WI: need young, attractive females
- Thread starter Monkeyleg
- Start date
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All but one of the women who posted here and who emailed me or sent me a pm thought using women to sell guns was a bad idea. If you want to get more women involved in shooting and/or voting the way you need them to, you may want to consider listening to them, and maybe even giving up ogling gun chicks. Think of it as a sacrafice for the cause.
1911Tuner
Moderator Emeritus
re:
Having met with Missashot and her husband on a few occasions, I can state without reservation that she is not only NOT a raging feminist who is looking for a reason to be offended...she is very much a lady. Very feminine, soft-spoken, very pretty, and has the most charming smile and "Southern Belle" accent that I've had the pleasure of coming under the influence of in a long time. She is also a strong woman who can and will voice her opinions without being confrontational or "In Your Face" with her views. She is one of those women who can disagree with you and make you like it.
We now return you to our regularly scheduled flame war...
(Juuuuuuuuust kiddin' Barbara!)
Having met with Missashot and her husband on a few occasions, I can state without reservation that she is not only NOT a raging feminist who is looking for a reason to be offended...she is very much a lady. Very feminine, soft-spoken, very pretty, and has the most charming smile and "Southern Belle" accent that I've had the pleasure of coming under the influence of in a long time. She is also a strong woman who can and will voice her opinions without being confrontational or "In Your Face" with her views. She is one of those women who can disagree with you and make you like it.
We now return you to our regularly scheduled flame war...
(Juuuuuuuuust kiddin' Barbara!)
xring44
Member
If I had a pink corvette & wanted to sell it at a auto show, I'd be looking at young attractive males to hawk the wares, thinking that it would probably be bought by some hawt chick----those poor attractive males would be subjected to some downright smokin' looks by those ladies.
I know how it is to be looked at like a side of beef Oops, left out the word "don't" between the first and third words on the last sentence
I know how it is to be looked at like a side of beef
Oops, left out the word "don't" between the first and third words on the last sentenceBarbara, it probably is a bad idea to use women to sell guns -- I think it is -- but you're just as guilty of commodifying our sex as the men are: individuals are entitled to make up their own minds about what actions they will or will not take. It would be quite immoral for us to compel them.
If some adult woman wants to pose nude in a magazine aimed at a male readership, that's her free choice to make; you and I aren't obliged to buy it or even approve of it.
Those Barbie-doll-shaped young things lounging on next years offerings at the car show are not there at gunpoint. They chose to be there.
--Herself
If some adult woman wants to pose nude in a magazine aimed at a male readership, that's her free choice to make; you and I aren't obliged to buy it or even approve of it.
Those Barbie-doll-shaped young things lounging on next years offerings at the car show are not there at gunpoint. They chose to be there.
--Herself
bromdenlong
Member
- Joined
- Mar 2, 2006
- Messages
- 106
demographic balance
I haven't been to that many gun shows, but the people behind the tables that I have seen have been predominantly middle-aged to elderly white men.
Seems to me that the NRA et. al. need to reach out to blacks, hispanics, jews, younger people, gays/lesbians (gotta dig the pink pistols)and women in all these groups, perhaps especially soccer moms - basically everyone who doesn't fit the NRA stereotype.
Now that I think on it, college students of all persuasions may be the most important audience of all. Future molders of public opinion and all that.
I'm sure all of this has been said before on THR. Apologies if this is dull and repetitive. But if a significant increase in the numbers of minorities, college students and soccer moms in the NRA could be effected, we'd stand a much better chance of politically marginalizing the antigun activists.
I'm a hetero white male. The government, big business, etc. - 'the system', if you will - is supposedly set up to favor guys like me. I still don't trust government enough to let them have all the guns. It completely floors me that gun control is so popular among groups who have traditionally been oppressed by that same system. But maybe that's a subject for another thread. I guess this one got hot enough.
I haven't been to that many gun shows, but the people behind the tables that I have seen have been predominantly middle-aged to elderly white men.
Seems to me that the NRA et. al. need to reach out to blacks, hispanics, jews, younger people, gays/lesbians (gotta dig the pink pistols)and women in all these groups, perhaps especially soccer moms - basically everyone who doesn't fit the NRA stereotype.
Now that I think on it, college students of all persuasions may be the most important audience of all. Future molders of public opinion and all that.
I'm sure all of this has been said before on THR. Apologies if this is dull and repetitive. But if a significant increase in the numbers of minorities, college students and soccer moms in the NRA could be effected, we'd stand a much better chance of politically marginalizing the antigun activists.
I'm a hetero white male. The government, big business, etc. - 'the system', if you will - is supposedly set up to favor guys like me. I still don't trust government enough to let them have all the guns. It completely floors me that gun control is so popular among groups who have traditionally been oppressed by that same system. But maybe that's a subject for another thread. I guess this one got hot enough.
