Which setup for camping/hiking?

[Big_E]

Hello,

I really want to start hiking and camping more often again and I am wondering what I should be using for bear and mountain lion protection.

So far I have a S&W Model 28 6'', that I would load with Buffalo Bore or Cor Bon .357 (not sure what grain is best)

I have a Ruger Old Vaquero 4.6'' .45 Colt, I haven't shot yet but I figure the older Vaqueros can handle hotter .45 loads that match or pass .44 mag loads.

lastly, I am contemplating picking up a Mossberg 500 combo at Big 5 for $279 (comes with 18.5'' and 28'' barrel) I could sell off the 28'' barrel since I have other shotguns with similar barrels. I would put a folding stock on it (either Choate, Mako or maybe Butler Creek) so I can carry it in my backpack. This would be loaded with 3'' slugs.

I am keeping an eye out for a .44 mag like a 629 classic 6'' but that is a little out of my price range. Are there better setups to use? The Model 28 has an incredibly long and heavy trigger pull for me, but I could get used to it with practice. I am not sure if I would fumble with a SA under pressure. Please help me out with my options and what loads I should look at, thanks.

 

[denfoote]

Here's my tramping in the desert gun.
28-2 4" barrel.



It's loaded with 158gr Gold Dot.

It's good enough for everything from no legged critters up to four.

 

[Purgatory]

I goofed and voted .357 for camping/hiking before I read your explanation for the poll.

If you feel strongly that you may encounter bear or mountain lion, it's not the worst choice in the world, but I would feel a little better with the 12 ga. 3" slugs for DAY-UM sure.

If you get the .44 mag, that may be even better for the sake of being more easily wielded and not as cumbersome as a shotgun. But the 12 ga. or the .44 are probably your better bet against those type of dangerous predators.

The speed and power of those animals is NO JOKE.

 

[Oro]

I tramp in the same mountains/threat areas you do. I usually go by horse so I carry both a .30-30 in a scabbard and a .44 mag 3" on the body. There are a few rules I like to apply to this situation:

1) The first rule of gunfighting: 1st, have a gun. If the 12ga. is in the backpack and there are times off your body, like while fetching water, cooking, or sleeping - it might be a great gun on paper but it is no longer a factor in an emergency. It's no longer a gun you have. Have a gun.

2) for that reason, decide what you can keep on your body with you at all times. 6" n-frames get freakin' annoying on the hip or shoulder all the time. I want a powerful, compact handgun I can always reasonably carry.

After those considerations, then heavy .45 Colt, .44 Mag., or heavy .357 become secondary considerations or even tertiary. Figure out which gun you will have and can tolerate carrying on you at all times.

Lastly, what happens if you are in a party of hikers/bikers/riders and you are struck by the mtn. lion or bear? Got someone who can shoot backing you up with a good round? You better. Think about that and have a second good gun to give to another capable member of your party (if more than one). And "two" is a party in this case. I don't go into grizz. country with others without one of them having at least a hard-hitting .357magnum.

 

[ironcode]

For bears, you want a .500 S&W Magnum. Trust me. Alternatively, a 12-ga with slugs, but that's probably too unwieldy for hiking...

 

[CZ223]

The shotgun is probably the best choice

but if you are on foot for any amount of time it is probably too heavy and unweildy. Your Ruger Vaquero in 45 Colt is a fine choice. As you mentioned it is the old model so you can safely load it with the heaviest rounds out there like Corbon and Buffalo bore. I would choose the heaviest slug available from one of those two companies or load your own. If you do load your own, be careful. You will not lose much if anything to a 44 magnum with these kind of loads. I would not spend the money on a 44 magnum if you allready have the 45 Colt. While I love the 357, it ain't bear medicine. If you feel the need for more handgun I would step up to something like the 454 Casul or the 460 You could also go with something like the 500 S&W but, with the other two, you could use 45 colt as a light load. Also, there is at least one carbine available in 454 Casul, made by Rossi. I don't understand why Marlin has yet to make a gun that can handle at least the 454 Casul if not the 460.

What ORO said, no gun is any good to you if it ain't on you when you need it. Again, that Ruger Vaquero is looking pretty good. The barrel is short enough not to be unweildy and the gun isn't that heavy. Since it is a fixed sight gun ther is nothing to hang up when drawing from the holster. I have carried two of these for more than 8 hours at a stretch as a Cowboy action shooter, one should be no problem.

 

[doc2rn]

I voted other cause I carry my 44 mag on a chest rig 24/7 when out in the back country.

 

[ArmedBear]

Camping where? Grizzly country, or around here with black bears?

