Why do you think the movement is getting stronger for gun control? Why do you think more liberals / Democrats are taking over? Why do you think the majority of the population is starting to move to universal / global law? Have they all gone mad? Is there no loyality to our country any more? Why do you think this is happening if there's no benefit. For instance, I just heard a poll that says a mojority of Americans want to try the Bush administration for participating in torture - torture which saved the lives of countless Americans. I am getting so frustrated with the liberalization of our great country I wanna bop all the kool aid drinkers on the head and bring them back to reality! Why is it happening? Whew - I feel better.
Why do you think it's happening
- Thread starter mugsie
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Deanimator
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Getting stronger WHERE?
Here in Ohio, it's going the OTHER way.
Mousegun
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A universal (at least here in the U.S.) short memory about the happenings of 9/11. Maybe more apathy than a short memory and a case of time healing wounds than should never be forgotten.
Maybe something like a mob mentality with the new "one" and a group type go along with some of the idiots in the new administration that are calling for the trial. It seems we missed the trial of the tax evaders though.
The new admin is going to do all it can to control more and more guns and people that have them. It may be out of fear of an armed population or a false sense that control will make things all better again, who knows but I wouldn't worry too much if I had my own security force 24/7.
The one poll that I am afraid of is the first major one that comes out asking the question, "do you think America would be better as a socialist country?" The answer I suspect would be very disheartening.
Maybe something like a mob mentality with the new "one" and a group type go along with some of the idiots in the new administration that are calling for the trial. It seems we missed the trial of the tax evaders though.
The new admin is going to do all it can to control more and more guns and people that have them. It may be out of fear of an armed population or a false sense that control will make things all better again, who knows but I wouldn't worry too much if I had my own security force 24/7.
The one poll that I am afraid of is the first major one that comes out asking the question, "do you think America would be better as a socialist country?" The answer I suspect would be very disheartening.
expvideo
Member
It's not. There are two reasons that it feels that way:
-There are more gun owners now, so there is more discussion about it on internet forums.
-Gun shops have started using scare tactics to sell more products.
I agree with some of the posts above - it's not getting stronger, it's losing in both the public mind, the legislatures, and the courts. You're just reacting to scare tactics. And perhaps the other side gets more shrill as it loses, but it is not gaining. As an example, in 1986, only eight states had "shall issue" cc laws. Today 38 states do. That's a huge legal shift, and the trend is not being reversed.
I don't think this is really on topic - nor is it factually correct. The forum is for "general gun discussion" and the rules are posted at the top of the forum - it's not a political forum.
Mob mentality
The current wave of anti-gun sentiment is being propelled by both sides of the issue. We who are very pro-gun are talking it up as well as the other side. We do not have a choice, if we don't move quickly and decisively, the democommies will do more than 1994. Remember $125 Glock mags and such?
Also, many of those who would support anti-gun legislation are basing their decision on a pure emotions. My sister will almost literally throw-up if she touches a gun. Why? I will never know. No bad experiences with them and she grew up in the same home as I. My brother-in-law has to do his gun buying low key to keep peace in the house.
If you have eve been to NYC, being gunless is normal there.
The current wave of anti-gun sentiment is being propelled by both sides of the issue. We who are very pro-gun are talking it up as well as the other side. We do not have a choice, if we don't move quickly and decisively, the democommies will do more than 1994. Remember $125 Glock mags and such?
Also, many of those who would support anti-gun legislation are basing their decision on a pure emotions. My sister will almost literally throw-up if she touches a gun. Why? I will never know. No bad experiences with them and she grew up in the same home as I. My brother-in-law has to do his gun buying low key to keep peace in the house.
If you have eve been to NYC, being gunless is normal there.
Since the sunset of the AWB a few examples, we have a substantial increase in
States issuing CCW
States issuing CCW on a "must issue basis"
States incorporating 2A explicitly in their state constitutions
"Castle doctrine" and "no duty to retreat"
Relaxation or removal of state level bars on SBR's and suppresor ownership
AR and other EBR ownership at all levels
Heller
etc
etc
There have been local problems, NJ and California as examples but even in CA we have a real 2A incorporation challenge at the circuit level in hand right now.
