Who Uses BB Birdshot for Home Defense Load?
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shoup dawg
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I've never had to use it. But (as many will probably also tell you) this is what I use:
3 birdshot
2 buckshot
2 slugs
I have a 7 round shotty.
3 birdshot
2 buckshot
2 slugs
I have a 7 round shotty.
barneyfife.357
Member
although I am not involved in the law, I believe that, in my state at least, (MO) the new CCW law considered personal protection at something rediculous like 21 feet (7 yds) even though I know nobody that can out run a bullet at that distance or further away, I plan to use the rounds inside the home, therefore I would consider bird shot just fine for HD; however, that is what I consider to be safe for innocent bystanders. Just my 2 cents
markk
Member
Check out what http://www.theboxotruth.com/ has to say on that subject.
Birdshot is a horrible horrible choice as a SD load. It doesn't penetrate and spreads too fast for accurate firing.
Read this discussion.
http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=315025&highlight=birdshot
Read this discussion.
http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=315025&highlight=birdshot
barneyfife.357
Member
though a valid argument, I am not running out to reload my shotgun with buckshot. first off, the report said that much of the birdshot struck the refrigerator, also it said that the person using birdshot was not a gun tech, especially with shotguns. he missed basically, the perp obviously did not.
for your own veiw, try it on a melon, I used a watermelon but anything would work. the furthest distance inside my home is about 30 feet, I set the melon up at 30 feet and fired no 6 bordshot and it did the job. at 10 yards the wad still hits, the pattern is still tight even out of my smooth bore 18" barrel.
granted much further, would have drastic differenes
for your own veiw, try it on a melon, I used a watermelon but anything would work. the furthest distance inside my home is about 30 feet, I set the melon up at 30 feet and fired no 6 bordshot and it did the job. at 10 yards the wad still hits, the pattern is still tight even out of my smooth bore 18" barrel.
granted much further, would have drastic differenes
I use to use it when I had an apartment. The walls were so thin and the neighbors just on the other side made me rethink using a 9mm Glock or "00" buck or slug.
So in that case I think it was more than justified. Now that I own a home and my nearest neighbor is about 50 feet or so also opposite sides of my entances, exits and windows I feel more safer using "00" or a slug-o.
So in that case I think it was more than justified. Now that I own a home and my nearest neighbor is about 50 feet or so also opposite sides of my entances, exits and windows I feel more safer using "00" or a slug-o.
camslam
Member
Who Uses Birdshot For Home Defense?
2 types of people:
People with special circumstances:
and...
People with no understanding of ballistics.
Not trying to offend, but seriously there is a reason it is called "bird" shot. Have you seen the size of most birds?
This topic has been discussed numerous times and each time I remind people that unless you are standing at point blank range when you fire birdshot at someone, usually it will cause them to have a bad day, but it isn't really an effective man stopper.
Get some 00 Buck and be prepared. JMHO.
2 types of people:
People with special circumstances:
and...
People with no understanding of ballistics.
Not trying to offend, but seriously there is a reason it is called "bird" shot. Have you seen the size of most birds?
This topic has been discussed numerous times and each time I remind people that unless you are standing at point blank range when you fire birdshot at someone, usually it will cause them to have a bad day, but it isn't really an effective man stopper.Get some 00 Buck and be prepared. JMHO.
Regolith
Member
I had 3" steel T (.20") shot loaded in my gun for a while, but I finally found some 00 buckshot locally (it was behind the counter, and the type face on the label was too small for me to read it at a distance; just had to ask the clerk ), so that's what I have in my gun now.
), so that's what I have in my gun now.Markk, first I've seen that http://www.theboxotruth.com/ site, boy do they look like they have fun!
And I should say that http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot3.htm shows the affects of a SG against drywall... in their "Box O' Truth"
And I should say that http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot3.htm shows the affects of a SG against drywall... in their "Box O' Truth"
MAX100
Member
Never ever use Birdshot for home defense unless that is all you have. #4 buck is the lowest you should go. There have been many test done, and Birdshot is never recommended. It lacks the ability to penetrate deep. The name Birdshot should tell you something.
Read This, By someone from another site:
Shooting in Butte, Montana
Shotgun preteen vs. illegal alien Home Invaders Butte, Montana November 5, 2006.
Two illegal aliens, Ralphel Resindez, 23, and Enrico Garza, 26, probably believed they would easily overpower home-alone 11 year old Patricia Harrington after her father had left their two-story home.
It seems the two crooks never learned two things: they were in Montana and Patricia had been a clay shooting champion since she was nine.
Patricia was in her upstairs room when the two men broke through the front door of the house. She quick ly ran to her father's room and grabbed his 12 gauge Mo ssberg 500 shotgun.
Resindez was the first to get up to the second floor only to be the first to catch a near point blank blast of buckshot from the 11-year-old's knee crouch aim. He suffered fatal wounds to his abdomen and genitals.