I like the 4" 629 Mountain Gun. No heavier than it's .357 cousins (a bit lighter than my 4" 686), easy to carry, plenty powerful.

I've only spoken with one person who had a genuinely scary encounter with a black bear. It ran when he fired a shot into the dirt in front of it. Our local bears are interested in two things: eating your camp food, and getting far away from humans. Sometimes these conflict, of course, but the results are seldom deadly.

Don't forget raccoons, badgers, wolverines, wolves, coyotes, rattlesnakes, etc. Most of what you might have to shoot to protect your dog, or even yourself (a couple of those animals are ornery and can really hurt you), isn't all that big. Chances are, you won't have to shoot anything, ever. But of course, the consequences of being attacked can be very bad.

Biologists and rangers I've talked to about cougars have all said the same thing: if you are going to be attacked in the woods, you'll be the last to know. Around here, they have plenty of livestock to eat; deadly cougar encounters seem to happen more in places where the urban/wildland interface is different from what we have here.

None of that is to say that you shouldn't carry a gun. I do. Sometimes it's a pocket .38, with a few snake loads mixed with JHPs. It's also been a hi-cap .45 loaded with heavy bullets, or the Mountain Gun. But I haven't had to use any of them. I drew on a coiled up and rattling snake once (I didn't have my dogs with me), but it didn't do anything, so neither did I.

 

[Dr-Science]

The S&W (or some other sa/da revolver in .357), Glock (in .40, .357 or .45), or a 1911.

 

[Big_E]

Thanks everyone. Thanks ArmedBear, since you have been here longer than me I figure you know the lay of the land.

I will only be exploring around the southern part of Idaho. So, the forests/mountains slightly north of Boise and maybe wandering around the valley/desert area all around us. I expect the forests to be black bear country around here but wear are the grizzlies located? Up by Sandpoint? F&G didn't have grizzlies mentioned on their website so I figured they are extremely rare.

I'm glad that I have had more votes for the .357, it will allow me to set some money aside for a nicer range toy that I need and ammo.

 

[ArmedBear]

Not much. I just have a habit of engaging people in conversations. Nobody ever seems to mind telling stories about camping, hunting, bears, etc. if you get them started.

I figured they are extremely rare.

They are, but if you talk to the locals, you'll hear a slightly different slant. They'll say the bears are around, but F&G doesn't want people up there looking to hunt them, because they are rare. But you might see them. Can't tell what's true.

This much I can say: you're far more likely to have a dangerous territorial encounter with a moose or a rutting bull elk up there, than with a big bear. Those ungulates are big, and potentially deadly. Again, rare, but it happens.

 

[Onward Allusion]

Another vote for the 357 but the .357 SIG in the form of a Glock 31. It will give you the extra rounds in a crunch. Also, you can change it up to 9mm or 40S&W for the range for less than 1/2 the price of another pistol (especially the 40S&W)

Big_E
Thanks everyone. Thanks ArmedBear, since you have been here longer than me I figure you know the lay of the land.

I will only be exploring around the southern part of Idaho. So, the forests/mountains slightly north of Boise and maybe wandering around the valley/desert area all around us. I expect the forests to be black bear country around here but wear are the grizzlies located? Up by Sandpoint? F&G didn't have grizzlies mentioned on their website so I figured they are extremely rare.

I'm glad that I have had more votes for the .357, it will allow me to set some money aside for a nicer range toy that I need and ammo.

 

[Robert]

Dunno if it is better, but I carry my 1911 and my Marlin 1895G when camping. I figure if 45-70 can't handle the issue then it might just be my time to go...

 

[jfdavis58]

I just gotta ask. Why isn't your first line of defense pepper spray, noise makers like bells & whistles and just plain old common sense? Maybe it is and I'm reading too much into your inquiry.

I've encountered several mountain lions while out hiking-even day hiking. Only once did it actually cause me concern. We sorta snuck-up on each other and got to bad breath distance before either of us realized fully what had happened. I made like I was big-arms out, jacket open, she made like she was small hunched-up, tail down and we both backed away slowly---exhilarating!

Except for hunting, I've never had a bear get close enough to raise concern. I know too much field craft to make myself a target intentionally and when just out hiking (especially with family or friends) I'm sure I/we make far too much noise stumbling over things and talking for any smart bear to want to get close.

Before anyone gets their panties in a bunch, I do carry a 357mag into back country as a matter of simple prudence-but in this day & age it's more likely my adversary will be two-legged and ugly---bears and mountain lions are rather 'purty' if you can stand the smell. Given a multi-day hike, any reason I'll often slip my dad's old model 94 (30-30) into the pack-straps too.

