Why join the NRA, anyway?
- Thread starter MicroBalrog
- Start date
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FPrice
Member
MicroBalrog...
"You're only a violent criminal when you commit violent crimes."
No, once a violent criminal, always a violent criminal. But in this case, if you had bothered to read the source you would have seen that is was directed towards
"Specific Groups Targeted by the Strategy:
Previously convicted felons who possess guns and/or armed persons involved in drug or violent crimes."
"And, yes, I believe that when criminals serve their time, ALL their rights should be restored."
Unfortunately for this point of view, too many violent criminals retain these behaviors even after they "serve their time". Look at all the second, third, and fourth offenders out there.
I support previous offenders having their rights restored when they show that they have changed. Perhaps KABA has determined a way to shwo when this has happened? Taking the view that a criminal should regain all their rights immediately upon their release from prison sounds like a nice idea, but like many nice-sounding ideas it is based upon an ideal situation and not the reality involved in criminal behavior.
"You're only a violent criminal when you commit violent crimes."
No, once a violent criminal, always a violent criminal. But in this case, if you had bothered to read the source you would have seen that is was directed towards
"Specific Groups Targeted by the Strategy:
Previously convicted felons who possess guns and/or armed persons involved in drug or violent crimes."
"And, yes, I believe that when criminals serve their time, ALL their rights should be restored."
Unfortunately for this point of view, too many violent criminals retain these behaviors even after they "serve their time". Look at all the second, third, and fourth offenders out there.
I support previous offenders having their rights restored when they show that they have changed. Perhaps KABA has determined a way to shwo when this has happened? Taking the view that a criminal should regain all their rights immediately upon their release from prison sounds like a nice idea, but like many nice-sounding ideas it is based upon an ideal situation and not the reality involved in criminal behavior.
geekWithA.45
Moderator Emeritus
Wow! I can't believe this thread has progressed so far without mention of the 800 lb gorilla!
A THR First!
And since I broached the topic of the gorilla, I'll point something out:
The gorilla may be interested mainly in Hunting bananas, is ham fisted, and tends to knock stuff over as it galumphs around.
That doesn't mean he has no uses to us, and it doesn't mean that a few well timed whaps with a stick won't convince him not to go certain places, for example, "cleaning up S. 1805 in committee".
Is it a perfect gorilla?
Nope.
Is it a dangerous gorilla?
Rule 1: Gorillas are always loaded
, and bear close watching.
Can it be taught?
It looks like it can.
How do we make it better?
When voting for the NRA board, scrutinize your votes for duckhunters, (say, from NJ) and don't vote for them!
Someone here said it best: I hunt a few weeks out of the year, and I support RKBA 365/24/7.
A THR First!
And since I broached the topic of the gorilla, I'll point something out:
The gorilla may be interested mainly in Hunting bananas, is ham fisted, and tends to knock stuff over as it galumphs around.
That doesn't mean he has no uses to us, and it doesn't mean that a few well timed whaps with a stick won't convince him not to go certain places, for example, "cleaning up S. 1805 in committee".
Is it a perfect gorilla?
Nope.
Is it a dangerous gorilla?
Rule 1: Gorillas are always loaded
, and bear close watching.Can it be taught?
It looks like it can.
How do we make it better?
When voting for the NRA board, scrutinize your votes for duckhunters, (say, from NJ) and don't vote for them!
Someone here said it best: I hunt a few weeks out of the year, and I support RKBA 365/24/7.
FPrice
Member
Announcement!
I am taking a break to go get some Chinese food for dinner. I'll be back shortly. In the meantime, carry on without me.
I am taking a break to go get some Chinese food for dinner. I'll be back shortly. In the meantime, carry on without me.
MicroBalrog
member
So basically either people who have committed a crime earlier in their lives (regardless of their current lifestyle) or people committing victimless crimes.
A nice example of the inherent insanity is the Bob Stewart case.
So let's say Tom, Dick, and Harry walk out of Club Fed after serving ten years each.
