Which AR would it be?

[kenken]

I am in the market for a new AR. I have one that I shoot in 'high power' but I am wanting a M4 style before the election this year. I am wanting to get me a Colt le6920. I believe this is a good piece according to all that I have read. Just the other day I was in Acadamy Sports and saw that they were selling ARs that were done by Red Jacket Firearms out of Baton Rouge, La.
Also, the salesman told me that the original guys from Bushmaster had started another company and was making a nice, quality piece also. I think he said they called it Windham Firearms.
I know that it is going to cost so I want the best I can. Has anyone else had any experience with any of these weapons or which would I be better off with.

Colt le6920 w/ law enforcement/military use only roll mark--1500.00
Red Jacket---1200.00
Windham --- about 1200.00

kenken

 

[proven]

i'd buy the colt over the other two any day. you can easily find a colt 6920 online for about $1000.

 

[kwelz]

The Red Jacket is a joke.
The WW is just a bushmaster with a different name.

The Colt is way overpriced at your dealer. You can get one for under 1K easily. Heck I pay less than that for a Noveske..

 

[Mr.Blue]

I'd get the Colt over the other two, but the price is high. You are paying a huge premium ($500-$600) over the regular SP6920, just for the LE/Miltary roll marks. That said, I'd get a Daniel Defense over the Colt. The Daniel Defense is just as tough as the Colt with better fit and finish, as well as better customer service. YMMV.

 

[rodinal220]

Forget crapmaster and red jacket.The Colt 6920 is the AR all others are judged by.Many AR "manufacturers" are simply a house of Lego. Colts always have better resale and they have a cute Lil pony on them The AR industry is an incestuous one.

CDNN is also closing out Colt 6940s(page 41 of their current catalog) if your into the monolithic rail.

 

[rklessdriver]

COLT 6920 all the way.

 

[Chindo18Z]

With all due respect to boutique makers and high priced local dealers...the only one you have listed that I'd implicitly trust would be the Colt.

Red Jacket is a boutique shop riding the popularity coattails of its current television show. They are simply one of dozens of small vendors who market ARs...and are riding a passing fad of their brand's notoriety. I'm sure their weapons are nice, but you are simply paying for the name. Nobody is taking Red Jacket ARs to combat or equipping large elements of LEO, Military, or Security forces with them. Instructors are not clamoring for their rifles...know what I mean?

Windham is a new company formed last year by ex-employees of the Bushmaster firm. The story goes that they intend to start building better guns at the new firm...but you might want to wait until product beta testing places them a little more solidly in the "must buy" category:
http://www.keepmecurrent.com/lakes_...cle_33e21c84-9775-11e0-84bd-001cc4c03286.html


You'd find it hard to go wrong with either of the following manufacturers:

1) Colt
2) Bravo Company USA ("BCM")

Both represent the best value in a MILSPEC purchase that you can get...for under $1100.

$1500 for the Colt you mentioned is highway robbery. I can buy the same thing out the door of gun shops/gun shows in Colorado for $1200-$1300 (retail plus tax)...and a hundred or two cheaper if I shop around.

If you can have a local FFL do the transfer for you, you can order a cosmetic blem lower from BCM for ~$300...then order an upper in any standard configuration you like and have UPS deliver that barreled upper right to your house.


http://www.gandrtactical.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?preadd=action&key=LWR-C
(When in stock, Gander has your Colt 6920 for less than $1000)

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/AR15-Upper-Receiver-Groups-s/1.htm


You can spend a lot more for an M4 style AR, but if you are looking for a straight up reliable gun fighting weapon...those two companies are among the very few gold standard manufacturers...at an affordable price. Both Colt and BCM are near top of the heap when it comes to being major manufacturers of quality military grade weaponry.

For a bit more money...Noveske or Daniel Defense are at the very top of the heap.


The roll mark issue is a trap for the unwary. Colt has recently begun marking the very same weapon without the old "LEO" stamp and there is zero premium associated with having (or not having) such markings. They finally got around to changing the new roll mark to "SP6920" for "Sporter". They are the the exact same gun. The newer roll mark is now marketable in a few states that forbade the earlier "restricted" version. If your dealer is trying to convince you that the "LEO" markings are going to be collectible and charge you a premium...you need to find another gun shop.


Hope this helps...

