish's prosecutor made hay with that, too--even though the local PD used HPs.

I don't think you have to use what the local PD uses, especially if it doesn't fit your needs or abilities. But I do think that any of us had better be ready to explain all choices that we made, before and during a SD shooting. And if you can't come up with a good reason now, before any shooting, maybe change something.

And by "explain" I mean formal, videotaped statements after consulting with an attorney who is experienced in local SD cases, and with that attorney present.
 
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If you are attacked, as they were, yet the attacker is bringing a knife, or screwdriver to a gunfight, how do you sell that your life was endangered, when you have the gun?
In Ohio, deadly force is deadly force. There's no legal difference between a Glock 18 and a ball peen hammer. If you don't believe it, run at a Cleveland cop with a butcher knife in your hand. It's been tried... with predictable results.

If outside of your home or vehicle, you have a duty to ATTEMPT to withdraw. That doesn't mean that you have to run away, merely that you must attempt to withdraw from the confrontation, IF you can do so IN PERFECT SAFETY. If your assailant thwarts your attempt to withdraw, "sucks to be him".

If in home or vehicle, you have the rebuttable presumption of justification. The prosecution (if there is one), must prove that you DIDN'T have an immediate, reasonable fear of life and limb.

My godsister was stabbed to death by her boyfriend. She's every bit as dead as JFK and John Lennon.
 
Then I suggest you study up on THE LAW what rises to the justification of the use of deadly force.

There is no such thing as "THE LAW". There are 50 states, so there are at least 50 different versions of the law, plus assorted federal statues which may or may not apply in any situation. Other countries have their own laws adding even more versions of "THE LAW".

I do know what "THE LAW" is in Texas regarding the use of force in general and in SD. I had to "study up" on it before I could carry a firearm. Before traveling to other states (such as Arkansas) I will indeed "study up on 'THE LAW'" as it applies IN ARKANSAS. But if I am not in Arkansas, it really doesn't matter what Arkansas law says.
 
Shoot a guy who wants to fistfight and let us know how that works out for you.
You can ask a guy named Tavai... if you know how to hold a seance.

He was one of the first, if not THE first to be shot and killed by a Texan with a credential after shall issue CCW was passed there. He was a large, highly muscular Samoan guy who was in the process of beating to death someone in a vehicle which had been struck in traffic by Tavai's.

The victim followed Tavai's vehicle to get the license number after the driver split (Tavai was a passenger). When both vehicles were stuck in heavy traffic, Tavai exited his vehicle and began savagely beating the victim, inflicting serious head and facial injuries on him. The victim couldn't even get his seatbelt off in order to flee on foot. The victim warned Tavai that if he continued beating him, he'd be shot. Tavai continued and was shot. The victim was of course no-billed.

You need to learn the concept "disparity of force".

If I'm:
  • assaulted by two or more people
  • assaulted by someone significantly larger/stronger/more adept
  • suffer from some sort of impairment that makes me vulnerable

In Ohio, Texas and a lot of other places, I have every right to defend myself with deadly force, provided I wasn't the aggressor.

I periodically hear people talk about "takin' their whippin'" rather than use deadly force. Usually they're somewhere around eighteen years of age, with a mental age of approximately twelve. Occasionally, they're PHYSICALLY older, with the same deficit of maturity and judgment.

I stay away from stupid people and stupid places, especially people who get drunk or high and hit each other and the places where they congregate.

I'm the guy in the family restaurant reading the $125 book on machine guns while he's quietly eating his dinner. If you want to start a fistfight with me under those circumstances, just realize that I don't exist for your amusement, and I have neither the legal duty nor the inclination to entertain you by allowing you to harm me. Nor will I take even the minutest risk to protect you from the consequences of your own actions.

As the doctor in the joke says, "Then don't do that"...
 
And there is an earthen berm to my right.
When I'm attacked by an earthen berm, I'll shoot the earthen berm.

Is the earthen berm acting as my assailant's accomplice?

If not, it's irrelevant to the situation.

You've already stipulated that retreat is impossible.

