What is the future of revolvers?
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Zaydok Allen
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I don't necessarily think there'll be any major innovations in revolver design, because what could they do really. I supposed they could totally redesign it to place the cylinder in front of the hand, and completely lower the bore axis with the hand. That would greatly lengthen the guns overall though.
I think we will see more innovations and availability of cartridge selection. With more and more people carrying, recoil sensitive folks will want more revolver options in 32 caliber rounds like 327 fed, and 32 H&R mag. You may even see some extremely recoil sensitive folks wanting some warm 32 S&W Long's, like Buffalo Bore produces.
You may see improvements in triggers also, like the LCR, to aid in new carriers learning curve.
I think we will see more innovations and availability of cartridge selection. With more and more people carrying, recoil sensitive folks will want more revolver options in 32 caliber rounds like 327 fed, and 32 H&R mag. You may even see some extremely recoil sensitive folks wanting some warm 32 S&W Long's, like Buffalo Bore produces.
You may see improvements in triggers also, like the LCR, to aid in new carriers learning curve.
BobWright
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"IF IT AIN'T BROKE, DON'T FIX IT"
Bob Wright
Bob Wright
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That has been done with the Mateba MTR-8
I really hope the .327 Federal catches on the second time around. I don't personally have one but I do have revolvers in 32 S&W Long and 32 H&R Mag. Both are fun to shoot. The range of power levels available for a .327 is fantastic.
A very common sentiment and one that will lead to the continued decline in the popularity of revolvers. Once the generation passes that grew up watching western and old cop movies the popularity will drop of a cliff.
Similar to muzzleloaders but without the boost that comes from have muzzleloader only hunting seasons.
There's not a lot of innovation in pocket-knives, hand screwdrivers, or hammers, yet they continue to sell and always will. There's refinement and sometimes some upgrades in materials, but not fundamental changes or great leaps forward. I think the same is true of revolvers (and bolt-action rifles, and break-action shotguns), and that's okay.
Sam1911
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As the Mateba above demonstrates, though, once you get to the pinnacle of improved ergonomics, and the most efficient positioning of controls, and you start to come down the other side of the peak, you're moving away from perfection in the name of innovation and trying something new.
Sure, low bore axis is cool. But now the cylinder has to be in front of the trigger. And that means the gun is long, but has a short barrel. Putting even a 6" barrel on it would make a monstrous long, heavy, and muzzle-heavy weapon, that no one would desire to shoot if they've got to choose between that and a 6" K- or N-frame or Python.
(To say nothing of what that trigger linkage now has to look like to advance the cylinder and fire the gun.)
Humans like to think that we're on an ever-rising march to perfection and that we can make anything better. Maybe that's true, but when you've got all the "bugs" worked out of an idea and several generations have passed each applying their tweaks and improvements in increasingly subtle and less "revolutionary" ways, it stands to reason that some pinnacle is being approached ... or maybe has been crossed ... where further refinements are minute indeed.
And that holds until something truly world-changing comes along which either sweeps that technological accomplishment (e.g.: revolvers) into a wildly new evolution, or sweeps them along with a lot of other things into the realm of the archaic.
Sure, low bore axis is cool. But now the cylinder has to be in front of the trigger. And that means the gun is long, but has a short barrel. Putting even a 6" barrel on it would make a monstrous long, heavy, and muzzle-heavy weapon, that no one would desire to shoot if they've got to choose between that and a 6" K- or N-frame or Python.
(To say nothing of what that trigger linkage now has to look like to advance the cylinder and fire the gun.)
Humans like to think that we're on an ever-rising march to perfection and that we can make anything better. Maybe that's true, but when you've got all the "bugs" worked out of an idea and several generations have passed each applying their tweaks and improvements in increasingly subtle and less "revolutionary" ways, it stands to reason that some pinnacle is being approached ... or maybe has been crossed ... where further refinements are minute indeed.
And that holds until something truly world-changing comes along which either sweeps that technological accomplishment (e.g.: revolvers) into a wildly new evolution, or sweeps them along with a lot of other things into the realm of the archaic.
BobWright
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JSH1 said:
Notice that two of those revolvers I posted are Single Action revolvers, with grip designs that date back to 1847~1851. The steel has been improved, the sights improved, the cartridges improved, but the overall design has remained unchanged. The guns are wood and steel. (O.K. the Ruger had some alloy parts, but this was quickly corrected.)
The "improved" Revolver shown, with its cylinder in front of the trigger, has increased in length but kept a very short barrel. Put a decent length barrel on that gun, and length gets to the point of being unweildy. Make that in a decent big bore caliber and from observation, even greater stress in recoil points will increase the weight.
No other design lends itself to fitting the gun with ivory, stag, exotic wood, gold or silver inlay, and fine engraving.
As long as there are men who appreaciate beautiful, accurate and powerful revolvers, the Colt inspired Single Action will be around.
Bob Wright
Notice that two of those revolvers I posted are Single Action revolvers, with grip designs that date back to 1847~1851. The steel has been improved, the sights improved, the cartridges improved, but the overall design has remained unchanged. The guns are wood and steel. (O.K. the Ruger had some alloy parts, but this was quickly corrected.)