When Garza ran to the foot of the stairs, he took a blast to the left shoulder and staggered out into the street where he bled to death before medical help could arrive.
It was found out later that Resindez was armed with a stolen 45 caliber handgun he took from another home invasion robbery. That victim, 50-year-old David Burien, was not so lucky. He died from stab wounds to the chest.
Ever wonder why good stuff never makes NBC, CBS, PBS, MSNBC, CNN, or ABC news....
Now that is Gun Control"
With birdshot these two would have more than likely ended up in the hospital and possibly come back later on to finish the job.
GC
Read This, By someone from another site:
Shooting in Butte, Montana
Shotgun preteen vs. illegal alien Home Invaders Butte, Montana November 5, 2006.
Two illegal aliens, Ralphel Resindez, 23, and Enrico Garza, 26, probably believed they would easily overpower home-alone 11 year old Patricia Harrington after her father had left their two-story home.
It seems the two crooks never learned two things: they were in Montana and Patricia had been a clay shooting champion since she was nine.
Patricia was in her upstairs room when the two men broke through the front door of the house. She quick ly ran to her father's room and grabbed his 12 gauge Mo ssberg 500 shotgun.
Resindez was the first to get up to the second floor only to be the first to catch a near point blank blast of buckshot from the 11-year-old's knee crouch aim. He suffered fatal wounds to his abdomen and genitals.
When Garza ran to the foot of the stairs, he took a blast to the left shoulder and staggered out into the street where he bled to death before medical help could arrive.
It was found out later that Resindez was armed with a stolen 45 caliber handgun he took from another home invasion robbery. That victim, 50-year-old David Burien, was not so lucky. He died from stab wounds to the chest.
Ever wonder why good stuff never makes NBC, CBS, PBS, MSNBC, CNN, or ABC news....
Now that is Gun Control"
With birdshot these two would have more than likely ended up in the hospital and possibly come back later on to finish the job.
GC
Okiecruffler
Member
I swear this is the last time I post on one of these birdshot vs buckshot threads, that horse is just about pulp by now. I don't get my info from any website or gun mag, I guess I'm just not that savy. I get my evidence from over 15 years working in Level 1 ERs. Anyone who says that birdshot used at home defense ranges is anything less than lethal is smoking crack. Now granted, I've never seen what birdshot does to ballistics gel or wet phone books, only human tissue, so maybe my evidence won't hold up on the internet. Not everyone I've seen hit with birdshot at close range has come in flatlined, but none has pressed on an attack. I've also seen more than a couple of people bring themselves in or picked up off site who were hit with one or 2 buckshot, probably by someone who just pointed and pulled.
Now me, I like 000 buck, but the wife can't tolerate the recoil. She's perfectly fine with a good load of #4 bird. The distance from her side of the bed to the bedroom door is 13 feet. We've mapped these things out, we have a plan. And a plan trumps internet gibberish anyday of the week.
Or maybe I just woke up in a bad mood.
Now me, I like 000 buck, but the wife can't tolerate the recoil. She's perfectly fine with a good load of #4 bird. The distance from her side of the bed to the bedroom door is 13 feet. We've mapped these things out, we have a plan. And a plan trumps internet gibberish anyday of the week.
Or maybe I just woke up in a bad mood.
trackaddict88
Member
I gotta agree with the "bigger is better" crowd.
Those guys on the box 'o' truth sure do have some fun, huh?
And I only hope my stepdaughter will do the same as the little girl in the Montana link. Open borders and no consequenses=Home Invasions.
Those guys on the box 'o' truth sure do have some fun, huh?
And I only hope my stepdaughter will do the same as the little girl in the Montana link.
Open borders and no consequenses=Home Invasions.ltetmhs
Member
I ll take 54 pellets of high density T shot over 9 pellets of buck every day of the week dead coyote= dead intruder
barneyfife.357
Member
If I was too use a shot gun in HD( which I don't do to my floor plan) I would use bird shot. I live in a multi family home. Would bigger be better? you bet. I beleave that if you fill some ones face with shot, rather it bet #8 from a 410 or a 12 ga slug, they are going to stop what they are doing.
Here's a article about a LEO who was shot in the face by a SG birdshot load but was able to chase the BG and return fire at least 7 times. He will survive with full use of his eyes.
http://www.philly.com/philly/hp/news_update/20070924_Report__Police_officer_shot.html
Just a little while ago, someone posted another article with pictures of a man who survived being shot in the face with birdshot after encountering some men who shot his dog(s). Could use some hlep if someone can post link here.
Don't recall any articles of people surviving a full load of 00 buck to the face...
http://www.philly.com/philly/hp/news_update/20070924_Report__Police_officer_shot.html
Just a little while ago, someone posted another article with pictures of a man who survived being shot in the face with birdshot after encountering some men who shot his dog(s). Could use some hlep if someone can post link here.
