Why is .40S&W so popular?

[wingnut]

No, I really, really don't want to start some long argument between everyone's favorite caliber and its "stopping power". Let's not do that, ok?

But I am truly curious as to why .40 caliber is currently so popular. If research dictates one can have maximized magazine capacity, less recoil, quicker follow-up shots, cheaper more readily available ammo with 9mm as compared to .40 AND .45 seems to be a "softer" perceived recoil (more of a push than a snap), less muzzle flip, and a bigger hole as compared to .40, then why do so many law enforcement professionals, and many of the general public (including many of you) go with .40 these days? It seems to be extremely popular.

I don't always buy the argument that it is the "best compromise" between 9mm and .45 either. Sometimes when you consider 9mm is great for all its reasons and .45 is great for its reasons, when you settle right in the middle of the road between the two you end up with something that is not great in any of those reasons. Compromise between two great things is worse IMO than being great at one end of the spectrum or the other. But maybe .40 has its own great qualities. What are they?

Remember, I'm a newbie to all this, and I don't have real life experience with these calibers like many of you do. I'm just basically comparing on paper. So, please teach me what makes .40 so good?

-WingNut

 

[browningguy]

Well to start part of your argument may be wrong:

Compromise between two great things is worse IMO than being great at one end of the spectrum or the other.

You may not believe in compromise, but billions of people on the planet do. I have pistols including .25, .32, .380, 9x19, .40, .45 suitable for carrying. And almost all the time I carry a .40. Good power level, high capacity, what's not to like.

If you don't like the .40, don't get one. But no reason to try to keep others from owning and enjoying them.

 

[S&W620]

As much as you are going to hate to hear it, it's because of the compromise!

I look at it like this. I like high capacity. I'm not saying high caps are the be all end all, but when given the choice I prefer a magazine that holds more rounds.

Also, in a defensive situation, I value a round that has a bit more weight behind it.

Combine these two and you end up with the .40 S&W. In my USP I get 13 rounds of a 180 grain hollowpoint at my disposal. I like that combo.

This is not to say that I don't like the feel of shooting a .45 or the price/capacity of 9mm, but to me the blend of the two qualities works. Of course in the process you do lose some of the positive qualities of both calibers, but you also gain some of the positives of both calibers.

 

[ArmedBear]

Seems it really got popular with the AWB. Here in CA, where we still have magazine size restrictions, a lot of people still figure they'd rather have 10 .40's than 10 9's.

 

[Intrepid Dad]

The .40 S&W isn't a compromise, it's the best of both worlds. It has the lower cost and higher capacity of a 9mm and the greater bullet weight and punch of the .45 ACP. That's why it's my first choice of caliber for my CCW.

 

[mikec]

In my USP I get 13 rounds of a 180 grain hollowpoint at my disposal. I like that combo.

An XD in .45ACP hold 13 in the mag plus one in the chamber. (Factory mags) For some reason the .40 S&W XD has 12 round mags.

The .40 is popular because some police agencies went to them to overcome some "issues" with the 9x19. The issues may be real or imagined, you decide. Then civilians started buying the guns.

 

[GTSteve03]

I'm not really sure either, honestly.

You get just as good penetration/expansion from high-quality 9mm loads as you do with 40 loads, and you get more capacity/less recoil.

Or, you can get better expansion and equal penetration from a high-quality 45 bullet, again with less recoil, at the expense of capacity.

But, to each their own, thankfully we live in a (mostly) free country where we have the choice!

 

[stevereno1]

It's a heavier caliber that fits maximum rounds in a 9mm. frame. A g-17 holds 17 rounds of 9mm, and a g-22 holds 15 rounds in the same frame. 180 gr jhp vs 124 jhp in 9mm, 147 at max for the 9. 9mm rounds fit into a .40 mag, and some .40 sw mags are interchangeable with astra and sig 9mm's, allowing for more 9mm rounds to be had. used to have to know that kind of stuff during the clinton gun-ban years

 

[S&W620]

mikec, I'm not quite sure I understand what you are getting at.

Sure, the XD holds more rounds of .45 but for the most part pistols tend to hold more .40 S&W rounds than .45ACP. There are exceptions, but I'm speaking in generalities.

Also, I fail to believe the general public buys particular guns just because LEO's carry them. Folks tend to buy what works, regardless of who carries/uses them.