Harry goes out and makes a living as a truck driver. He buys an 870 to carry in his truck.
Tom goes out and makes a living as a pizza delivery driver, gets a Glock-17 to carry in his car.
Dick goes and robs an elderly lady with a Lorcin.
All three of them go to prison again. ***?
Bartholomew Roberts
Member
No you do not understand correctly. NRA spent $1.23 million on lobbying AND $1.4 million in soft money AND $1.57 million in PAC money in 2000 for a total of $4.2 million on all three.
Furthermore, NRA did this only with donations from mail solicitations. Unlike GOA, they do not get to use the $30/year membership money for political activities. That money gets spent on the magazine, ranges, safety classes, Eddie Eagle, etc.
GOA spent $4.1 million on lobbying with their five in-house lobbyists (Craig Fields, Michael Hammond, Larry Pratt, Erich Pratt and John Velleco). For comparison, it took the NRA 36 different registered lobbyists across six different law firms (not including in-house lobbyists) to spend even a quarter of that. For more comparison, look at this list:
http://www.opensecrets.org/pubs/lobby00/lobby.asp
It is a list of 128 professional lobbying firms (not in-house) and how much money they took in from ALL of their clients combined. GOA would have ranked higher than 101 of those firms based on what they spent in-house.
JohnBT
Member
The NRA sells a 1 Year Associate Membership for $10.00 (no magazine).
Great horny toads, spend the ten bucks get on with your life. I wasted $20 of my time skimming through this thread.
As far as Project Exile goes, if they're carrying a gun unlawfully, well, they're as close to being a violent felon as anyone can be. Aren't they?
When they get out of jail and go back to dealing and carrying guns they deserve to get sent to an out of state jail where their momma can't come see 'em.
John
Great horny toads, spend the ten bucks get on with your life. I wasted $20 of my time skimming through this thread.
As far as Project Exile goes, if they're carrying a gun unlawfully, well, they're as close to being a violent felon as anyone can be. Aren't they?
When they get out of jail and go back to dealing and carrying guns they deserve to get sent to an out of state jail where their momma can't come see 'em.
John
MicroBalrog
member
IDF private's salary - $60
No, why?
Like Bob Stewart?
No, why?
Like Bob Stewart?
MicroBalrog
member
Bartholomew Roberts
Member
Boats, you aren't comparing apples to oranges. Check the disclaimer on your link:
"The organizations listed below were the biggest donors to federal candidates and political parties in the election cycle. The numbers combine all PAC, soft money, and large ($200+) individual contributions made by the organization, its employees, officers and their immediate families. Subsidiaries and affiliates are also included in the totals. Not included is money spent independently on issue ads or donations to political party conventions, legal defense funds, presidential inaugurations or post-election recount funds."
GOA spent almost all of its money on lobbying and very little ($83k) on PACs - so none of it is recorded in the list you show. Lobbying covers things like golf vacations in the Bahamas for 20 Congressmen and yourself to "discuss RKBA policy" but doesn't count as a donation to a campaign or party.
http://www.opensecrets.org/lobbyists/indusclient.asp?code=Q13&year=2000
ReadyontheRight
Member
El Tejon - Well said Sir.
I would also suggest to get involved in local politics and even state or national politics.
Art Eatman
Moderator In Memoriam
MB, considering this is about the third or fourth go-round on this general subject, you ought to give thanks for the courtesy and politeness of the responses.
Since this IS the "umpteenth" go-round, and even the polite responses are repetitive, I think this thread has gone far enough.
Art
Since this IS the "umpteenth" go-round, and even the polite responses are repetitive, I think this thread has gone far enough.
Art
MicroBalrog
member
I believe at least one point I brought up has been new, namely the Congressional Hearings reference.
FPrice
Member
MicroBalrog...
I'll see your link and raise you one.
http://www.house.gov/judiciary/earlatt.htm
And I'll go back to an earlier idea of mine, that there is no idea so good and a corrupt person cannot make something bad of it. PE in it's earliest form was targeted at violent criminals, not your imaginary Tom, Dick, and Harry. Well, Dick maybe.