 

[kenken]

The LEO markings was told to be more desirable by a few people. I don't know but that is why I am asking before I jump. I have been priced one at a gun store with the markings for 1595.00 cash/1695.00 credit for a marked le6940. And of course he only has one left. What is the difference between a 6920 and a 6940? Sounds a little high to me.

kenken

 

[Chindo18Z]

The 6940 (bottom rifle) has a monolithic upper (the rail extends as one piece all the way from the receiver to the front sight); the barrel is free floated. It also has factory installed flip up front/rear sights. Meh...

Unless you intend to mount some serious target acquisition hardware to a personal weapon, I find the whole concept of masses of extended rails to be worthless added weight.

A 6920 (with removable carry handle) will take any Aimpoint or other scope you are likely to use and seat it right where it needs to go...on top of the upper receiver... and still have room for a rear Back-Up Iron Sight (BUIS). Of course the gun will shoot pretty damn nicely with the factory iron sights it comes equipped with. The only other thing you might need is a weapon light mounted up front, which can be mounted in any number of ways to conventional hand guards or aftermarket hand guards (like Magpul's inexpensive MOE furniture).

Multiple rails were designed for military users to be able to mount multiple lights, scopes, lasers (both visible and IR), grenade launchers, and the inevitably required vertical fore grip for tape switches and pressure pads from competing devices. If you don't own all this kit...and the helmet mounted night vision monocular to go with it...why bother?

My issued Colt M4A1's rails mounted with a moderate load of stuff while in Iraq...

The 6940's monolithic upper rail provides for more rail-estate for mounting combat optics, swing-out magnifiers, backup rear sights, and night vision/thermal weapon sights along the same plane. This represents many thousands of dollars worth of optics (that you will likely never own) and turns your light and handy AR into a weapon with the weight of a WWII BAR.

You don't need it. Go with the 6920 (or BCM equivalent). Add a Surefire or Streamlight TLR-1 flashlight with an inexpensive mount that you can operate with a thumb or pressure switch. At that point...you are good to go.

It's a carbine...not a Swiss Army Knife.

I have been priced one at a gun store with the markings for 1595.00 cash/1695.00 credit for a marked le6940.

With regard to the LEO Restricted markings on previous 6920s...think of it as last year's model. All they have changed on the gun is the roll mark. Certain unscrupulous dealers are now trying to convince naive buyers that this somehow makes them "special" or "collectible". They aren't. Colt will continue to push LE marked lower receivers out the door until they exhaust their stocks, but all newer production simply has a different roll mark.

Shop Around. Colt is now pumping out several package variants to dealers with most of what you might want in terms of features.

Like this one...railed M-4 profile:

http://www.armslist.com/posts/29498...t-le6920mpr-ar-15-limited-magpul-talo-edition

Or this one...railed lightweight (M16A1) barrel profile:

http://www.armslist.com/posts/30818...le--colt-lt6720r-magpul-limited-edition-ar-15

 

[kenken]

Are the 6920,6720,6940, and so on all the same gun just different setups or are the different. I notice they all have the 1 in 7 twist bbl and some have the magpul this and that but are they all the same basic gun?

kenken

 

[FlyinBryan]

The WW is just a bushmaster with a different name.

not exactly

 

[Chindo18Z]

They are all the same weapon with different furniture (stock, grip, hand guard), rail configurations, iron sight combinations, and barrel length/profile differences.

At the heart of the weapon...they are all AR-15/M4 Carbine upper and lower receivers.

The AR is jokingly referred to as a Barbie Doll for men...dress it up any way you like. It's a modular weapon...allowing you to add or subtract Lego parts.

The problem with a lot of buyers is that they buy features that look "neat" without having an appreciation for actual utility provided by those features. Buying a long, heavy, four sided, premium rail system designed for combat (that costs half the price of the weapon) is a case in point. A complete waste of money if you intend to mount nothing more than a simple flashlight to the rifle. Vendors will happily sell you a replacement gew-gaw or gadget to "improve" every aspect of the original weapon.

However, the fact of the matter is that Colt's 6920 configuration is the essentially the very same weapon I carried to combat in Afghanistan, Iraq, Kosovo, Bosnia and to several other places. Mine had a 14.5" barrel and was full-auto capable (making it an NFA item here in the States), but the weapon was otherwise almost identical to the usual semi-auto 16.1" barreled civilian version you can buy.

This is the Colt I took to war in 2001. It's dated now in terms of advances in rails and optics, but it worked just fine back then:



This is the Colt I carried in Iraq last year (actually two Colts):



Same carbine...just different accessories. Barbie Dolls for Men.