The "improved" Revolver shown, with its cylinder in front of the trigger, has increased in length but kept a very short barrel. Put a decent length barrel on that gun, and length gets to the point of being unweildy. Make that in a decent big bore caliber and from observation, even greater stress in recoil points will increase the weight.
No other design lends itself to fitting the gun with ivory, stag, exotic wood, gold or silver inlay, and fine engraving.
As long as there are men who appreaciate beautiful, accurate and powerful revolvers, the Colt inspired Single Action will be around.
Bob Wright
Not quite the same. Pocket knives are the semi-autos of the knife world. Before the folding pocket knife was invented people carried fixed blade knives. Now the vast majority of people that carry a knife carry a folding knife instead of a fixed blade.
Folding Knife = Semi-Auto
Fixed Blade = Revolver.
BobWright
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Ah, but the vast majority of folks who use a knife use a fixed blade knife.
Bob Wright
Bob Wright
My point is that the number of people that appreciate revolvers is steadily declining.
There are lots of things that traditionalists didn't believe could be improved upon. Then someone comes out with a different design and takes over the market. Will that happen with revolvers? I doubt it because most of the people that still like revolvers hate the idea of changing anything about the look of a revolver. This causes development to stop and then the product slowly dies out along with the traditionalists.
I personally like revolvers and no longer own any semi-autos. As someone in my 30's that makes me a very odd duck.
Sam1911
Moderator Emeritus
Yeah, that might be carrying the analogy out beyond the point where it stays relevant.
But to play along...
The fixed blade knife, maybe like the revolver, is now pretty much what it has been for a very long time. We've improved it, and some folks will tell you that their special combination of steels and handle materials, and shape and blade contour, and sheath, etc., makes the fixed-blade knife they're selling substantively different that anything before. And of course, that's 95% total crap.
With folding knives, maybe like autos, we've come up with some pretty nifty improvements. 17 different ways to lock the blade open, for example. Every one being, of course, better than any of the others. But when we took it to the next level (let's say automatic knives) we ended up with something that's more ... nifty ... than necessary, or even desirable for most people. I'd say that's going beyond the pinnacle of perfecting the concept and starting to head down the far side of the development curve.
So what's left for knives? Will we ever see the next great thing? Sure. When we have some kind of controlled cutting beam technology or energy blade or something similar to micro-light saber. And then we'll have what I alluded to before: "something truly world-changing comes along which either sweeps that technological accomplishment into a wildly new evolution, or sweeps them ... into the realm of the archaic."
But to play along...
The fixed blade knife, maybe like the revolver, is now pretty much what it has been for a very long time. We've improved it, and some folks will tell you that their special combination of steels and handle materials, and shape and blade contour, and sheath, etc., makes the fixed-blade knife they're selling substantively different that anything before. And of course, that's 95% total crap.
With folding knives, maybe like autos, we've come up with some pretty nifty improvements. 17 different ways to lock the blade open, for example. Every one being, of course, better than any of the others. But when we took it to the next level (let's say automatic knives) we ended up with something that's more ... nifty ... than necessary, or even desirable for most people. I'd say that's going beyond the pinnacle of perfecting the concept and starting to head down the far side of the development curve.
So what's left for knives? Will we ever see the next great thing? Sure. When we have some kind of controlled cutting beam technology or energy blade or something similar to micro-light saber. And then we'll have what I alluded to before: "something truly world-changing comes along which either sweeps that technological accomplishment into a wildly new evolution, or sweeps them ... into the realm of the archaic."
Corpral_Agarn
Member
Sadly, I think that the future of revolvers is Pocket carry, competition (to fit in a specific class), Hunting (for magnums cartridges) and nostalgia (my dad/granddad had one of these).
That is really not very many shooters total. Somebody posted earlier 10% of the market. I think it will be less than that.
I think that the days of the mid/full sized combat revolver are nearing an end.
That is really not very many shooters total. Somebody posted earlier 10% of the market. I think it will be less than that.
I think that the days of the mid/full sized combat revolver are nearing an end.
I'm 34. I like my SP101 more than the 1911 I had before, and my wife likes it far more. The simplicity, predictability, and ease-of-use are all excellent, and I like how I can load it with mild .38 Special for the range all the way up to .357 Magnum hollowpoints when camping.
rWt
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"Sadly, I think that the future of revolvers is Pocket carry, competition (to fit in a specific class), Hunting (for magnums cartridges) and nostalgia (my dad/granddad had one of these).
That is really not very many shooters total. Somebody posted earlier 10% of the market. I think it will be less than that.
I think that the days of the mid/full sized combat revolver are nearing an end."
Corpral_Agarn
I concur with the above. Especially if ammunition development allows for shorter/smaller rounds that carry increased lethality from smaller revolvers. What if the .32 could perform at the level of today's .380 from a small revolver? Would it become the replacement for the S&W 642 ( and the 38 Special) that everyone could shoot well? Can the revolver be made to shoot well as easily as the semi-auto?
That is really not very many shooters total. Somebody posted earlier 10% of the market. I think it will be less than that.
