Which Mosin-Nagant to Buy? Milsurp or handload?

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...but if I was limited to one rifle, I would go with one that I would be confident in.
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After reading these posts and many other threads, I have to go with this point of view. It may cost a bit more, but I think that I'll probably end up going for the better variants of the major battle rifle platforms. What this means is that if I want a MN, I'll get a Finn M39. Here you have the same basic design, but a more accurate shooter that was probably built with higher quality control and not abused as much. Barring that, I'll probably get a decommissioned sniper 91/30 from Aztec, as these rifles were the pick of the litter from the very start (and $129 for one of these is very reasonable).

Please keep the comments coming, as they are the usual THR blend of knowledge, experience and wit.
 
7.62X54R Loads

I just recently acquired a 91/30. I've only fired S&B 180 grain SP, Czech milsurp 148 grain "silvertips", and Wolf copper-washed steel case 148 grain out of it. Believe it or not, the most accurate was the Wolf.
 
Why wouldn't I believe it ?
Wolf works fine in guns.
Not so well on the internet.
 
Not to Start a Wolf Ammo Thread

As 444 pointed out, I've surfed a lot of bad news about Wolf but have never had problems with it, in rifles anyway. I use it in the SKS and the wife uses it in her Mini-14 and it's fine.

I have not seen it in 8mm but if I did I would not hesitate to give it a try in my Mausers, the cheap milsurp has got to dry up sometime.

But to get back on topic, I love the 91/30. I plan on using the Wolf in it from now on.
 
That's one of the things I worry about with surplus guns. Eventually the surplus ammo has to dry up. What do you do if teh K-31 ammo is all goen and you can't reload your own? I guess buy it from people that will reload for it. If there's a market for it, it should be produced, right?
 
That's one of the things I worry about with surplus guns. Eventually the surplus ammo has to dry up. What do you do if teh K-31 ammo is all goen and you can't reload your own? I guess buy it from people that will reload for it. If there's a market for it, it should be produced, right?
 
7.5 Swiss is loaded by Hornady and Norma along with at least one other company.
Now that you see a reason to start handloading, there is no time like the present to get started.
 
All this talk about 91/30s made me go out today and shoot mine. They are a lot of fun. I downloaded the target used for this postal match: http://www.surplusrifle.com/shooting/postal/index.asp and was able to hold the 10 ring with five shot groups fired at 100 yards from a rest (the rear fender of my pickup) using mil-surp ammo (I believe it is Russian).
 
I'm waiting with baited breath for my Aztec hand picked ex-sniper to arrive. Hopefully it will be a good shooter. The 91/30 isn't the most accurate of Mosins, but for some reason I've got a soft spot for that rifle as wide as the soft spot for my Mossberg 500. It's just a real nice firearm to have around.
 
If one is reloading the 7.5 Swiss round, Graf & Sons has new cases for about $0.28 each (and less in greater quantities) at http://www.grafs.com/

I've now had another change of heart (at least for today), and now I've got my heart set on a K-31. The rifles are cheap - under $100, or at most in the $125-$150 range for selected examples, and they are apparently deadly accurate - with 1-2 MOA not uncommon. The thing that turns me off is the cost of the ammo (nearly $0.40/round for the Swiss surplus match), but reloading will take care of that concern.
 
The K-31's are a little different for those not used to straight pulls, but once you get the hang of them they're excellent. All-around probably the best rifle buy you can make now. The GP-11 is expensive but worth every penny. For reloading the plus is you use .308" bullets. The round is very old but flawless. It's like an improved .308 with a sharper shoulder angle. My K-31 would routinely get 1 1/2" groups rested.
 
The K31 is the cream of the crop.
I own probably between a dozen and 15 or so of these milsurp rifles (probably don't have $1000 into all of them).
I shoot in Vinatage Military Bolt Action Rifle Matches.
Out of all those rifles I have to choose from to compete with, the K31 has been my choice for the last year. It is a superb rifle. I have never won one of these matches, but I am in the hunt every month (out of maybe 30 shooters) and have taken second and thrid several times.
Of course now that I have an 03A3 that might have to get cycled into the rotation.
 
K-31's are going for something like $89 at AIM, and Yugo 24/47 Mausers (I just got a beauty) are $109 there. I'd grab them before I'd jump on the Russian stuff. The Russkies made millions upon millions of Mosins. The Swiss weren't nearly as prolific with the K-31, which is one outstanding rifle.

Have fun! I got my C&R in Oct of last year, and have 15 milsurps already (11 of which are Enfields).
 
Sorry Sam, but I can't help you.
I bought one from a guy I work with and another from a local guy here. Never ordered one.
 
444

I read a relatively recent post of yours on TFL (where I was just looking, not posting, and had to sign off in a hurry) that you had bought 500 7.5 Swiss brass cases from Graf's. Questions:

1) Assuming that you've reloaded some already, how does the accuracy of the Graf's cases compare to that of other manufacturers (I wouldn't think that there'd be much difference, but there are always slight differences)?

2) Have you been able to determine anything about the durability of these cases yet?

3) Any other comments?
 
I've been using the 180gn S&B .311 bullet in S&B cases with 44gns of N140. I used to use the Sierra .308 190gn BTHP but this is much cheaper and just as accurate (bore was gauged by the gunsmith and passed as suitable for .311)
 
MkVII

That barrel must've been quite used to be able to fit .311 bullets. But, hey, as long as it works, right?
 
I just got the C&R about 10 days ago, and I've been very busy with other stuff since then. I'm going to first get a K-31 (it'll be ordered tomorrow), and then a Finn M-39. Regarding the latter, I'm going to look for one that is an antique (i.e. pre-1899). I don't need the C&R for that, only a drivers license, and it gets recorded nowhere. I'll be reloading for both, though with the 7.62x54 being so incredibly cheap (surplus, that is), I'll use that for a while.
 
An update for everyone. I got a K-31, but still haven't shot it yet. :fire: I got reloading dies and brass from Graf's, as well as a few bricks of the GP-11. I'm good to go with that one for quite a while. It is a 1941 rifle, and while the stock is a bit beat up, it looks and feels great. It also has some history, having definitely been used by some Swiss infantryman to deter a German invasion.

I just ordered a Finn M-39. It is built from a pre-1899 receiver, so it'll have no paperwork for the JBTs to inspect, and I'm buying it with a money order. I plan on initially getting a bunch of Czech silvertip, Hungarian yellowtip and Wolf 148 grain ammo (at gunshows, for cash), and seeing which works best. Yeah, I know about the corrosive primers on the first 2, so I'll be bringing a bottle of glass cleaner with ammonia to the range to swab out the barrel and clean the bolt face right away. It is going to be a real thrill to shoot a rifle older than my grandfathers, particularly one that is probably capable of 1 1/2 - 2 MOA or better. Not so bad for a "non-gun."

A range report will follow...but that may take a while. Little kids and a wife with not so much patience after a week with them tend to delay trips to the range.
 
milsurp 7.62 x 54r ammo works, but it sticks sometimes

I shoot surplus ammo in my surplus guns all the time. Czech silvertip works fine in my M44 and M38, but I have a rough time with some rounds sticking in the chambers of my M91/30s.

I'll figure out why they stick, someday. By that time, however, I'll be through a few thousand rounds of this milsurp ammo since it's cheap enough to buy quite a bit of it.

Good luck,

straightShot
 
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