What is your CCW Status?

[SkyDaver]

Simon76 and Molon Labe, I have to disagree. I'm not willing to go all or nothing on re-gaining gun rights. I'm not willing to risk all that I've worked for, nor to put my family through the hassle of fighting for my 2nd Amendment rights in a court of law. There are lots of people with guns and badges that will make my life hell if caught breaking some of these laws.

I would like to say that I have the fortitude to get arrested for violating an unconstitutional law, and to fight it to the point where the Supremes grant ceritori, or not, but I don't. If you do, more power to you. Let me know when it happens.

I am willing to fight for my rights with the soapbox, ballot box, jury box. By going through the CCW process, we marginalize the nut job gun grabbers, and whittle away at their claims.

And, with respect, Molon Labe, I think you have it backwards. Claiming that your 2nd amendment rights are inalienable, and getting a CCW is more like being a carnivore, but eating tofu when the cost of steak is too high ;-)

 

[Simon76]

I am willing to fight for my rights with the soapbox, ballot box, jury box.

You forgot the most important of the box-style voting tools: The cartridge box.

You're a sheep, plain and simple. Sorry to have to tell you that, but between every line on your post all I heard was Baaahhhh, Baahhhh, Baaahhhh!!.

May your chains rest lightly upon you.

Simon.

(I suspect the carnivore is eating tofu because he LET someone KICK his teeth out, and that's about ALL he can eat. Or all his blessed Socialist World Order will LET HIM eat.).

 

[SkyDaver]

I am moderately sure that I was not insulting in my post. If I was, I apologize, right here. That was not my intent.

We agree on the ultimate goal, but disagree on the tactics for getting there. That's OK by me.

Now, here's what would have been insulting.

<incoherent rant>
So, Simon76, when are you going to get yourself arrested for illegal CCW so that you can get all of the gunlaws in the country overturned?

What, you haven't done it yet? Oh, I guess you must be a coward.
</incoherent rant>

 

[Igloodude]

Expired CCW in Alaska (because I moved to Vermont), now current resident CCW in NH, and looking around to see how to get a non-resident one in Mass. I might get a FL non-resident one soon as well, but it isn't a priority.

 

[Molon Labe]

SkyDaver: If you want to get a CCW permit, fine. But do not claim you have a right to keep and bear arms. From here on out, you must insist it is a privilege, not a right. Also, do not claim you will "fight for freedom" when the balloon goes up. If you do not have the courage to stand up to these minor infringements on our liberty, you certainly won't have the courage to fight when we’re up against full-scale tyranny.

I'm not willing to risk all that I've worked for, nor to put my family through the hassle of fighting for my 2nd Amendment rights in a court of law. There are lots of people with guns and badges that will make my life hell if caught breaking some of these laws.

We should all get down on our knees and thank God the minutemen of 1776 did not share your attitude.

 

[Molon Labe]

So, Simon76, when are you going to get yourself arrested for illegal CCW so that you can get all of the gunlaws in the country overturned?

What, you haven't done it yet? Oh, I guess you must be a coward.

Only an idiot would make it their goal to get arrested (e.g. Rick Stanley). A courageous person will simply (and peacefully) ignore unconstitutional & immoral laws.

 

[SkyDaver]

Molon Labe,

Are you willing and prepared to suffer the consequences if you get caught violated the laws that we both agree are unconstitutional and immoral?

What are you doing to get them overturned?

Any chances you can continue this discussion without insults?

Only an idiot would take on superior force head on. Getting these laws overturned requires maneuver warfare, not set piece battles.

Read Sun-Tzu, and Robert Boyd.

Simon76,

Have you seen enough support that you're ready to answer the call of the minutemen? There needs to be a certain critical mass of support .... just like there was in 1775.

You have no idea what I will do if the balloon goes up. To read your descriptions, the balloon is up. Why aren't you out there fighting?

Last time I checked, the minutemen were not alone. They may have been outnumbered, but not alone.

 

[Molon Labe]

Are you willing and prepared to suffer the consequences if you get caught violated the laws that we both agree are unconstitutional and immoral?

Of course. For more information, go to www.dictionary.com and look up the word "courage".

What are you doing to get them overturned?

The usual... I’m a lifetime member of the GOA, I write my representatives, etc. etc. etc.

Any chances you can continue this discussion without insults?