Ohio law doesn't require me to incur even one IOTA of risk to protect somebody attacking me from the consequences of his own actions.

If I'm not in home or vehicle, he presents a reasonably perceived, credible and immediate danger to life and limb, and I am unable to retreat with NO danger to myself, either from him or from the attempt itself (I have NO duty to jump off of a cliff), then he's toast and it's nobody's fault but HIS.

I'm not in the habit of picking fist (or knife) fights with strangers. If he's coming after me, it's because he's an idiot. I don't play games with idiots. I certainly don't play games that could harm ME with idiots.

This "warning shot" thing is of a kind with the pretzels people tie themselves into trying to condemn the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. It's amazing the number of ALLIED military and civilian casualties some people would have been willing to incur to keep a SINGLE additional Japanese soldier from dying. This is no different.

If you CHOOSE to put me in reasonable, immediate fear of life and limb, the LAST thing on my mind (in fact, it's not on my mind AT ALL) is how to protect YOU. You've made your choice to put me in fear of my life. I'm going to take you at your word. Don't complain to ME about the consequences.
 
It appears that in most jurisdictions, defendants in clear or typical self-defense (SD) cases are not arrested by the police, not charged by the district attorney, not true billed by a grand jury, nor sent to trial.

So SD news reports and case law are based on unclear, unusual cases, where the defender is arrested or otherwise adjudicated by the criminal and/or civil justice system (unlike the 18 yr old young woman and mother in Oklahoma).

What we hear about are the SD cases that went wrong. While it is probably a good idea to be aware of what can go wrong, that seems to ignore all the cases that went right, which is what good strategy ought to be based on.

Excellent post.

On these forums we hear about cases where someone was convicted after an iffy or illegal shoot. Case in Point: The OK pharmacist who killed a wounded and incapacitated robber. We seldom hear of cases where the shooter was not charged: When those cases are brought up there is often very little discussion.

Last year a Comanche county, OK man killed a person in self defense: There were witnesses to the shoot. The shooter left for his out of state job before he was interviewed by the sheriffs dep't: He was gone for a month or two. When the shooter got back home he went to the sheriffs dep't and squared things away. There were no charges.
 
You can ask a guy named Tavai... if you know how to hold a seance.

He was one of the first, if not THE first to be shot and killed by a Texan with a credential after shall issue CCW was passed there. He was a large, highly muscular Samoan guy who was in the process of beating to death someone in a vehicle which had been struck in traffic by Tavai's.

The victim followed Tavai's vehicle to get the license number after the driver split (Tavai was a passenger). When both vehicles were stuck in heavy traffic, Tavai exited his vehicle and began savagely beating the victim, inflicting serious head and facial injuries on him. The victim couldn't even get his seatbelt off in order to flee on foot. The victim warned Tavai that if he continued beating him, he'd be shot. Tavai continued and was shot. The victim was of course no-billed.

You need to learn the concept "disparity of force".

If I'm:
  • assaulted by two or more people
  • assaulted by someone significantly larger/stronger/more adept
  • suffer from some sort of impairment that makes me vulnerable

In Ohio, Texas and a lot of other places, I have every right to defend myself with deadly force, provided I wasn't the aggressor.

I periodically hear people talk about "takin' their whippin'" rather than use deadly force. Usually they're somewhere around eighteen years of age, with a mental age of approximately twelve. Occasionally, they're PHYSICALLY older, with the same deficit of maturity and judgment.

I stay away from stupid people and stupid places, especially people who get drunk or high and hit each other and the places where they congregate.

I'm the guy in the family restaurant reading the $125 book on machine guns while he's quietly eating his dinner. If you want to start a fistfight with me under those circumstances, just realize that I don't exist for your amusement, and I have neither the legal duty nor the inclination to entertain you by allowing you to harm me. Nor will I take even the minutest risk to protect you from the consequences of your own actions.

As the doctor in the joke says, "Then don't do that"...

And this is why each individual faced with learning what is and is not permissable needs to quit wasting time debating it HERE and learn instead the state law of where they reside or plan to carry.

