Watching Red Dawn...

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The logistics of an invasion of the United States are incredibly tough. But in the opening, the film did explain some of it.

-Mexico is plunged into revolution. Nothing but chaos down there, and Communist insurgents

-Cuba and Nicaragua reach troop strengths of 50,000

-NATO dissolves as Greens Party takes over in West Germany

-Europe (except for Britain) sits the war out

-Soviet nuclear missiles are more accurate than we had thought; a well-timed sneak attack destroys most of our silos and apparently prevents a full retaliation. Even if we did hit a few Russian cities or military bases, it wouldn't stop their war machine

-The Soviets used a lot of their nukes on China.

-Infiltrators came up from the southern border and wreaked havoc at SAC bases in the Southwestern US, further impairing our ability to counterattack

-The US and the UK then face, by themselves, the combined forces of the USSR, Cuba, Nicaragua, and all of the Soviet Satellite states. We've been caught off guard, nuked, repeatedly, and the Soviets have only suffered a minor nuclear retaliation in response.


Still impossible to mout a successful invasion, I think. Lincoln once said that all of the armies of Europe and Asia combined couldn't by force take a drink from the Missouri River (or something to that effect), and he was probably right. The sheer size and population of the United States would make a sustained occupation impossible, but that wasn't necessarily the Soviets' Goal. Easier would be to invade, knock us out as a world power, and have a few occupational forces in a few places to make sure we don't reorganize and start building a military that can threaten the USSR. Then, the suriving Americans could probably just starve and fight amongst themselves, for all the Soviets cared. (If they were really smart, they'd fund agitator groups to keep the Americans fighting amongst themselves and from uniting to rebuild.)

Still, made for an interesting movie. :cool:
 
The HIND helicopter...I'm really wondering where they got that. It's obviously an older one, with the flat nose (instead of the later models, with the trademark double-bubble canopies), but still; where do you get a HIND in the mid 80s? Was it just a mock-up? They did a good job on it if it was (even got that exaust port on each side in the right spot).

That wasn't a mock-up, it was the real thing. I've seen it before- the Army owns it- for those of you who have been to JRTC, the OPFOR guys down there fly a few Russian helicopters, including a Hind and a Hip. Don't know where it came from, I do know that the mechanic I talked to had an unusual accent.

Not sure if "Hind-A" is the right designation for it, tho. There wasn't really any difference in the A & D models. One was made just for the Soviets, and as I understand all the labeling of the cockpit and instruments was in cyrillic- the other was made for "export"(so to speak) and the lettering was in English. Other than that, I believe they were the same.

Those things are baaaaaaad! They have three modes of targeting: air-to-air, air-to-ground (stationary) and air-to-ground (mobile).

ANM
 
Abominable No-Man, did you read M2 Carbine's post earlier in this thread?

RE: what the helicopters really were? ;)
 
Aww, hell........... I hate it when I f*** up........no, I guess I totally skipped over M2's post. I didn't know that at all, and I wouldn't have spouted off what turned out to be an urban myth if I did.

Oh, well, ain't the first time I've been wrong, won't be the last.

But, FWIW, some of you guys that have been to Ft Polk, help me out here......please?

Humbly yours.......

ANM
 
If that's a Puma, then either they didn't use a Puma in the movie, or the picture is reversed, because the Puma has the tail rotor on one side but the Hinds have the rotor on the other side.
 
They are Pumas in the movie.

The movie "Hind's" TR is on the right side.

If you look close at the Red Dawn Hinds you can see the landing gear housings under the stub wings.

The PHI pilots were
Scott Wead
Clay Wright
Jim Ballard
and Tom Gehrke ( I think that's how it's spelled)

Scott was a company check pilot.
He gave me my Bell 206L checkout in the early 70's.

:D My first time in the L Model I did better autorotations than he did.
After that, he never again touched the controls when he was giving me a check ride.:D
 
I don't know who did that "face lift", if it was PHI maintenance or outside contractors. Maybe a little of each.
They did look pretty good.