Yep, and the CEOs selling them are there by choice, too. But not many women make the choice to be CEO, do they?
So, why not?
I'm not saying it should be illegal, and anyone, male or female, can do what they want to, as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else. But I'm going to keep asking the questions because I think its important.
My goal in life isn't to make people happy. It's to change the way things are. Being accused of combativeness isn't really an issue for me.
So, why not?
I'm not saying it should be illegal, and anyone, male or female, can do what they want to, as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else. But I'm going to keep asking the questions because I think its important.
My goal in life isn't to make people happy. It's to change the way things are. Being accused of combativeness isn't really an issue for me.
NineseveN
member
It's not even whether or not it is a bad idea, it's whether or not it's an idea that is worthy of contempt and near damnation. Monkeyleg is asking for volunteers, not forcing employees or people to do this. He wants females, of their own free will, that can attract others and be appealing at a fundraiser...
What in the world is so outrageous about that? It's not like he gave measurements or sexual performance requirements. It seems to me that some folks just need something to gripe about. For all of your trouble Monkeyleg, you should have just hired Hooters girls if this was going to be the reaction anyway.
What in the world is so outrageous about that? It's not like he gave measurements or sexual performance requirements. It seems to me that some folks just need something to gripe about. For all of your trouble Monkeyleg, you should have just hired Hooters girls if this was going to be the reaction anyway.
Working Man
Member
WOW... that took way too long to get through.
I almost forgot what the first post was about.
I think that having women there will help attract other women. As stated
before it helps with their comfort level. I've been to enough shows to see
how many men talk down to women when it comes to firearms. These are
fools who will continue to lose sales but may also drive a few women away
from gun ownership and support.
I think the biggest issue is Monkeyleg's wording, not his intent.
Will pretty girls get his booth noticed? Yes. By women? Maybe/maybe not.
Does sex sell? Yes. Does it sell guns? No. At least as a real gunny I hope not.
Maybe because I'm young (29), idealistic, or just practical.....
but Dorothy holding a firearm provocatively or dressed like Marry Ann won't
make a sale to me. Show me how it ripped a big hole through the Tin Man
or some downed lions, tigers, and bears, now you have my attention. Drop
the Wicked Witch with one shot and that puppy is sold. Demonstrate how
it's Gilligan proof and I'll buy two. A Beach Babe selling (your gun here)
won't make me buy two and rest my head between them.... I wouldn't even
buy one unless it is what I wanted at a good price. Even then who knows,
bimboism is a real turn off.
Now if she can demonstrate how to take it apart and clean it, knows all the
different loads for it, knows the effective range and practical uses for it,
and is not pushy.... well that's a different story.
If T&A was as strong as some want you to believe I'd have a truck I didn't
really want right now.
I almost forgot what the first post was about.
I think that having women there will help attract other women. As stated
before it helps with their comfort level. I've been to enough shows to see
how many men talk down to women when it comes to firearms. These are
fools who will continue to lose sales but may also drive a few women away
from gun ownership and support.
I think the biggest issue is Monkeyleg's wording, not his intent.
Will pretty girls get his booth noticed? Yes. By women? Maybe/maybe not.
Does sex sell? Yes. Does it sell guns? No. At least as a real gunny I hope not.
Maybe because I'm young (29), idealistic, or just practical.....
but Dorothy holding a firearm provocatively or dressed like Marry Ann won't
make a sale to me. Show me how it ripped a big hole through the Tin Man
or some downed lions, tigers, and bears, now you have my attention. Drop
the Wicked Witch with one shot and that puppy is sold. Demonstrate how
it's Gilligan proof and I'll buy two. A Beach Babe selling (your gun here)
won't make me buy two and rest my head between them.... I wouldn't even
buy one unless it is what I wanted at a good price. Even then who knows,
bimboism is a real turn off.
Now if she can demonstrate how to take it apart and clean it, knows all the
different loads for it, knows the effective range and practical uses for it,
and is not pushy.... well that's a different story.
If T&A was as strong as some want you to believe I'd have a truck I didn't
really want right now.
1911Tuner
Moderator Emeritus
Outrageous
9-7 spake:
>It's not even whether or not it is a bad idea, it's whether or not it's an idea that is worthy of contempt and near damnation. Monkeyleg is asking for volunteers, not forcing employees or people to do this. He wants females, of their own free will, that can attract others and be appealing at a fundraiser...
What in the world is so outrageous about that?<
**********************
Pretty much sums it up, I'd say.
As long as someone's personal choices don't infringe on my rights or cost me any hard-earned green, my attitude is...et sic, suum cuique.