 

[12131]

Right or wrong, I think things started rolling after the 1986 FBI Miami shootout, where the 9mm was deemed not an adequate "man stopper". Not sure why, but the 10mm never caught on. Then came the .40 S&W. Once LE agencies started adopting it, we lowly civilians just followed them. Just my theory.

 

[wingnut]

Compromise vs Best of Both worlds

So most of you feel it's not a real compromise (meaning middle of the road yields loss of the best aspects of the extremes) but rather it's truly the best of both worlds (realizing some of what makes the others great may be lost, but most of those are not)? Does that make sense? You're saying it's best of both worlds, not settling for a compromise? Interesting.

 

[jmr40]

I'm in the camp that believes the .40 is not a compromise, but is better than either the 9 or .45. Yes, it does have more recoil, but it is mild compared to the .357 mag revolvers I used when I started shooting handguns.

For good or bad the 9mm and .45 ACP earned their reputations during WW2 and Vietnam. One thing that I consider to be a factor that is seldom discussed is the size of people today. The average German soldier probably only weighed 150-160 lbs, and a Japanese or Vietnamese soldier was probably less than 140. Bad guys today could easily weigh double that.

 

[easyg]

But I am truly curious as to why .40 caliber is currently so popular.

Because it offers the power of a .45ACP with nearly the magazine capacity of a 9mm....all in a medium sized weapon that doesn't require gorilla hands to hold comfortably.

In my opinion, the recoil is not a problem and follow-up shots are easy and fast too.

The recoil is'nt too much of a problem because .40's generally have more powerful springs and heavier slides to help manage the recoil.

IMO, when it comes to autoloaders, the .40S&W and .357Sig are the best available.

 

[S&W620]

Well said jmr40.

For those who feel the recoil is too "snappy" and what not, shoot a magnum revolver sometime.

The recoil isn't even comparable.

 

[gallo]

I think the .40 S&W cartridge's popularity stems a little from people's relentless quest to find a magic bullet, a man stopper, combined with a high capacity magazine.

The .357 magnum is a fine bullet but it kicks too much to facilitate follow-up shots and it can carry at most 8 bullets, but most commonly 6.

Are there numbers to prove the .40 S&W is better than the .45acp or the 9mm? I don't think so. Each cartridge has its loyal supporters, and each bullet if placed correctly is equally lethal. There is not a point in the human anatomy where one of these bullets would be lethal and the other would not.

A great part of winning a fight, as in the case of LEO, is having confidence in the weapon and it's ammo to do the job. A small part, though not one to be neglected, is the cheer physics of the round. It is heavier and more pressurized, so when the bullet hits it penetrates plenty and makes a bigger hole than the 9mm.

So in conclusion, if you can handle the recoil and the extra cost of the ammo, by all means, make the .40 S&W your bullet of choice. If you like to shoot a lot and not break the piggy bank, get a 9mm -- 100 years of history credit it with being an excellent choice.

 

[Harley Quinn]

I carry numerous various calibers around myself, starting with 357 Sig and going up from there. But I do believe the 40 is a good round especially in the 165/180 area.

I am leaning toward the 400 Corbon because of my G 21 ability (I have a barrel) The 10mm is good.
But according to many tests the 40 is now the all around best one...Why most police are carring it. It is a little harder to shoot (over the 9mm) and the reason that most LEO women will not go for it, if they can (not all though) they will shoot, or go for the 9mm. Quanity of more in the mag helps in the 9mm IMHO

40 is a great choice.

 

[DerbyDale]

12131 Wrote: Right or wrong, I think things started rolling after the 1986 FBI Miami shootout, where the 9mm was deemed not an adequate "man stopper". Not sure why, but the 10mm never caught on. Then came the .40 S&W. Once LE agencies started adopting it, we lowly civilians just followed them. Just my theory.

You're right about the Miami shootout. It is what pushed the FBI to find a more "effective" round. The 40S&W was developed by S&W and Winchester to be more powerful than the 9mm, but easier to shoot than the 10mm.

There is some argument (which I agree with somewhat) That the performance edge once held by the 40S&W has been eaten way at by todays quality 9mm defensive rounds like the Winchester Ranger +P+ Law Enforcement Only. The expansion rate, penetration, and energy of todays 9mm +P+ rounds are far better than the rounds used back in the 80s, and has closed the gap between the 9mm and 40S&W.

 

[CPshooter]

Just for the record, the XD .45 holds 13 because the grip is freaking huge. An XD .40 holds 12, but has a MUCH more comfortable and practical sized grip.

