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----- Original Message -----
From: Boris Karpa
To: [email protected]
Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2003 11:41 PM
Subject: what will put you in prison in America - a short list
Shannon!
Here was my point: In modern-day America, you can get arrested for the possession of physical objects - namely weapons or the means to manufacture such weapons. This really a loophole big enough to drive a limo through. Note, that the "means to manufacture" is up to the decision of the arresting officer. So, what can they bust you for?
1.Posession of a shotgun with a barrel shorter than 18 inch. Illegal since 1934. You could have one if you paid $200 and waited about a year for the tax stamp. Up until 1968 if you had an illegal one, you could pay $200 and be legal - not anymore.
2. Rifle with barrel shorter than 16 inch. Same as above. Moreover, if you want to remake your rifle into a pistol, you can't. What starts as a rifle, remains a rifle, if you try, you go to prison.
3. Machinegun. Now this one is tricky. A machinegun can only be yours if it was already owned by some civilian before 1986. Not kidding. So an M-16A1 made on September 15, 1986 and owned by a civilian can be yours, but not one made on September 17th. Moreover, if a gun was made in 1985 but not civilian property, you can't register it. Sorry.
Number of crimes committed with legally-owned machineguns 1934-1986=0. Don't ask me to justify this law.
But this is not where it gets wierd. It gets wierd when the law determines that a machinegun is a gun that fires more than once per trigger pull - or anything that can be readily modified into one. The ATF uses that to bust people for having certain parts of military weapons. For example, an "M-16 auto-sear" - a piece of metal under an inch long - is officially a machinegun if I recall correctly. You're in possession of machinegun if you have one in your pocket. Read more on this here, I suggest you scroll through the technical part. And yes, the part on that picture is a machinegun. http://www.quarterbore.com/nfa/dias.html . ?You will note burden of proof is on you on this one. Presumption of innocence? Get real.
This is how they enforce that insanity: http://www.boogieonline.com/revolution/firearms/enforce/lamplugh.html
4. Any modern rifle using cartridges bigger than 12.7mm. Legally, there's no difference between a Russian 14.5mm rifle and a 40mm launcher - or a sawed-off shotgun.
5. Any handgun bullet made of material other than lead or copper. The only exception is for a list of bullet types made by ATF. How you define "handgun cartridge"? Almost any catridge used in a handgun, for example, AK47 ammunition is "handgun ammo" because there's an obscure handgun shooting that model. People did go to prison because they bought up on such ammo days before it was declared "handgun ammo". Totally illegal, no licenses available.
6.Dealing in guns without a license. Now, it's legal to sell a gun without a license as long as you're not "dealing", i.e. doing that to turn a profit. So if you sell me your Bersa .380, you should be fine. In theory. In practice, they have entrapped people by offering outrageous prices - and then arrested them for making a profit. So that's why many serious "gun nuts" had licenses in 1992 (200,000+). Now there's 60,000 - Clinton and the ATF did all they could (many of it illegal) to make people get rid of their licenses.
7."Assault weapons" and the means to make them (including conversion from legal weapons). Most of it explained here. http://www.awbansunset.com/whatis.html
8.Silencers and the means to make them. See entry 1 on license. According to experts, this is a big contributor to hearing loss, especially with hunters. Note that in some countries these are obligatory for people shooting in the outdoors (hunters, plinkers, etc.) because of noise pollution concerns. Note that some silencers use rubber parts that wear out easily, having spare is just like having machineguns around.
9.Grenades/mines of any form. Includes molotov cocktails. Also includes "means to make those weapons". See shotguns.
10. Conspirancy to make any of the above weapons/equipment. They have busted people for talking about making machineguns, don't tell me they won't. They have put people in prison for having inert grenades (no explosives inside) for "conspiring" to make them into real grenades.
I think this is it, or at least the big ones.
Sorry it's too long.
SY,
Boris Karpa
From: Boris Karpa
To: [email protected]
Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2003 11:41 PM
Subject: what will put you in prison in America - a short list
Shannon!
Here was my point: In modern-day America, you can get arrested for the possession of physical objects - namely weapons or the means to manufacture such weapons. This really a loophole big enough to drive a limo through. Note, that the "means to manufacture" is up to the decision of the arresting officer. So, what can they bust you for?
1.Posession of a shotgun with a barrel shorter than 18 inch. Illegal since 1934. You could have one if you paid $200 and waited about a year for the tax stamp. Up until 1968 if you had an illegal one, you could pay $200 and be legal - not anymore.
2. Rifle with barrel shorter than 16 inch. Same as above. Moreover, if you want to remake your rifle into a pistol, you can't. What starts as a rifle, remains a rifle, if you try, you go to prison.
3. Machinegun. Now this one is tricky. A machinegun can only be yours if it was already owned by some civilian before 1986. Not kidding. So an M-16A1 made on September 15, 1986 and owned by a civilian can be yours, but not one made on September 17th. Moreover, if a gun was made in 1985 but not civilian property, you can't register it. Sorry.
Number of crimes committed with legally-owned machineguns 1934-1986=0. Don't ask me to justify this law.
But this is not where it gets wierd. It gets wierd when the law determines that a machinegun is a gun that fires more than once per trigger pull - or anything that can be readily modified into one. The ATF uses that to bust people for having certain parts of military weapons. For example, an "M-16 auto-sear" - a piece of metal under an inch long - is officially a machinegun if I recall correctly. You're in possession of machinegun if you have one in your pocket. Read more on this here, I suggest you scroll through the technical part. And yes, the part on that picture is a machinegun. http://www.quarterbore.com/nfa/dias.html . ?You will note burden of proof is on you on this one. Presumption of innocence? Get real.
This is how they enforce that insanity: http://www.boogieonline.com/revolution/firearms/enforce/lamplugh.html
4. Any modern rifle using cartridges bigger than 12.7mm. Legally, there's no difference between a Russian 14.5mm rifle and a 40mm launcher - or a sawed-off shotgun.
5. Any handgun bullet made of material other than lead or copper. The only exception is for a list of bullet types made by ATF. How you define "handgun cartridge"? Almost any catridge used in a handgun, for example, AK47 ammunition is "handgun ammo" because there's an obscure handgun shooting that model. People did go to prison because they bought up on such ammo days before it was declared "handgun ammo". Totally illegal, no licenses available.
6.Dealing in guns without a license. Now, it's legal to sell a gun without a license as long as you're not "dealing", i.e. doing that to turn a profit. So if you sell me your Bersa .380, you should be fine. In theory. In practice, they have entrapped people by offering outrageous prices - and then arrested them for making a profit. So that's why many serious "gun nuts" had licenses in 1992 (200,000+). Now there's 60,000 - Clinton and the ATF did all they could (many of it illegal) to make people get rid of their licenses.
7."Assault weapons" and the means to make them (including conversion from legal weapons). Most of it explained here. http://www.awbansunset.com/whatis.html
8.Silencers and the means to make them. See entry 1 on license. According to experts, this is a big contributor to hearing loss, especially with hunters. Note that in some countries these are obligatory for people shooting in the outdoors (hunters, plinkers, etc.) because of noise pollution concerns. Note that some silencers use rubber parts that wear out easily, having spare is just like having machineguns around.
9.Grenades/mines of any form. Includes molotov cocktails. Also includes "means to make those weapons". See shotguns.
10. Conspirancy to make any of the above weapons/equipment. They have busted people for talking about making machineguns, don't tell me they won't. They have put people in prison for having inert grenades (no explosives inside) for "conspiring" to make them into real grenades.
I think this is it, or at least the big ones.
Sorry it's too long.
SY,
Boris Karpa
