What is your experience with the P3AT?

[RonJon]

The "intended purpose" of a self-defense handgun is first and formost to be totally reliable. You are staking your life on its reliability.

Therefore, I don't believe that the Keltec handguns serve their "intended purpose"

I'll stick with S&W thank you!

 

[Wilson 17&26]

Henry Ford made Model Ts affordable and to fill a need. My Granddad said in his day, everyone knew how to work on a Model T because something always needed fixing but at least they had transportation.

Kel-Tec turns out well over 1,000 pistols a week with only a couple of dozen employees. Their guns are simple, inexpensive, and lightweight for concealment with no hand finishing that I can see. Hand fitting and finishing would likely add 30-50% to these $210 (NIB gunshow price) pistols. There’s also a lifetime warranty to the first owner, so fire several hundred rounds before carrying it to be sure it’s a 100%. They fill a need for folks that can’t afford or don’t want to pay $300-900 for a pocket pistol.

When the numbers are posted for 2005, I bet you find Kel-Tec will have produced more pocket pistols than all other manufactures combined. It’s a pocket pistol for the common man/woman.

Do I hear an Amen

 

[rhkirk1]

AMEN Brother Wilson!

 

[RonJon]

To borrow a quote from the Brownells catalog, "It's unwise to pay too much...but it's worse to pay too little. If you pay too much, you lose a little money...that is all. When you pay too little, you sometimes lose everything, because the thing you bought was incapable of doing the thing it was bought to do. The common law of business balance prohibits paying a little and getting a lot. It can't be done. If you deal with the lowest bidder, it is well to add something for the risk you run. And if you do that, you will have enough to pay for something better." - John Ruskin

 

[Wilson 17&26]

Let me see if I understand John Ruskin. If an individual of modest means had saved $220 at $20 per month they should not purchase a Kel-Tec but should continue to save, for another 34 months, then buy a Rohrbaugh. I believe that Mr. Ruskin has failed to consider that a couple of sheets, of different grits, of sandpaper and an hour of the purchasers time can make 98% of the Kel-Tec pistols function as well as the hand finished Rohrbaugh pistol. The warranty can take care of the other 2% in far far less than 34 months. I also believe that Mr. Ruskin has ignored the risk to life and property that would be incurred during the intervening time.

Most P-3ATs work perfectly out of the box but there are exceptions. You may find this hard to believe but even some $900 Rohrbaugh pistols have problems. I would bet it’s about 2% like most manufactures.

John Ruskin’s argument might make good sense if you could afford to buy any pocket pistol you wanted. I enjoy tinkering with my guns but I could never bring myself to totally dissemble a $900 pistol. I guess I just don’t have John Ruskin’s money

 

[Lonestar.45]

I'd rather spend $250 on a gun and have to send it back to the factory than $900 and still have to send it back. From what I hear, the Rohrbaughs are finicky and prone to issues as are all pocket sized guns. Once I found the ammo my 3AT likes, it has been issue free.

I spent $420 on my SA Champion GI and it has been hiccup free. I have a friend with a Kimber Ultra CDP, spent $1,000 on it, and has had all kinds of issues. Money spent does not necessarily guarantee reliability, not by a longshot.

 

[imas]

I am putting NAA Guardian 32 on the list first. Then comes the P3AT and then the Rohrbaugh.

I don't mind tinkering with the Rohrbaugh. It seems to be an excellent gun. After looking at the quality of the Rohrbaugh $900 doesn't seem out of line. Most comparable quality 1911's cost a similar amount of money. They also come off the line tight and need a little breaking in. Most of the Rohrbaughs are perfect after being broken in. A few have had FTF issues but those issues can be easily resolved.

Same story with the P3AT. I will break it in and see how its shooting. Then make adjustments if needed.

Also sometimes you really do get what you pay for. Most of the time a $1000 gun really is nicer than a $400 gun. The key in that sentence is "most of the time" not "always."