Stay aware and vigilant, yes
Chicken Little syndrome, no
States issuing CCW
States issuing CCW on a "must issue basis"
States incorporating 2A explicitly in their state constitutions
"Castle doctrine" and "no duty to retreat"
Relaxation or removal of state level bars on SBR's and suppresor ownership
AR and other EBR ownership at all levels
Heller
etc
etc
There have been local problems, NJ and California as examples but even in CA we have a real 2A incorporation challenge at the circuit level in hand right now.
Stay aware and vigilant, yes
Chicken Little syndrome, no
sjohn26
Member
"Why do you think the movement is getting stronger for gun control? Why do you think more liberals / Democrats are taking over? "
1st thing a tyrannical government does is disarm the populace to minimize any resistance!
1st thing a tyrannical government does is disarm the populace to minimize any resistance!
The country as a whole is shifting towards Socialism and federal power.
More and more people want the federal government to have more and more power.
This means lessened reliance on personal responsibility as the people insist that the government do everything for them.
Disarmament goes along with this dependent, serf mentality.
Since the voters elected a Socialist, anti-American president last November and installed in power the party dedicated to tuning America into a Communist state I have been very depressed and despondent. I truly feel that the country I was born in no longer exists. We now live in the United Socialist States of America.
I am glad that I am old and won't live too much longer.
More and more people want the federal government to have more and more power.
This means lessened reliance on personal responsibility as the people insist that the government do everything for them.
Disarmament goes along with this dependent, serf mentality.
Since the voters elected a Socialist, anti-American president last November and installed in power the party dedicated to tuning America into a Communist state I have been very depressed and despondent. I truly feel that the country I was born in no longer exists. We now live in the United Socialist States of America.
I am glad that I am old and won't live too much longer.
TexasRifleman
Moderator Emeritus
Where is it getting stronger?
No bans currently in the works, Heller decided on our side, more states with concealed carry than ever.
Yep, sounds like things are really bad
No bans currently in the works, Heller decided on our side, more states with concealed carry than ever.
Yep, sounds like things are really bad
Not so much dumbing down, but a distortion of history. Textbooks being written now with a PC version of historical events and the increasingly liberal stance of the school systems. :banghead:
Also, the antis feel empowered now with the coronation of The Chosen One and his minions like Emanual and Holder.
Claude Clay
Member
written now with a PC version of historical events
.......the attempted peaceful intervention at the O K Corral turned violent when some of the wrong thinking individuals acted out inappropriately.
.......the attempted peaceful intervention at the O K Corral turned violent when some of the wrong thinking individuals acted out inappropriately.
PryItFromMyColdDeadHands
Member
i thought we were on the winning side right now?
Duke of Doubt
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O.K., early this morning I made a telephone call to a source well-placed in the new administration who I've known personally for over seventeen years.
He couldn't and wouldn't comment on any gun regulation plans of the new administration other than what has been announced re: the Tiahrt Amendment. But he DID confirm that a senior administration official is well aware of Gun Rush 2008, and perhaps surprisingly, the Presumptuous One is taking stock.
Nice, though the proof of the pudding is in the eating.
He couldn't and wouldn't comment on any gun regulation plans of the new administration other than what has been announced re: the Tiahrt Amendment. But he DID confirm that a senior administration official is well aware of Gun Rush 2008, and perhaps surprisingly, the Presumptuous One is taking stock.
Nice, though the proof of the pudding is in the eating.
Duke of Doubt
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HexHead: "Not so much dumbing down, but a distortion of history. Textbooks being written now with a PC version of historical events and the increasingly liberal stance of the school systems."
It's true. Most kids have no knowledge of our history whatsoever, other than a few trivial matters and labor/social movements blown out of all proportion to serve a political agenda.
Ask anyone under 25 what happened in 1989, and they look at you like you may as well have said 1985 ... or 1885.
It's true. Most kids have no knowledge of our history whatsoever, other than a few trivial matters and labor/social movements blown out of all proportion to serve a political agenda.
Ask anyone under 25 what happened in 1989, and they look at you like you may as well have said 1985 ... or 1885.