My selection of guns is really based on something less tangible than immediate self defense. An old lever-action saddle gun and a worn modern revolver in old leather attract very little attention-especially from open-space law enforcement. They fit the scene. Can the same be said of a combat shotgun tricked with a folding stock? I carry that same analogy/question into the selection of ammo. Big heavy lunker bullets without all the street-smart 'features' in the handgun and standard heavy weight hunting ammo in the rifle.

 

[ArmedBear]

Why isn't your first line of defense pepper spray, noise makers like bells & whistles and just plain old common sense?

Those are mine.

I was up in the mountains last night, looking for the aurora borealis that never happened. I had a .45 with me, but really only because I figure there's no point in owning it if it sits in the safe. Might as well toss it into the Jeep.

Bears probably would love those rosemary potatoes one guy made on the camp stove. But we didn't see or hear any, and the dogs with us probably would have warned us if anything was around. Bring loud, funny camping companions, and you don't need bells or noisemakers. Those are just for hiking alone or with quiet buddies.

 

[Big_E]

Oh I can be pretty loud and annoying when I need to be. I do have bear mace and I only would use the sidearm as a third option. I am more worried about the cougars, bears I know usually run away unless you have food (sounds like me ). But, there is always the chance of a freak event where I smell better than beef jerky and protein bars.

 

[wow6599]

If brown bears are part of the discussion it's gotta be the 12 w/ OO buck followed by 3" slugs, IMHO.

 

[keyboard commando]

Other....

Take along a fat guy who can't run fast.

 

[Wolfeye]

For hiking, I generally carry a 4" .357 magnum or 6" .44 magnum, depending on whether there are "no bears" or "a few black bears" in the area. If there are any brown or grizzly bears, I pack either a longarm or pepper spray + a pocket gun depending on how much I plan to travel on foot. The pocket gun's not for animals, obviously.

If I had to pick just one gun, though, I'd pick the shotgun loaded with slugs & carry it on one of those rigs that hangs it off your chest. A shotgun won't do you any good if it's in the backpack!

 

[Defense Minister]

Glock 20, or 29, loaded with these http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/ca...ucts_id=105&osCsid=1gjkjc2kj7v7vgo4ljlbo14bv2 . The Glock is a lightweight pistol with a high magazine capacity that you will appreciate much more than a shotgun or large, steel-framed revolver when you've been carrying a backpack for several days. Trust me, I know.

But, if you're talking about Grizzly bears, go with the shotgun. Just don't put it in your pack where you can't access it quickly.

 

[browningguy]

WHen I am camping/hunting in bear country it's currently a Ruger Super Blackhawk in .44 Mag, but I would be ok with the .45 Colt and some heavy Corbon loads. Bigger is better when talking bears, even black bears.

 

[gun guy]

when in the back country i always wear my hand tooled cowboy holster with the classic ammo loops in the back, a stag handled knife, and a ruger blackhawk in 41 magnum. it doesnt put off the forest rangers, or other outdoor types like certain firepower type autos do. i have to agree with davis on that one its almost like something, someone in the wild is supposed to have. and it has adaquate hit for most any situation. if i'm going further in, i take along a 270 as well.

 

[Sweet]

Howdy, I live in bear country less than 60 miles from the last bear attack in the Soda Butte campground. I carry a old Vaquero 3" barrel w/ birdsheads gripframe in 45colt in a huckleberry rig. It is loaded with Hornady 300gr hp/xtp. I am a Cowboy Action Shooter so I am comfortable with the SA. I think what is most important is practice with the firearm you are carrying.

 

[Mainsail]

Are you camping or backpacking? If you're camping, which means you're using a camper (RV) you can carry almost anything. Backpacking is a whole different game. If you can backpack carrying a shotgun, chances are you're not going to be walking very far into the woods, which pretty much negates the need for the shotgun. I'll second the G20 suggestion. You have to balance weight vs power, the G20 is the best at doing that.

 

[ForumSurfer]

While I've never been in such a situation, I feel the shotgun wouldn't be the best choice. It would make me more comfortable than the others if it were in hand or slung on my shoulder.

If I needed it in a hurry, I rather have a potent handgun holstered on my side than draw a shotgun from my pack. It just seems that there's too many obstacles for it to snag on unless it is in some sort of designated snatch-and-grab-away device. Like others have said, sometimes you take that pack off. If you're wearing a sidearm in a holster, it is always there even if you get caught with your pants down.