When would you stop resisting?

[CTGunner]

https://www.chubb.com/personal/html/helpful_tips_protection.html

Above is a link to what Chubb Insurance has to say about Home Invasions. Keep in mind that Chubb's personal line of insurance caters to the wealthy. The write up includes their thoughts on how to help prevent a home invasion.

One section really struck me at the very least as highly debatable. Under what circumstances or at what point during a home invasion would you STOP resisting?

How to protect yourself should your home be invaded.
If an intruder is able to get inside your home, here are some things you can do to help protect yourself and your family. Cooperate with the invader(s). This may help calm the criminals and reduce the likelihood of violence. No matter how discomforting it is to lose your valuables, do not risk your life."

They also say...."If you own a firearm, you may want to keep it hidden in your master bathroom. Victims of home invasion are most often contained in the master bathroom."

I was just looking at their site a bit more and found a similar section on car jacking. I like the ideas on avoiding. However, once again the recommendation is not to resist if it happens.
https://www.chubb.com/personal/html/helpful_tips_protection_carjacking.html

 

[scottaschultz]

One section really struck me at the very least as highly debatable.

Why? I would rather my homeowners insurance company pay me for a loss of property than to have my life insurance company pay my widow!

Scott

 

[TexasRifleman]

How very 1950-ish of them.

Might want to check some crime stats on this.

I believe more modern trends indicate that home invaders no longer prefer to leave witnesses.

You can resist and maybe get dead, or be passive and maybe get dead.

Personally I'll take my chances with fighting back.

 

[CTGunner]

Why? I would rather my homeowners insurance company pay me for a loss of property than to have my life insurance company pay my widow!

Scott

Because maybe after they say they just want my stuff, they change their minds, handcuff me, and decide to rape my 12 year old daughter?

 

[Avenger29]

one section really struck me at the very least as highly debatable. Under what circumstances or at what point during a home invasion would you stop resisting?

never!

 

[bdickens]

I might stop resisting only after I am dead.

 

[Ohio Gun Guy]

I'm with bdickens and the others here. I'm not about to hope that they just want my TV.

Just to make the point, read the M.O. on Dennis Rader AKA "BTK"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_Rader

 

[colorado_handgunner]

As long as you resit, your life is still in your own hands. Once you surrender, you are at the mercy of the invaders, who generally show none. Not even a choice, as far as I am concerned.

 

[John E.]

A social norm that homeowners will cooperate with home invaders encourages home invasions.

A social norm that homeowners will resist home invaders discourages home invasions.

 

[Corporal K]

When I'm dead.

 

[CTGunner]

Right on John E.

 

[Ohio Gun Guy]

When I'm out of ammo, and I've thrown the gun at them...

 

[travellingJeff]

What a bunch of liberal pansy-ism. When the dark hordes begin to raid the houses of the ultra-rich elite, we'll see how they behave.

 

[LightningJoe]

If you start resisting, don't stop. If you don't start, run away. Don't become a prisoner. Sometimes, being taken prisoner in your home works out OK. A lot of the time, it doesn't. And when it doesn't, it's often quite bad.


Fight and win if you can. Fight and die if you must. Don't die on your knees.

 

[benEzra]

Why? I would rather my homeowners insurance company pay me for a loss of property than to have my life insurance company pay my widow!

Here's what cooperation can get you:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,304496,00.html

NEW HAVEN, Conn. — The suspects in a deadly home invasion in Cheshire poured gasoline on and around a mother and two daughters, then set their house on fire and fled, according to search warrants released by a judge Tuesday.

The 11 heavily edited warrants provide the first official version of the events of July 23. Jennifer Hawke-Petit, and her daughters, Hayley, 17, and Michaela, 11, were killed. Hawke-Petit's husband, Dr. William Petit, was badly beaten but escaped.

Investigators found traces of rope-like material around the ankles of all three victims and tied to the two girls' wrists and bedposts, according to the warrants. They also found three partially melted one-gallon gas containers.

"One of the deceased was burned beyond recognition, with indications that an accelerant was liberally poured on her," investigators wrote in a search warrant. "The remaining two victims appeared to have some indication of accelerant being poured onto or in close proximity to them, but not to the same degree as the other victim."

Hawke-Petit was strangled and the two girls died of smoke inhalation, according to the medical examiner.

Paroled burglars Joshua Komisarjevsky, 27, of Cheshire, and Steven Hayes, 44, of Winsted, both face capital felony and multiple murder, kidnapping, sexual assault and arson charges in connection with the killings.

They are scheduled to appear Nov. 6 in Superior Court for probable cause hearings.

An attorney for The Hartford Courant argued last month for the release of the documents. Prosecutors did not object to unsealing the warrants, but defense attorneys said coverage of their contents would make it difficult to find impartial jurors for their client's trials.

Last week, Superior Court Judge Richard Damiani agreed to release edited versions of the warrants. Defense attorneys did not appeal.

"I don't think there is anything new that hasn't been previously disclosed," said Thomas Ullmann, the public defender representing Hayes. He declined further comment.

Police say Komisarjevsky and Hayes entered the home about 3 a.m. July 23, planning to burglarize it. When they found the family home, they beat Dr. Petit, then tied up his wife and daughters.

Authorities were tipped off that the family was in danger by employees at a local bank when one of the suspects forced Hawke-Petit to make a withdrawal around 9:30 a.m. Bank employees became suspicious and called police, who drove to the Petit home.

The suspects were caught in the family's car after ramming several cruisers as they fled the burning home, which they allegedly torched to cover their tracks. Dr. Petit escaped to a neighbor's house.