Since you specifically asked for a why opinion I feel comfortable answering from a religious perspective.
If Christian beliefs offend you, you may wish to stop reading now
I believe all this is happening because we are approaching the end of the age ( This is actually a specific reason that I chose to arm myself). As the end of the age approaches the world will be come more vile , people will become crueler and more hateful and the world will become a very dangerous place. At some point the Bible states the one man will emerge ( No it's not Obama) to rule the world politically, economically and spiritually.
Now back to our topic, the only way this could happen is if there was a paradigm shift away from the ideals of national soveriegnty.
I believe we are seeing the begining of that shift and I believe that the "Communitarians" are working toward our disarmement to that end.
I didn't post this to open a religious debate it merely represents my take on the issue at hand
If Christian beliefs offend you, you may wish to stop reading now
I believe all this is happening because we are approaching the end of the age ( This is actually a specific reason that I chose to arm myself). As the end of the age approaches the world will be come more vile , people will become crueler and more hateful and the world will become a very dangerous place. At some point the Bible states the one man will emerge ( No it's not Obama) to rule the world politically, economically and spiritually.
Now back to our topic, the only way this could happen is if there was a paradigm shift away from the ideals of national soveriegnty.
I believe we are seeing the begining of that shift and I believe that the "Communitarians" are working toward our disarmement to that end.
I didn't post this to open a religious debate it merely represents my take on the issue at hand
Tommygunn
Member
To the extend there is a perception of an antigun movement, the forces are taking advantage of the fact that we now have a democratic president and the kongress is under Democrat control, so they are trying to pressure them to move on the issue since they believe they will have a greater likelihood of success now than under Dubya.
OTOH I am being pestered galore by requests from the N.R.A. and other pro 2A groups for donations, so the same thing has energized the pro-rights community.
OTOH I am being pestered galore by requests from the N.R.A. and other pro 2A groups for donations, so the same thing has energized the pro-rights community.
ConstitutionCowboy
member
Why is it happening? Ask Adolph. Oh, wait, he's dead.
As for the anti-gun-rights movement, those involved are simply kicking and screaming harder and louder 'cause they are losing ground.
Watch out for placating legislation that is designed to leave all the underlying infringements in place, such as nation-wide concealed carry laws, and the like.
Watch out for little amendments to major legislation that'll slowly and incrementally destroy our ability to maintain our effectively armed and well regulated status. The deviants in Congress are clever enough to come up with the seemingly most innocuous taxes or regulations aimed at certain chemicals and metals that can drive ammo and arms manufacturing costs through the roof.
Woody
As for the anti-gun-rights movement, those involved are simply kicking and screaming harder and louder 'cause they are losing ground.
Watch out for placating legislation that is designed to leave all the underlying infringements in place, such as nation-wide concealed carry laws, and the like.
Watch out for little amendments to major legislation that'll slowly and incrementally destroy our ability to maintain our effectively armed and well regulated status. The deviants in Congress are clever enough to come up with the seemingly most innocuous taxes or regulations aimed at certain chemicals and metals that can drive ammo and arms manufacturing costs through the roof.
Woody
I'm going to sound typically cynical here, but the voting masses are malleable and tend to blow with the wind. To the average American, the Bush administration was an unmitigated disaster (actually, I would agree this, though not for the reasons that most would cite - I was and am most concerned about the unchecked spending and the expansion in the size and power of the federal government - that administration was hardly "conservative" by any traditional measure). If we were presently in a time of unprecedented prosperity, you could say with absolute certainty that we would still be run by the same general group of people - Bush could practically have painted portraits of himself on federal buildings and his designated successor would still have been elected. Instead, we suffered a nasty economic meltdown which was driven by factors not directly under the control of the federal government (to suggest otherwise indicates a gross misunderstanding of basic economic principles). The housing and credit crisis are closely related, and there is actually some evidence that government intervention in the markets exacerbated that problem. Nevertheless, I digress.
Given the state of things, people were easily moved by the idea of "change," which is precisely the idea that Obama rode to victory. Really, few of them understand the fundamental differences between the two political parties, if indeed there really are any (note, again, the Bush administration's massive overspending and government expansion).