In Arkansas the law is very clear that Demeanor's view WILL result in your prosecution and in the case of someone "just wanting to fight" most likely a conviction if the jury follows the defined justifications set forth in state code.

Again you take the high road as an armed citizen and attempt to avoid all confrontation. But if someone takes it on themselves to do so you can't simply shoot them because its the most convenient solution for you. Or at least not HERE in Ar you can't. Just because you have a gun doesn't mean you can use a gun to solve all your problems

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it's irrelevant to the situation.
No, it is not. One important argument against a "warning shot" is the risk to an unintended human recipient of that shot. The earthen berm minimizes that risk.
Ohio law...
Neither does MA law. If it's only about the law to you, and you plan to open fire as soon as you think O, A, and J are present (or whatever else legally justifies lethal force in your locale), no one can stop you.

I'm sure Peairs thought he was in lethal peril, too. And so I am glad he was spared criminal conviction.
If he's coming after me, it's because he's an idiot
And perhaps Ohio specifies a death sentence for idiocy? I will assume you mean "idiot" figuratively, and do not mean that you are prepared to shoot a mentally challenged individual who you mistakenly thought was attacking you, because he didn't know enough to not "play games" with you.
This "warning shot" thing is of a kind with the pretzels people tie themselves into trying to condemn the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
Hmmm. Well, if you have decided that firing a warning shot is the same as endorsing thousands of additional WWII US GI deaths in the PTO :)confused::eek::confused:), I guess that's that.
the LAST thing on my mind (in fact, it's not on my mind AT ALL) is how to protect YOU.
Actually, I would suggest that the last thing on your mind is that you might be mistaken, or that you might later regret your action. So be it.
 
I can't speak for others, but, if I were sufficiently in fear of being killed or seriously injured, or knew that a family member was about to be,...and that fear was sufficient enough to PRESENT my weapon,...the only warning shots I would fire would be aimed center mass of the threat, and I would continue to "warn",....until the threat is no longer a threat. YMMV
 
As a 75 year old guy in a violent country I am not going to discuss or wrestle with an intruder in the dark. He has broken into my house and threatened my life, not the other way around. 2 shots to center of mass, no statements to the police, and let the lawyers argue about it.
 
Actually, I would suggest that the last thing on your mind is that you might be mistaken, or that you might later regret your action. So be it.
The law in Ohio (and most other places) requires a REASONABLE belief that ones life and limb are in IMMEDIATE, credible danger.

If somebody tries to rob me at "gunpoint" with an airsoft gun that's not readily distinguishable from a real gun and he gets shot, once again "sucks to be him". I was never in any ACTUAL danger of being killed. But I didn't NEED to be. I just need a REASONABLE BELIEF. I don't have ANY duty to demand that my assailant fire a warning shot, or allow me to detail strip his "weapon" to prove CONCLUSIVELY that it's REALLY a firearm. I just need a REASONABLE BELIEF based on the totality of the circumstances that I'm in mortal danger.

If people are SO determined to protect their ASSAILANT, they need to just not carry or use firearms. That will COMPLETELY eliminate the "danger" that you might shoot some jackass who's a blowhard or carrying a toy gun.

Of course I've seen it argued that even a REAL firearm and a REAL threat of death or great bodily harm are NOT justifications for using deadly force, since you don't REALLY know that he means to kill you until he DOES. And besides THAT, how do you know you'll really DIE, even if he shoots you in the head.

As I said, when somebody willfully puts my life in danger, their safety is not only of LOW priority, it's of NO priority.

Don't like that? Then don't put me in reasonable fear of life and limb.

A Brit once told me that women shouldn't be allowed to carry guns for self-defense because he was "afraid that he'd be mistaken for a rapist and shot". My reply:

"How is it that you act around women that you're afraid that you'll be 'mistaken' for a rapist?

Put down that butcher knife, pull up your pants, and you'll be just fine."

If you don't want to be shot, try not working so hard to make reasonable people think you NEED to be shot.

And no, I'm not EVER going to regret NOT letting a violent assailant kill or maim me or a family member.
 
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