Despite my earlier harsh language I wish we could keep this going on a higher, more civil plane.
I'll see your link and raise you one.
http://www.house.gov/judiciary/earlatt.htm
And I'll go back to an earlier idea of mine, that there is no idea so good and a corrupt person cannot make something bad of it. PE in it's earliest form was targeted at violent criminals, not your imaginary Tom, Dick, and Harry. Well, Dick maybe.
Despite my earlier harsh language I wish we could keep this going on a higher, more civil plane.
Shooter 2.5
Member
- Joined
- Dec 29, 2002
- Messages
- 476
Why join the NRA, anyway?
They are the only gun group the media ever mentions.
They are the only gun group the anti-gun politicians ever mention.
Because the NRA is the only National gun group that actually accomplishes anything.
They are the only gun group the media ever mentions.
They are the only gun group the anti-gun politicians ever mention.
Because the NRA is the only National gun group that actually accomplishes anything.
MicroBalrog
member
FPrice: Project Exile in it's current form is nothing more than enforcement of the current law. We don't need a gun law for Dick - we already have a law against robbing people. I suggest removing firearms rights shouldn't be mandatory, it should be a judge's option, and then for violent crimes only.
They are the only gun group the media ever mentions.
http://www.ccrkba.org/video/demguns.wmv
We have just covered some of their brightest ones.
It is an NRA-supported bill that included the first ever federal BAN on firearms, you know...
They are the only gun group the media ever mentions.
http://www.ccrkba.org/video/demguns.wmv
We have just covered some of their brightest ones.
It is an NRA-supported bill that included the first ever federal BAN on firearms, you know...
MicroBalrog
member
Why? Am I working for some gun org or something that I need to trot out someone's accomplishments?
The topic of this thread is the NRA, not some other gun group.
I oppose the FOPA-86, the GCA-68, the NFA-34 etc. I think they're immoral.
The NRA thinks they should be enforced and uses it's power to advance that.
Why should I pay money that will be used to immoral causes?
El Tejon
Member
Micro, the NRA of today is not the NRA of 1934. I wish 1977 was not necessary. I wish that the NRA was fighting for civil rights then. It was not.
I can whine all day on the Internet. I can stamp my feet and bang on the table. I can point out what an NRA president said 70 years ago. However, I cannot go back in time.
I am glad 1977 happened and believe we owe much to Harlon Carter. To honor him we stay in the fight and work as he did.
The NFA is unconstitutional, inane and immoral. So was slavery. We shoud work to ensure its abolition. As with slavery, it will be a long hard struggle as there are those that defend the NFA as there were those that defended slavery. So be it.
I cannot go back in time, but I can pull the wagon today so those behind me do not have to.
I can whine all day on the Internet. I can stamp my feet and bang on the table. I can point out what an NRA president said 70 years ago. However, I cannot go back in time.
I am glad 1977 happened and believe we owe much to Harlon Carter. To honor him we stay in the fight and work as he did.
The NFA is unconstitutional, inane and immoral. So was slavery. We shoud work to ensure its abolition. As with slavery, it will be a long hard struggle as there are those that defend the NFA as there were those that defended slavery. So be it.
I cannot go back in time, but I can pull the wagon today so those behind me do not have to.
MicroBalrog
member
And the NRA today, as 70 years ago, supports this law.
You still haven't answered the Key question:Why should I give money to support something I don't?
$25 can make for a copy of Innocents Betrayed, you know...
Art Eatman
Moderator In Memoriam
Bashing makes all of us look dumber'n hammered dirt. Okay, here's the deal: For about a month or so, if not more, there ain't gonna be any bashing of any gun group by anybody who favors some other gun group. At the moment, things seem reasonably calm in D.C., so keeping a wary eye on "the enemy" there is a Good Thing. Otherwise, for a month or so, all pro-gun folks love all other pro-gun folks. We can all go to neck-hugging and kissin' and makin' up and practicing amicability.
, Art
, Art- Status