Frankly, we as an active political group absolutely dwarf our opponents - compare the size and wealth of the Brady Campaign or similar to the NRA, for example. There is no comparison. However, we are also far smaller than the politically apathetic masses, who don't care one way or another and are, as I said, easy to manipulate. There was actually little to no protest when the Clinton AWB expired in 2004, and there is likely to be little or on protest if a new one is put into place. Either way, these people simply don't care. Gun control is scarcely a footnote in the average voter's mind - and given the political alliances that anti-gun activists have built, it's easy enough for them to push their agenda when the right people get into office without raising much protest amongst the constituency. People did not vote for Obama on the basis of his purported gun control policies - many probably don't even know what they are (in fact, they were buried even on his campaign website) - but nevertheless, it is what it is and we have to deal with the potential consequences. Remember: it isn't the will of the people, it's the will of the people who participate. 99% of the country could oppose gun control, but if the 1% who didn't were running Congress, we'd be SOL.
Right now, I'd say that we are actually in the the stronger position, given the Heller ruling as well as the prevalence of CCW and the proliferation of castle doctrine - but we can't rest on our laurels. I would not be surprised to see some attempt at a renewed AWB (a classic political football in modern times) or some legislation aimed at gun/ammo registration and various taxes on ammunition or firearms themselves.
Given the state of things, people were easily moved by the idea of "change," which is precisely the idea that Obama rode to victory. Really, few of them understand the fundamental differences between the two political parties, if indeed there really are any (note, again, the Bush administration's massive overspending and government expansion).
Frankly, we as an active political group absolutely dwarf our opponents - compare the size and wealth of the Brady Campaign or similar to the NRA, for example. There is no comparison. However, we are also far smaller than the politically apathetic masses, who don't care one way or another and are, as I said, easy to manipulate. There was actually little to no protest when the Clinton AWB expired in 2004, and there is likely to be little or on protest if a new one is put into place. Either way, these people simply don't care. Gun control is scarcely a footnote in the average voter's mind - and given the political alliances that anti-gun activists have built, it's easy enough for them to push their agenda when the right people get into office without raising much protest amongst the constituency. People did not vote for Obama on the basis of his purported gun control policies - many probably don't even know what they are (in fact, they were buried even on his campaign website) - but nevertheless, it is what it is and we have to deal with the potential consequences. Remember: it isn't the will of the people, it's the will of the people who participate. 99% of the country could oppose gun control, but if the 1% who didn't were running Congress, we'd be SOL.
Right now, I'd say that we are actually in the the stronger position, given the Heller ruling as well as the prevalence of CCW and the proliferation of castle doctrine - but we can't rest on our laurels. I would not be surprised to see some attempt at a renewed AWB (a classic political football in modern times) or some legislation aimed at gun/ammo registration and various taxes on ammunition or firearms themselves.
Sato Ord
Member
It's not that it's getting stronger, it's just getting louder, and the liberal media is eating it up. Not only are the proponents of gun control screaming louder than ever, one of them is now in the white house, so he gets a lot of attention from the press.
Add to that things like having Bill - give me some wax to loosen my zipper - Clinton jump on the band wagon faster than he could jump on a White House staffer, and it gets even more attention.
The thing is, there are more firearms in the hands of private citizens than ever before, and the numbers are still climbing. Unfortunately the vast majority of folks who do own firearms tend to be down to earth people who just want to go their own way and live their lives peacefully without imposing their will on their neighbors.
The other side of the issue is full of people who sleep with a night light, and can't close their eyes at bedtime unless they have the security of the police watching over them, even though such security is an illusion.
They want to be cared for, and have mommy and daddy dispatch the boogie-man like when they were six. Wrapping their little minds around the fact that personal security might involve some personal responsibility is just more than they can handle, so they drink the cool-aid and buy into the BS that no one needs to have a nasty old gun to defend themselves, and that only bad people would want one of those terrible things.
They also believe that the police can protect them, that criminals will obey the new gun control laws, and most likely that the tooth fairy will leave them a quarter if they put a tooth under their pillow.