9-7 spake:
>It's not even whether or not it is a bad idea, it's whether or not it's an idea that is worthy of contempt and near damnation. Monkeyleg is asking for volunteers, not forcing employees or people to do this. He wants females, of their own free will, that can attract others and be appealing at a fundraiser...
What in the world is so outrageous about that?<
**********************
Pretty much sums it up, I'd say.
As long as someone's personal choices don't infringe on my rights or cost me any hard-earned green, my attitude is...et sic, suum cuique.
Originally posted by CB900F:
What I was trying to say, is that the thread was labeled VERY inappropriately.
If he insists on having females to run his table, maybe he should have said "Knowledgeable females wanted to run a gun table".
Not "Young attractive females". I would like to see someone run a table that knows something about it. I HATE it when you try to ask someone a question and they just giggle and go "I don't know" and they are there only because they are pretty. That applies to ANY situation. Whether it is at a gun show, car show, a shop in the mall, or anywhere else. I feel like if you are going to be selling something you need to know something about it.
I assure you that my post was not a knee jerk reaction.
1911 Tuner:
Thank you for the kind words.
I did start in the beginning. I read every post. I usually read everything before I reply to any thread.
What I was trying to say, is that the thread was labeled VERY inappropriately.
If he insists on having females to run his table, maybe he should have said "Knowledgeable females wanted to run a gun table".
Not "Young attractive females". I would like to see someone run a table that knows something about it. I HATE it when you try to ask someone a question and they just giggle and go "I don't know" and they are there only because they are pretty. That applies to ANY situation. Whether it is at a gun show, car show, a shop in the mall, or anywhere else. I feel like if you are going to be selling something you need to know something about it.
I assure you that my post was not a knee jerk reaction.
1911 Tuner:
Thank you for the kind words.
Bolding mine. I have seen the above implication well more than once in this thread, and it's completely false.
Dick is not involved in an endeavor to sell guns using women. He never implied as much. He certainly does not deserve to be even inadvertently accused of the same. He was attempting to enhance attendance at a pro-gun affair by having a few appealing ladies work the tables.
This is no way degrades women. If anything it degrades men by showing how gullible they can be to fork out more cash or attend an event because there’s a nice looking female near by.
Fact: Men (most) are attracted to women. Also, a good percentage of men will show more interest in a product when pretty ladies are associated with the product. No man associated with this forum would dare admit to being part of this category
, but it works and marketing is tailored around what works.I hope you get as worked up when you see a guy pumping iron on a BowFlex commercial. That poor SOB. Being taken advantage of by that mean corporation. Oh the humanity.
:banghead:PS -- It may be a good idea to be sure there is a real true injustice instead of going all berzerker-feminist looking for things where they do not exist. It may lead others to think, "cry wolf" when you really need our help to rally for support.
Working Man
Member
I get what you're saying but bad analogy with the BowFlex. That is suppose
to show you what you can achieve buy using the product. Well I guess there
are lots of products I need to stay away from because I do not want to be
top heavy.
Kramer Krazy
Member
Edit - I guess I didn't word this well enough for some people here
As someone who actually has a degree in Marketing (EDIT) like it really means anything.........ever consider this about having "attractive women" at your booth, (EDIT) depending on the how you present these women.......
1) You attract people who are not interested in anything at your table
2) These people block your table/display from those who really are interested
3) Because of a crowd of female gawkers, some people refuse to go near your table at all
4) Some people get offended and take note to NOT support you and your product/cause
5) Word spreads that you are a sexist-pig
6) Men who happen to be with their significant other get in trouble for even looking in the direction of your table......heaven forbid they mention a word about going over to it.
7) Add any more you wish to add.......
I've seen similar things at guitar shows (EDIT) but to great extremes. One vendor hired women in bikinis to walk around holding a guitar with a sign to visit this guy's booth. You'd hate to imagine the comments made about him, his "hired whores", and his product made by others at the show. (EDIT) THIS is not normal at a guitar show, so it was frowned upon.....
On the other hand, (EDIT) an effective way to do this, I know a woman who is married to a member of the Hell's Angels. They have a friend who has a table at several area bike show/swap meets and he gets her to run his table for him. The difference is that she dresses as she always does (jeans and T-shirt), but she grew up around bikes and bikers (her father was a patch holder) and knows the product better than most of the customers. There's nothing worse, as Missashot mentions, asking the woman behind the table a question and she knows absolutely nothing about what you just asked. It's always, "Honey....this gentleman would like to know......". Ideally, I think you need to find women like Missashot........she has her conceal carry permit/has more guns/shoots more often/reloads more than most guys I know.....then again, I helped create that "gun monster".