I'll bet just the paperwork was a job to get through.

PHI didn't own the Pumas. They were on a long term multi million dollar lease because of drilling in Mexican waters.
The Mexican government left PHI (and others) holding the bag.

:D I made points with the president of PHI when I asked him, "What dumb ass would sign a long term many million dollar lease, believing the Mexican government would keep it's word. He should be fired."

The president said, "I had to sign the lease or we wouldn't get the contracts."

I said, "You haven't got the contracts and the company owes millions."

I don't think he really liked me.:D


Ya, the pilots said those birds were a bugger to fly.


We lost at least 2 Pumas in the Gulf of Mexico.
One with transmission failure and one was landing on an offshore drilling rig and was hit by a crane and went over the side. Over a hundred foot fall to the water. 19 dead as I recall.

Sorry, wandering off the subject.
 
Nightcrawler, I believe that is an E model. It has cannons fixed on the side rather than the four barreled 12.7mm in a turret.
 
The last picture shows a Hind-F. The D and E were basically the same, except the E had better night-fighting sensors.

The first two pics are of a Hind-A. Variants from the D onwards all had the new cockpit, only the A had the bulky side-by-side cockpit.

There are quite a few different variants of the Hind, and they are still in production, even today! :D (I think the latest version is the M variant, but that isn't completely certain)

Jeremy
 
I can't believe, with all this talk of Red Dawn, that no one pointed out that it was the first on-screen pairing of Jennifer Grey & Patrick Swayze, who went on to make movie magic in "Dirty Dancing".:rolleyes:

Jeesh guys, this little shoot-em-up led to such great things and we're just focused on guns & copters!! Tsk Tsk!!

hehe.
 
I can't believe, with all this talk of Red Dawn, that no one pointed out that it was the first on-screen pairing of Jennifer Grey & Patrick Swayze, who went on to make movie magic in "Dirty Dancing".

And I've spent many years trying to FORGET their second pairing...:barf:


My favorite Swayze movies are Roadhouse and Next of Kin (mess w/ a hillbilly--& his family will come a'callin' :evil: ). But Red Dawn comes in a close third.

I really need to add RD to my DVD collection...:cool:

TRIVIA: In Roadhouse, which combat/cowboy movie veteran was Swayze's co-star? :scrutiny:
 
The OPFOR guys at Ft Polk JRTC have Hind-Ds, a couple, IIRC. Also some smaller one, don't remember the designation. Maybe an Mi-8/15 as well.

NTc at Ft Irwin and CMTC at Hohenfels use mocked up Hueys as Hinds.
 
IIRC The U.S. Army obtained a few more Hinds during GW1 and the 90's as a whole. I believe that both NTC and JRTC have Mi-24s and -8's in the inventory. Also did anyone else notice the trooper with his reserve deployed in M2's newspaper clipping? Seems his main is fine yet there is the white reserve. wonder why he deployed it?
 
Could be his reserve malfunctioned, but he probably just counts too fast and chickened out!
 
I'll ask RedDawn if he remembers what happened with that chute.

I think he said these jumpers had all levels of experience.
 
the DVD also has an original trailer, which shows a few scenes not in (probably cut) the movie...

great movie though...bought it at WalMart on DVD as soon as I saw it.

DB
 
on the train rolling through town at the end, there's a WWII vintage German 37mm towed AT gun on one fo the flatcars...

not to mention the B-58A "Stores package" (the thing that looks like "THe Mother of all drop tanks" it takes up a whole flatcar and is almost as high as the Boxcars) that i THINK was on the car imediately preceeding the above mentioned AT gun. i wanna know where and WHY they dug THAT thing up to put on the train??

sheesh i hope i'm not the ONLY aviation nut who knew/knows what that monster was :D
 
If they were really smart, they'd fund agitator groups to keep the Americans fighting amongst themselves and from uniting to rebuild.)

They do, "tree hugging hippie liberals", "NAACP", "VPC", "MMM" just to name a few.

Great movie.................
 
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