I have a Latin expression for those types of folks:
Caesar si viveret
ad remum da resis
If caesar were alive, you'd be chained to an oar!
Add to that things like having Bill - give me some wax to loosen my zipper - Clinton jump on the band wagon faster than he could jump on a White House staffer, and it gets even more attention.
The thing is, there are more firearms in the hands of private citizens than ever before, and the numbers are still climbing. Unfortunately the vast majority of folks who do own firearms tend to be down to earth people who just want to go their own way and live their lives peacefully without imposing their will on their neighbors.
The other side of the issue is full of people who sleep with a night light, and can't close their eyes at bedtime unless they have the security of the police watching over them, even though such security is an illusion.
They want to be cared for, and have mommy and daddy dispatch the boogie-man like when they were six. Wrapping their little minds around the fact that personal security might involve some personal responsibility is just more than they can handle, so they drink the cool-aid and buy into the BS that no one needs to have a nasty old gun to defend themselves, and that only bad people would want one of those terrible things.
They also believe that the police can protect them, that criminals will obey the new gun control laws, and most likely that the tooth fairy will leave them a quarter if they put a tooth under their pillow.
I have a Latin expression for those types of folks:
Caesar si viveret
ad remum da resis
If caesar were alive, you'd be chained to an oar!
Last edited:
bonza
Member
The current administration was not elected on the gun control issue, but rather on a combination of a "what Obama will do for me" & a "anyone but Bush (Republican)" mentality.
Duke of Doubt
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bonza: "The current administration was not elected on the gun control issue, but rather on a combination of a "what Obama will do for me" & a "anyone but Bush (Republican)" mentality."
I have to agree. Around here, most of the Osama vote was not made on the basis of race either, but instead because a huge percentage of those people expect big "stimulus" checks to come their way, and for the government somehow to keep them in a house they cannot afford. Those voters are already running scared, and I am no comfort to them. When they ask me if I think the latest boondoggle will work, I look at them like they've asked about the Tooth Fairy, and say, "Of COURSE not." They actually seem surprised and mildly hurt. Gun control is the last thing on their mind; even the Osama voters around here are gun nuts.
I have to agree. Around here, most of the Osama vote was not made on the basis of race either, but instead because a huge percentage of those people expect big "stimulus" checks to come their way, and for the government somehow to keep them in a house they cannot afford. Those voters are already running scared, and I am no comfort to them. When they ask me if I think the latest boondoggle will work, I look at them like they've asked about the Tooth Fairy, and say, "Of COURSE not." They actually seem surprised and mildly hurt. Gun control is the last thing on their mind; even the Osama voters around here are gun nuts.
ScotZ
Member
A once Independent people have started to become dependant on a central government to solve its problems. I blame the "gun fear" on the social shift from an agrarian society to an urban manufacturing/service society. We are moving from personal accountability to social accountability. When a society starts to make excuses for its individual members actions instead of holding them accountable,down is the only way to go. We have two choices, buck up and be accountable or digress into a "big brother" style government.
I live in Ohio and believe that "enough is enough" is the general feeling. People are tired of liberal judges legislating from the bench. Weather it is deserved or not. GW Bush has brought on much of the anti conservative movement. I will not debate if that is true or not. It is simply an observation I have made over the last eight years.
I live in Ohio and believe that "enough is enough" is the general feeling. People are tired of liberal judges legislating from the bench. Weather it is deserved or not. GW Bush has brought on much of the anti conservative movement. I will not debate if that is true or not. It is simply an observation I have made over the last eight years.
Obama said in his bail-out address that "government is the only entity that can save the economy from collapse"
I'm just waiting for a tragic public shooting and Obama coming out and saying "government is the only entity that can save our children from gun violence"
It comes down to a majority of people who are unwilling to take responsibilty for their own success and safety electing leaders who make promises of roads paved in gold and safety for all.
I'm just waiting for a tragic public shooting and Obama coming out and saying "government is the only entity that can save our children from gun violence"
It comes down to a majority of people who are unwilling to take responsibilty for their own success and safety electing leaders who make promises of roads paved in gold and safety for all.
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