 

[FlyinBryan]

and that 1911? you carried that?

 

[Chindo18Z]

Yes, I did.

And another (different) 1911 during two previous tours to Iraq.

Issued Army weapons if you were wondering. They are still around in some units.

 

[JustinJ]

I went with the Colt 6720 as i see no benefit to the extra weight a the front. The only downside with the 6720 is after market gas blocks in .625 are much less common than .75. The 6720 also comes with a Matech BUIS instead of a detachable carry handle. The first thing i did with my new Colt is intsall a Troy TRX rail. Its a very light free float rail system that allows one to install rails where they wish so weight is minimized by having rails only for used items.

 

[FlyinBryan]

Yes, I did.

And another (different) 1911 during two previous tours to Iraq.

made my day.

 

[mopar92]

+1 for bravo company
+1 DPMS

 

[RatDrall]

OP, those prices are horrible. Your gunshop is trying to screw you. You can get that 6920 all over the internet for way less, like $1100:

http://clydearmory.com/colt-le6920.html

Forget crapmaster and red jacket.The Colt 6920 is the AR all others are judged by.

The 6920 is popular because of consistent quality control and widespread use by law enforcement. Also, because people sometimes don't know better.

Unless you have a grenade launcher to attach to your carbine, no reason to use an M4 barrel, unless you're into more recoil, more wear on the weapon, and less handguard. They make "Mid Length" 16" rifles now that solve these issues with 100% reliability, less recoil, less wear on the weapon, and more room for handguards.

That "LE Only" rollmark might be cool, but it could also be a problem when there is another assault weapon ban.

Look to Daniel Defense and Bravo Company for a top tier rifle (absolutely no corners cut) at less cost than a Colt, without the stupid "special guns for special people" rollmark.

There are better, or at least equal, rifles out there:

http://www.slip2000.com/art-swat2.html

 

[Cmeboston]

Chindo18Z,
what is the model of the forward optic and mount on the first rifle? i want to get something like that for my AR.

 

[Chindo18Z]

That's a 2001 era standard issue M68 Close Combat Optic (otherwise known as an Aimpoint CompM2 red dot sight). It's mounted on a "goose-neck" forward mount (included as a standard accessory from Aimpoint at that time). Today the Army issues the CompM4...a product improved Aimpoint. I don't believe the Army issues the goose-neck mount any longer...but there are a lot of them still for sale new or used.

The rear of the goose-neck mount screws down through the hole located about half way down the sight tunnel of the rifle's carrying handle. The lower front projection has a section of rail for accepting the thumbscrew tightened Aimpoint and its scope ring/base. You can still look through the top of your carry handle when using your rear iron sight with goose-neck mounted (as it also has a tunnel).

Fortunate that we had them...because I didn't have access to any Backup Iron Sights as I deployed. Some folks just tossed their carrying handles and ran with an Aimpoint or Eotech. Screw that. I used the forward mount so I could keep and use my carry handle iron rear sight. I'd previously run the same setup through a multi-week CQB Instructor course and knew that it worked just fine.

Had my scope ever died for any reason, I could simply shift my eye to the rear iron, look through the glass, and acquire my front sight post. Co-witness.

In 2012, it looks old school. Hell...it is old school. But it works quite well if you are inclined to run your gun with the removable carry handle/A2 style rear sight.

The goose-neck mounts run about $60-$70 new, a lot less on e-bay, and a lot more if you buy the fancy version with vertical adjustment and additional rails.

http://www.botachtactical.com/brugthomfwdm.html

http://www.promagindustries.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=PM103A

http://armsmounts.com/default.asp?mode=products&sub=mounts&id=[hsh]39

 

[Cmeboston]

Wow thanks a ton! Exactly what I want to put on my fixed handle Bushmaster...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[dprice3844444]

6940 to add to my 2 smiths,1 essential,3 olympics

 

[rjrivero]

M4 style? Colt or LMT.

 

[kenken]

+11

 

[kfgk14]

You, sir, are getting bs'd on the colt.

Look, go to grtactical.com.
Look at their price on the colt.

Trust me, buy a Colt through G & R Tactical, have it shipped to a local FFL. You can buy that Colt for less than $1100 with whatever charge your FFL gives you. If the FFL charges you more than $50 for the transfer, tell them to go choke and find a different FFL.