Police searched a car registered to Komisarjevsky's mother and found a package for a BB gun, duct tape, a Lowe's Home Improvement store receipt, flexible ties and different types of gloves, according to the warrants.

In another car, they found Dr. Petit's wallet, his wife's wallet, two pearl necklaces and a red, blood-like stain.

The warrants also allowed police to test various items for traces of blood, saliva and semen.

Nonresistance led to the worst of all possible outcomes in this case; the teenagers were tied to their beds, raped, doused with gasoline and burned alive.

Thing is, you never know what kind of monster you're placing yourself at the mercy of.

When the dark hordes begin to raid the houses of the ultra-rich elite, we'll see how they behave.

"Dark hordes?" I hope you're not referring to ethnicity here.

^^ The two monsters responsible for the home invasion in the article above, FWIW.

 

[travellingJeff]

Dark in spirit, I mean.


Of course, statistically speaking... Nah.

 

[Deanimator]

A home invasion is by definition "violent". You can't "prevent" something that's already happened.

I always sneer at those who tell me to "trust" violent criminals.

Violently force your way into my home and it's on til somebody loses. I'm going to do EVERYTHING possible to make sure it's you. Gun, fist, knife or couch cushion, you're either leaving or being incapacitated, by whatever means necessary.

 

[Mikhail Weiss]

Re: Home invasion
Under what circumstances or at what point during a home invasion would you STOP resisting?

Short answer: Stop resisting if you believe that such choice is the best way to survive. Sometimes you're just screwed and there are no good options. But you only get to be wrong once.

Slightly longer answer (skipping the philosophical one,which would make it even longer): my essential knee-jerk nature is to resist, even if it may turn out bad. For example...

The idea of not resisting briefly crossed my mind once during a home invasion, but there was only one goon, he offered violence, the consequences of not resisting were unacceptable in a number of ways, so I surprised him with even more violent violence. That solved the problem.

I looked at the link provided and took immediate issue with bullet points number one and two, namely, the ones about cooperating with the bad guy and not looking him in the eye. The fellow in my case didn't come to cooperate. Rather, his intent seemed clearly to get rid of me and to then rape the bikini-clad lady with whom I was visiting (at least that's what I assume he meant when he told her, “You know what I'm here for.”).

No doubt the bad guy's intentions would have eventually become apparent whether I looked him in the eyes or not, but doing so told me something about what he was up to well before he said or did anything. We'll lump those eyes, their expression, and everything else about him into this handy category: body language. It's not hard to read.

 

[Rockwell1]

U.S. forces code of conduct paragraphs II & III

I will never surrender of my own free will. If in command, I will never surrender the members of my command while they still have the means to resist.
III
If I am captured I will continue to resist by all means available. I will make every effort to escape and to aid others to escape. I will accept neither parole nor special favors from the enemy.

I have no intention of trusting my life to the mercy of a home invader.

 

[CTGunner]

Rockwell1 - Excellent reference.

 

[Deanimator]

Rockwell1 - Excellent reference.

Not to mention the fact that the Code of Conduct generally refers to interactions with the soldiers of organized armies, employed by nation states, many of whom at least pretend to adhere to the Geneva and other conventions.

Maybe I'm uninformed, but I'm completely unaware of any sort of international convention governing the conduct of home invaders. I wouldn't surrender to the Japanese Army of WWII. Why on earth would I surrender to a meth head who's kicked in my front door?

 

[bensdad]

"...with your shield, or on it."

 

[AKElroy]

Personally I'll take my chances with fighting back.

Exactly. THEY started the fight when they entered my house. Since the fight is on, I want to be equipped to win.

 

[Leanwolf]

"How to protect yourself should your home be invaded.

If an intruder is able to get inside your home, here are some things you can do to help protect yourself and your family. Cooperate with the invader(s). This may help calm the criminals and reduce the likelihood of violence. No matter how discomforting it is to lose your valuables, do not risk your life."

Uhh huh. In additon to the recent incidents posted above....

Cooperate with the invader(s).

The way Mr. and Mrs Clutter, and their two children "cooperated" with Perry Smith and Dick Hickock.

The way Sharon Tate, Jay Sebring, and Abigail Folger "cooperated" with Charlie Manson's Little Cuttin' Cuties and Tex Watson.

Yep, cooperation and non-resistance work every time.

Fight back!!

L.W.

 

[earlthegoat2]

In the book Defensive Living by Ed Lovette and Dave Spaulding there is a incident described where a man and wife wake up to a bump in the night and the man investigates it unarmed. They had been home invaded by some AK toting thieves who decided that they would finish their night by taking turns on the mans wife at gunpoint.

No one was killed but I would rather be dead than have to live with that.

I will resist explosively and viciously to any home invader. They will get fair warning and if they dont heed.......


On another note,

There is a trend in the United States with the insurance companies and the lawyers to always advise against any sort of resistance. This is backed up by rising insurance rates and liability suits all over the place. Citizens of this country have been manipulated into taking the passive route with what amounts to bribery and scare tactics. I have called this trend the Sissification of America. It would be a refreshing day indeed when someone would stand up and tell the populace to take back the night. Resist viciously against any and all acts of wrongdoing against you. A message that the common man is not just going to role over and let himself get robbed.

I know this may be an oversimplification because violent encounters will never played by a set of rules. An armed attacker against an unarmed victim is one sided in the best of times. But still resist whenever you can.

On yet another note your homeowners insurance can pay for the hell you rained down upon your would be attackers to fix the bullet holes or broken furniture or any and everything you had to do to protect yourself.