Don't recall any articles of people surviving a full load of 00 buck to the face...
madcratebuilder
Member
I agree, for in-home defense, #4 well get the job done. People that don't believe it need to pattern their shotgun at 15 & 20 feet, It doesn't spread that much folks.
kmrcstintn
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- Joined
- Jan 5, 2006
- Messages
- 1,236
found this site on a whim, but great info...
http://www.tacticalshotgun.ca/ballistics_shotgun.html
just revisited the site after not being there for a while...REALLY DAMNED GOOD INFO!!!
http://www.tacticalshotgun.ca/ballistics_shotgun.html
just revisited the site after not being there for a while...REALLY DAMNED GOOD INFO!!!
ZeroJunk
Member
Anybody with an IQ in double figures knows that 00 Buck will penetrate deeper than bird shot.
But, bird shot at very close range, with the proper choke, can be quite devastating.
But, bird shot at very close range, with the proper choke, can be quite devastating.
ArchAngelCD
Member.
Birdshot is for birds, Buckshot is for Deer size targets. (man falls into that size range)
mugs79
Member
I live in a small apartment. I'm also in college.
I know that, reasonably, the only people likely to break in are those looking to steal my laptop or my ipod, or even a few text books.
Those people will, reasonably, be college drunks, or maybe perhaps dropouts.
I keep my bird gun, with it's 30 inch barrel, loaded with 12 gauge #2.
The same shot I use for duckies.
Because I know that, reasonably, the only people invading my apartment, lived in by 4 guys, will be petty thieves.
And for those petty thieves, the pump of my 870 will likely prove intimidating enough.
If not that, a few #2 bird shot rounds to the face or torso will be enough.
Yes yes, I know I know, should some hardened criminal decide it's time for me to die, bird shot will likely prove inadequate.
I'll take my chances. I feel no need to endanger my neighbors.
I'd rather have to be very careful I get my bird shot in the right spot, than to risk my neighbors.
And inspite of the dozens upons dozens who will disagree, I still stand by the intimidation power of a pump shotgun.
I know, I know, that bird shot isn't what you want to use when your life is on the line. But I still say that anything, anything will stop a lot of bad guys in their tracks.
Man size targets get killed best by buck sized shot.
But... for a lot, if not most, bad guys, any sized shot is going to prove itself intimidating as hell.
I know that, reasonably, the only people likely to break in are those looking to steal my laptop or my ipod, or even a few text books.
Those people will, reasonably, be college drunks, or maybe perhaps dropouts.
I keep my bird gun, with it's 30 inch barrel, loaded with 12 gauge #2.
The same shot I use for duckies.
Because I know that, reasonably, the only people invading my apartment, lived in by 4 guys, will be petty thieves.
And for those petty thieves, the pump of my 870 will likely prove intimidating enough.
If not that, a few #2 bird shot rounds to the face or torso will be enough.
Yes yes, I know I know, should some hardened criminal decide it's time for me to die, bird shot will likely prove inadequate.
I'll take my chances. I feel no need to endanger my neighbors.
I'd rather have to be very careful I get my bird shot in the right spot, than to risk my neighbors.
And inspite of the dozens upons dozens who will disagree, I still stand by the intimidation power of a pump shotgun.
I know, I know, that bird shot isn't what you want to use when your life is on the line. But I still say that anything, anything will stop a lot of bad guys in their tracks.
Man size targets get killed best by buck sized shot.
But... for a lot, if not most, bad guys, any sized shot is going to prove itself intimidating as hell.
I'd be concerned that if you point a shotgun at "petty thieves" when your life isn't in danger, then you could be in trouble.
An unloaded shotgun is "intimidating". If you actually need to use the thing it might be a signal that the intimidating factor didn't work.
Less likely your load is to harm your neighbors, the less effective it would be on Bubba and his friends. By the time birdshot spreads out to where there's actually a pattern, it's lost it's penetrating power.
People talk about the shotgun being really intimidating as if Bubba wouldn't mind getting shot with a handgun. A good firearms instructor told me a "secret" years ago. It's not the gun, necessarily they're afraid of.
It's YOU they size up. Criminals who've been in prison get pretty good at it.
An unloaded shotgun is "intimidating". If you actually need to use the thing it might be a signal that the intimidating factor didn't work.
Less likely your load is to harm your neighbors, the less effective it would be on Bubba and his friends. By the time birdshot spreads out to where there's actually a pattern, it's lost it's penetrating power.
People talk about the shotgun being really intimidating as if Bubba wouldn't mind getting shot with a handgun. A good firearms instructor told me a "secret" years ago. It's not the gun, necessarily they're afraid of.
It's YOU they size up. Criminals who've been in prison get pretty good at it.
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