I agree with the .40 being popular due to the comprimise. The .45 is great because it has stopping power. That's it though. Otherwise it's expensive, harder to conceal, and allows for a low magazine capacity. The 9mm is cheap and high capacity, but isn't known for its stopping power like .45 is.

Most .40 rounds out of a sub 5" barrel have more kinetic energy than .45s do anyways. You can also squeeze 13 rounds into a Glock 23 sized pistol. What's not to like? It's cheap to buy too! I personally like the .40s&w.

 

[gomakemeasandwich]

Well to start part of your argument may be wrong:

Quote:
Compromise between two great things is worse IMO than being great at one end of the spectrum or the other.
You may not believe in compromise, but billions of people on the planet do. I have pistols including .25, .32, .380, 9x19, .40, .45 suitable for carrying. And almost all the time I carry a .40. Good power level, high capacity, what's not to like.

If you don't like the .40, don't get one. But no reason to try to keep others from owning and enjoying them.

Whether he is wrong or not, he is still allowed to say why he thinks so. If he doesn't like the .40, he has a right to say why.

 

[gomakemeasandwich]

Don't know.

 

[TAB]

I think one of the reason the 40 got a bad rap when it came to recoil was firing it from light wieght( and normally plastic) guns.

All of us know that if you fire .38s from a "ultra light" snubby its going to bark more then fring it from the same gun in steel.

I personally think the 40 is a good choice for alot of people. I would personally rather have a gun in 10mm or 45 acp. Part of that is the fire power, part is I can only have 10 round mags.

 

[Rexster]

It took a long time for .40 S&W to become popular among private citizens. For years, it was mostly a law enforcement round, and some predicted that if another cartridge became fashionable for LE, the .40 would die off. The ammo was priced quite high for years. A good comparison is the .357 SIG, which is mostly an LE cartidge nowadays, expensive, not too popular among the public, and predicted to die off. As for .40 being a compromise, it may have been presented that way by some, but nobody considered the .38 WCF, aka .38-40, a compromise in its day. The .38 WCF, a true .40, fired a 180-grain bullet at about the same velocity as a current 180-grain .40 S&W load. Several gunwriters who were LE-oriented had urged the production of what became the .41 magnum, a cartridge which nearly died off, largely because it was just a bit too powerful for most officers to control. I think the .40 S&W largely validates the idea of the .41 for police use, but packaged in a different envelope. Do I think the .40 S&W is the best out here? Well, no, I like the .357 SIG and .357 mag more, but I am perfectly content carrying the .40 as my mandated duty cartridge. When I retire, I can always swap .357 SIG barrels into my P229 pistols, and pack .45 Colt sixguns for fun.

 

[DWARREN123]

It is a good caliber that comes in some outstanding platforms.

 

[hotpig]

The 40 got off to a slow start but picked up when Glock started giving away(almost) the G22/23 to LE Agencies. Since it is not a shabby round and gun was cheap it gained popularity in the LE world. The consumer market is generally pretty quick to follow LE.

Seven years ago the mfg told those of us on the LE side that the 357Sig would replace the 40 cal as the premier LE round. So far none of the Fire arms mfg are going to bat on it.

 

[amprecon]

I was a 9mm and .45acp fan, thinking that the .40S&W didn't really fill any special niche. Hearing about the harder recoil, larger muzzle flash, gun frames cracking and so on and so on, I never really gave it much consideration.
I took my Glock 19 and my friend brought his Glock 23 to shoot some targets, we traded guns for curiosity's sake, and it was then that I realized that the .40S&W wasn't the monster everyone had made it out to be. The recoil wasn't imposing at all, muzzle flash wasn't the bolt of lighting as it was described and it was as accurate as my Glock 19.
So I started looking at the .40S&W cartridge a little closer. What I discovered was that for the 9mm to be as "good" as it needs to be it needed to be in +P special defensive ammunition, which cost more. Whereas the standard defensive ammunition for the .40S&W cost about the same as the +P 9mm defensive ammunition.
They were the very exact same sized guns, the .40S&W carrying 2 less rounds than the 9mm.
So my deduction was that why not have a more powerful and larger caliber in the same sized gun as the 9mm and not have to pay more for the defensive +P ammunition. I will concede that 9mm practice ammunition is cheaper than the .40S&W, but my "practice" ammo in .40S&W is more effective than the "practice" ammo in the 9mm if that is all I have on hand at any one given time.