 

[P. Plainsman]

The fact remains that most people can carry a J-frame revolver without a problem. That is a mighty small, light, efficient defense gun. S&W often has 642s on sale for less than $350, NIB. Practice ammo is cheaper in .38 Special than .380 ACP, too.

The 642 is a wonderful design. It gives you a fully reliable, nicely finished pocket gun that can hit quite a bit harder than any .380 -- the 158 gr .38+P lead semiwadcutter hollowpoint is a serious defense round; so is that new Speer 135 gr .38+P Gold Dot round.

The case for the snubby revolver over the P3AT seems extremely strong. I just don't see why most shooters would bother with the latter.

I agree that if you're both on a tight budget and need extremely deep concealment, the little guns might make sense. But most people don't need that extreme level of concealment. Just slip a 15 oz J-frame in your pants/coat pocket and no one will know.

 

[RonJon]

To P. Plainsman...

Amen!! ...and well said too!

 

[procomps]

My 2nd gen. NIB P-3AT gave me a few problems with the first box of ammo, WWB flat-nosed FMJ. I did a F&B, and about 300 rounds later it has been flawless with everything I have put through it. I prefer Remington UMC FMJ for practice because it does cycle smoother than the WWB, but I also like Blazers. I have had no trouble with JHPs including XTPs, Gold-Dots, or Hydro-Shocks, but prefer Remington 88gr JHPs ($16/100 @ WM) due to the price factor. I am anxiously awaiting the Corbon DPX test results and impending availability.

I did put a Hogue Handall Jr. (see http://www.ktog.org/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi?board=104;action=display;num=1128210598 ), and Bersa finger extensions on mine. I carry it every waking hour in a pocket holster. For those non-waking hours, I have a Taurus 24/7 9mm 17+1 TAP FPD in my nightstand.

 

[MR.G]

About 400 rounds through a first generation P-3AT without a problem. Did do a f&b before ever shooting it. I would like to find a better built gun that is as thin and light as the P-3AT. Until then it will be the P-3AT.

 

[0007]

Sorry, but when you are on the slim-build side, the S&W model 36 prints no matter where you put it on the person including an IWB holster. I just picked up a P3AT. Because I can stuff it my back jeans-pocket and it's not visible unless you look really hard at the bootae.

 

[P. Plainsman]

The 36 is a steel-frame gun, quite a bit heavier than the alloy-framed airweights I'm talking about. Naturally it sags more. You don't need any IWB with a little airweight like the 642. It goes in the pocket.

I'm medium height, medium build, and a holstered J-frame "prints" in my right pants pocket in much the same slight way as my keychain and my building ID card "print" in the other pocket. It is no problem.

Like I said, if you're in an extreme deep concealment situation where you can't be seen to have anything in your pocket, then OK, I grant your point. But how common is that kind of situation in everyday life? Most people -- most men, at a minimum -- walk around with some junk in their pockets. It's not suspicious.

For a woman wearing tight or skimpy clothing (and far be it from me to discourage this!) who wants an on-body carry method, I guess you might need to go with something as teeny as a P3AT. Thus, returning to the original post in this thread, it might not be a bad choice for the poster's wife. I'd go with a Rohrbaugh, funds permitting.

My comments were directed at CCWers in general, who usually have a lot more options. For a man wearing ordinary attire, be it slacks, jeans, or regular shorts, choosing a gun that small, in .380 caliber, that's hard to point accurately (I've fired one), with a fairly questionable reputation for reliability, seems pointless in 95% of CCW situations.

 

[BerettaRacer]

My P3AT has been fine, but do realize, what makes it good also makes it bad. Small and lite is nice to carry, but doesn't give any mass to absorb recoil, that little sucker has a bite to it, especially the pinch on my trigger finger. But I figure if it comes down to needing it I probably won't even notice.

 

[DSGB610]

What About Beretta Jrtfire And Bobcat Series

 

[Alan Fud]

Maybe I just got stuck with a lemon but the P3AT was one of the worst guns that I have ever owned and would not trust my life to it.