To insult is "to treat with gross insensitivity, insolence, or contemptuous rudeness." Please point out where I've treated you with gross insensitivity, insolence, or contemptuous rudeness.

Only an idiot would take on superior force head on.

Tell that to the Vietnamese.

 

[SkyDaver]

To insult is "to treat with gross insensitivity, insolence, or contemptuous rudeness." Please point out where I've treated you with gross insensitivity, insolence, or contemptuous rudeness.

Your posts of 11:01, and 11:09 qualify.

Tell that to the Vietnamese.

I'm not a student of the Vietnam war, but I didn't think that the Viet Cong or North Vietnamese engaged directly very often, and I didn't think that they did very well when they did.

SkyDaver: If you want to get a CCW permit, fine. But do not claim you have a right to keep and bear arms. From here on out, you must insist it is a privilege, not a right. Also, do not claim you will "fight for freedom" when the balloon goes up. If you do not have the courage to stand up to these minor infringements on our liberty, you certainly won't have the courage to fight when we’re up against full-scale tyranny.

I know that I don't have the resources to get through a court fight. Lacking those resources, I know I would fail, and gun owners would not have received any benefit from a quixotic stand.

You have chosen your risk, and I have chosen mine.

You may have the last word. I'll no longer participate in this thread.

Please tell us when your all or nothing approach gets one of these laws overturned.

 

[mountainclmbr]

I personally don't like the situation where law-abiding citizens have to get a "permit" to carry CCW, but the crooks are assumed to carry and get light sentence increases for having a firearm in the commission of a crime. I am sure I would get a longer sentence being a non-convict and non license holder than a criminal that has a concealed weapon. It is the government expectations and it is wrong.

I got a permit because I don't want to face the consequences of not having one and being caught. I don't morally disagree with those that CCW anyway. I just don't agree that I have given up my future rights because I got a permit. Liberty has been swinging in the wrong direction for many years. It seems to have turned around (see VT and AK) and is swinging in the other direction. When the time is right, the second ammendment should be reworded and the constitution ammended to show very clearly that the Bill of Rights strictly limits government power and any politicians that tread on individual rights are under certain threat of a life prison sentence or worse for treason. That is my rant for tonight. Good night all.

 

[S_O_Laban]

Sorry to break up the current thread hijack.....

I live in a state (MO) that is shall issuse but I am unable to get a licence because the county I live in has refused to comply with the law becuase of a technicality on funding. Thus I have two OOS permits which are valid here in Mo... PA and FL, G-d bless them

 

[Edward429451]

I'm with Molon Labe and Simon on this one. Never had it, never will. It's just a matter of resolve. Everyone knows its correct, people draw their lines in the sand in different places.

Maybe the nation will go the way of AK or VT. Fat chance. What if it doesn't? There'll be more lines drawn then. Some of us here will turn them in when they say to and some of us wont. Some will continue to scoff at us constitutional purists, some will stand with us.

We're all in this together though. We shouldn't beat on each other over it. There sure is a lot of division here on the so called high road. I find it odd that us types who ccw quasi illeagally and state our position get taken to task for it, and yet when the leo's get on here and ha-ha I can carry anywhere cuz I'm leo...literally laughing in your faces...no one finds anythng wrong with that...Hmmm. I sense a wrongness there.

Divide and conquer is almost complete.

 

[SkyDaver]

Edward429451 wrote:

We're all in this together though. We shouldn't beat on each other over it. There sure is a lot of division here on the so called high road. I find it odd that us types who ccw quasi illeagally and state our position get taken to task for it, and yet when the leo's get on here and ha-ha I can carry anywhere cuz I'm leo...literally laughing in your faces...no one finds anythng wrong with that...Hmmm. I sense a wrongness there.

I had intended to stay out of this, but Edward's post was too reasonable to let pass.

I never intended to excoriate anyone who choses NOT to get the CCW permit, but carries anyway. You make your choice, and more power to you. My choice was to try to push back a bit at a time, and getting the permit was a push.

I agree with Edward very much about the LEO nationwide carry. I resent that they get this, and I can't recall any LEO or retired LEO writing anything to the effect of "Good, now we can work on getting nationwide carry for everyone"

I did not speak up against it, however, having decided that it could be another incremental push back.

 

[aguyindallas]

Texas CHL, carrying daily.

I am considering picking up another state so I can carry while in Ohio.