I think that the days of the mid/full sized combat revolver are nearing an end."
Corpral_Agarn
I concur with the above. Especially if ammunition development allows for shorter/smaller rounds that carry increased lethality from smaller revolvers. What if the .32 could perform at the level of today's .380 from a small revolver? Would it become the replacement for the S&W 642 ( and the 38 Special) that everyone could shoot well? Can the revolver be made to shoot well as easily as the semi-auto?
walnut1704
Member
I walked into a Bass Pro today and did notice they had one case of revolvers, and three cases of semi-autos.
I don't think the "obsolete" argument holds water. What is probably the most popular semi-auto is over 100 years old. Certainly the 1911 is archaic and obsolete compared to more modern designs. It manages to maintain it's popularity.
Ammunition capacity doesn't sway me. It's highly unlikely you will ever use your weapon in a defensive situation. It's even more unlikely you'll need more than 2-3 rounds.
The revolver market is segmenting though. The range-rat sport shooters who own multiple guns have gone to semi-autos en mass. Now it's 2" .38's for pocket / self-defense and Magnums for those that want or need power. There's not a lot in the middle of the road like there used to be.
What's dying off is the 4"-6" .38/.357 that guys used to buy to have fun with on the weekends and maybe keep in the nightstand. Now instead of a K-38 or a Model 15 they have a Glock or an M&P.
The hunters will keep the big Magnums alive. The general populous will still be drawn to 2" .38's for their simplicity. You'll know it's over when Ruger discontinues the Blackhawk.
I don't think the "obsolete" argument holds water. What is probably the most popular semi-auto is over 100 years old. Certainly the 1911 is archaic and obsolete compared to more modern designs. It manages to maintain it's popularity.
Ammunition capacity doesn't sway me. It's highly unlikely you will ever use your weapon in a defensive situation. It's even more unlikely you'll need more than 2-3 rounds.
The revolver market is segmenting though. The range-rat sport shooters who own multiple guns have gone to semi-autos en mass. Now it's 2" .38's for pocket / self-defense and Magnums for those that want or need power. There's not a lot in the middle of the road like there used to be.
What's dying off is the 4"-6" .38/.357 that guys used to buy to have fun with on the weekends and maybe keep in the nightstand. Now instead of a K-38 or a Model 15 they have a Glock or an M&P.
The hunters will keep the big Magnums alive. The general populous will still be drawn to 2" .38's for their simplicity. You'll know it's over when Ruger discontinues the Blackhawk.
GDownRange
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If a company produced a 5 shot .32 that was considerably smaller than an LCR I'd buy it today. (72 hours from today)
There may have been historical 5 shot .32's, but I don't think there are any modern designs available. Would that qualify as a change in the future of revolvers?
There may have been historical 5 shot .32's, but I don't think there are any modern designs available. Would that qualify as a change in the future of revolvers?
Driftwood Johnson
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Howdy
Interesting thread.
Personally, I don't really care what the future development of revolvers is. I doubt I'll be buying any anyway.
Just this year I bought the first brand-spanky new S&W that I have bought in 40 years. A seven shot Model 686. I bought it on a whim, the price was right and I thought 'why not'. Doubt if I will be buying any more brand new Smiths. Just can't get into MIM parts and the lower quality that Smith is putting out now.
Interesting thread.
Personally, I don't really care what the future development of revolvers is. I doubt I'll be buying any anyway.
Just this year I bought the first brand-spanky new S&W that I have bought in 40 years. A seven shot Model 686. I bought it on a whim, the price was right and I thought 'why not'. Doubt if I will be buying any more brand new Smiths. Just can't get into MIM parts and the lower quality that Smith is putting out now.
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Pelo801
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I think I'm doing my part to keep the next generation interested in wheel guns. I'm in my 40's and my daughter (who's 7), comes in asking which gun she gets when I die. I open up the safe and let her pick. Guess what she picked? Ruger Blackhawk in 45 colt.
Driftwood Johnson
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WHAT???
I have carried a Swiss Army knife in my pocket ever since college. Don't ask when that was. Seldom is there a day that goes by when I don't take it out and use it for something.
Driftwood Johnson
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There is nothing new under the sun.
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Zaydok Allen
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Ah, sure enough. I am a little ashamed that this is the first time I've ever seen one of these.That has been done with the Mateba MTR-8
I really hope the .327 Federal catches on the second time around. I don't personally have one but I do have revolvers in 32 S&W Long and 32 H&R Mag. Both are fun to shoot. The range of power levels available for a .327 is fantastic.
theotherwaldo
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I think that the biggest change for firearms in general will be better sights in a lower, more holsterable profile. When you are responsible for every round coming out of your barrel then you want the best sights possible - especially when you have either a short sight radius on your pocket gun or massive recoil from your magnum.
Mateba made several odd revolvers in the 80's and 90's. The owner was the man that designed the Chiappa Rhino but he died before it reached production.
Here is a Mateba 2006M. It has the benefit of the low barrel but without the strange grip to trigger relationship of the Rhino.
Here is a Mateba 2006M. It has the benefit of the low barrel but without the strange grip to trigger relationship of the Rhino.
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