 

[Safety First]

Mine is a first generation but one of the later production runs. It has the factory installed hard chrome slide which in my opinion improves the looks of the gun considerably. But what is important is, so far no malfunctions,it feeds and ejects the Speer Gold Dots....I would love to see kel-tec come out with a 9mm in a true pocket rocket...

 

[varoadking]

I prefer my P32 over my P3-AT...by a long shot...

 

[NMshooter]

Not my P3AT, but a friend's.

After he put a couple magazines he wanted me to complete the break in for him.

No big deal I thought, I had owned a P-32, a nice little pistol, so I figured it would be like that.

The only pistol I have encountered worse trigger slap with was the AMT .45 backup I once owned. Even that one was ok until it "broke in". The P3AT is suprisingly nasty for a .380, I expected recoil, not that jerk on my trigger finger. No one else who shot that pistol liked it either.

Reliability was acceptable for a new pistol, he did the "fluff and buff" and that cured the minor hangups.

Personally I would rather own the P-32, much easier to shoot.

 

[Harry Paget Flashman]

I had two P3AT's. The first one I bought I never got around to shooting and gave it to a nephew in Missouri who is an undercover drug task force LEO. He already carried a SIG 232 backup so I guess it was no upgrade. I bought a new one to replace it and was shooting it at the range where I bought it 10 minutes later. Didn't work for me. A brutal little gun to shoot. I was using Wolf and S&B ammo. I should have know better, virtually all the Wolf ammo stuck and failed to eject. About half the S&B did. I'll grant that I could have used better ammo and probably got it to work but I didn't like the gun. Nice concept though and I'm happy for anyone that has one that works for them.

I horse-traded it and a Norinco 1911 for a Ruger Model 77 in .30-'06 with a 3X9 scope. No regrets.

 

[boldkharma]

My P3AT has been flawless. I do keep it clean and it in turn does it's job. I bought my wife a 642, great gun, but you can't compare the size of the two and be fair. The Keltec is the smallest, lightest auto that fires a decent caliber. If you have a chance, compare them side by side. There is no comparison as far as I am concerned. Granted, my Keltec serves a limited function, but in that function( deep concealment) no other pistol comes close. JMHO

 

[10 Ring Tao]

2 second gens.

I didn't vote, because I did some light polishing and fluffing before either of the 3Ats went to the range. One was NIB, one was bought "lightly used". The used one had a kinked recoil spring as I bought it, and needed a new one (replaced free by KT).

After my polishing and the new recoil spring, both have run perfectly.

 

[obxned]

2nd generation and never a problem! I did remove a sharp edge on the trigger and a few others from the molding process, but never had a reliability problem. Accuracy is also amazing for such a small pistol with microscopic sights and an extemely short sighting radius. You do not want to play first-string catcher on my P3AT team, even at 50 yards!

The best thing about this gun is it hides so easily and weighs so little that you will always have it with you. The .380 may not be the best 1-shot stopper, but it is a darn fine 3- or 5-shot stopper!

 

[JohnBT]

"The case for the snubby revolver over the P3AT seems extremely strong. I just don't see why most shooters would bother with the latter."

Because the snubbies are too dern big for my front pockets and I don't wear jeans too often either. I have to believe a lot of folks have the same problem. I have a 442 and a 649. Too big. I like my old hardchromed P-32 and I'm still looking for a hardchromed P-3AT, but I've never even seen one.

Meanwhile, I bought a used Rohrbaugh, put 3 or 4 drops of oil on it and shot 100 rounds. I'll take the slide off and clean it when I get a new recoil spring, but the office is closed until 6/14. For vacation I suppose.

John

 

[10 Ring Tao]

I don't see how people can honestly compare a revolver to a keltec. Sure, the 2 dimensial measurements are close enough, but the thickness ruins that comparison.

I have a feeling that those professing a revolver over a keltec sized auto, haven't actually tried to carry an auto that small and thin.