(EDIT) - I sure hope this better represents what I was trying to say. In a situation like this, where it is not the norm to showcase "attractive women" to attract viewers (such as at car shows where the majority of the women involved know nothing other than the car is "pretty"), there *can* be very negative reactions.
As someone who actually has a degree in Marketing (EDIT) like it really means anything.........ever consider this about having "attractive women" at your booth, (EDIT) depending on the how you present these women.......
1) You attract people who are not interested in anything at your table
2) These people block your table/display from those who really are interested
3) Because of a crowd of female gawkers, some people refuse to go near your table at all
4) Some people get offended and take note to NOT support you and your product/cause
5) Word spreads that you are a sexist-pig
6) Men who happen to be with their significant other get in trouble for even looking in the direction of your table......heaven forbid they mention a word about going over to it.
7) Add any more you wish to add.......
I've seen similar things at guitar shows (EDIT) but to great extremes. One vendor hired women in bikinis to walk around holding a guitar with a sign to visit this guy's booth. You'd hate to imagine the comments made about him, his "hired whores", and his product made by others at the show. (EDIT) THIS is not normal at a guitar show, so it was frowned upon.....
On the other hand, (EDIT) an effective way to do this, I know a woman who is married to a member of the Hell's Angels. They have a friend who has a table at several area bike show/swap meets and he gets her to run his table for him. The difference is that she dresses as she always does (jeans and T-shirt), but she grew up around bikes and bikers (her father was a patch holder) and knows the product better than most of the customers. There's nothing worse, as Missashot mentions, asking the woman behind the table a question and she knows absolutely nothing about what you just asked. It's always, "Honey....this gentleman would like to know......". Ideally, I think you need to find women like Missashot........she has her conceal carry permit/has more guns/shoots more often/reloads more than most guys I know.....then again, I helped create that "gun monster".
(EDIT) - I sure hope this better represents what I was trying to say. In a situation like this, where it is not the norm to showcase "attractive women" to attract viewers (such as at car shows where the majority of the women involved know nothing other than the car is "pretty"), there *can* be very negative reactions.
Last edited:
NineseveN
member
At what part did reading comprehension and context fall off of the face of the earth in this discussion. Monkeyleg never, ever asked for cheap chicks with their thongage flashing, he didn't go to the sluttymodel web forums, he came to the High Road; a place where gun knowledge and enthusiasm is paramount and asked for young (subjective term) attractive (again, subjective) women to help at a fundraiser involving firearms rights.
All of this silly nonsense about hiring whores to pimp products and degrading women in scantily clad outfits is completely irrelevant to the topic at hand and a net full of red herrings. He came here, to the High Road. Am I the only one that finds it obvious what this pretty well defined member of our community was looking for? Again, it sounds like some people were just looking for a reason to get upset or to spout some anti-sexism or feminist horse poo. How do you people make it through your average day making so many completely unsupported leaps and assumptions in trying to assert your dominance on an issue that is not even part of the discussions at hand?
Please, for the sake of relevance, give it a rest already. :banghead:
All of this silly nonsense about hiring whores to pimp products and degrading women in scantily clad outfits is completely irrelevant to the topic at hand and a net full of red herrings. He came here, to the High Road. Am I the only one that finds it obvious what this pretty well defined member of our community was looking for? Again, it sounds like some people were just looking for a reason to get upset or to spout some anti-sexism or feminist horse poo. How do you people make it through your average day making so many completely unsupported leaps and assumptions in trying to assert your dominance on an issue that is not even part of the discussions at hand?
Please, for the sake of relevance, give it a rest already. :banghead:
Henry Bowman
Senior Member
Amen, NineseveN!
Monkeyleg is doing a huge amount of frontline work to bring CCW to Wisconsin. Can't he catch a break?
Monkeyleg is doing a huge amount of frontline work to bring CCW to Wisconsin. Can't he catch a break?
Kramer Krazy
Member
I decided to slightly edit my post #143, above. I guess I wasn't getting my point across the way I was hoping to.
Justin
Moderator Emeritus
This one's definately gone off track.
Perhaps it was the initial post was phrased, or perhaps something else.
There's certainly nothing wrong with asking for female volunteers to show up to an event for reasons of diversity, or possibly even sex appeal.
In the end it all depends on how you want to present yourself, and how your volunteers present themselves.
There's a big difference between a woman dressed up like a Playboy Bunny and a woman dressed professionally and capable of making an intelligent pitch to others.
Perhaps it was the initial post was phrased, or perhaps something else.
There's certainly nothing wrong with asking for female volunteers to show up to an event for reasons of diversity, or possibly even sex appeal.
In the end it all depends on how you want to present yourself, and how your volunteers present themselves.
There's a big difference between a woman dressed up like a Playboy Bunny and a woman dressed professionally and capable of making an intelligent pitch to others.
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