Wilderness protection ideas when hiking?

[roscoe]

ShooterMcGavin,

The ballistics of the 10mm place it between the .357 and the .41 mag, probably closer to the .357. Plenty of people carry .357 in bear country - a 3" SP101 is our woods gun because my wife is more comfortable with a revolver. With 200 grain hardcast loads at 1300 fps, it can really penetrate.

I do, however, also have a .45LC Blackhawk that can shoot loads hotter than .44 mag (nowadays you can buy .45LC ammo that is hotter than .44 mag). The Blackhawk is single-action, however. Taurus makes a fairly handy 5-shot .44 magnum called the Tracker, although I have no personal experience with it.

There are a ton of threads here and at TFL on bear defense - all out of proportion to the likely threat. Still, however, I carry the hardcast loads with them in mind. You can always use them in the much more likely event of a person threatening you. I would not want to be hit in the sternum with a hardcast 10mm load.

The main advantage of the 10mm auto over a revolver is capacity and the fact that follow-up shots are quicker. The polymer frame of the Glock 20 soaks up some of the recoil, also, making target re-acquisition easier, in my experience. The Glock 29 in 10mm is on my list as the next purchase because is it so light and powerful.

If you are really backpacking for distance, weight is a major concern. I personally think that the Glock 29 represents one of the best compromises in terms of packability and capability, but the SP101 is pretty good, too.

The other thing I was going to recommend is a Wilderness Safepacker holster - it makes a handgun look like just another piece of gear, yet the pistol is immediately available should you need it.

 

[ZeSpectre]

Well if you really want penetration from a pistol you need a CZ-52 in 7.62x25 use some nice Czech ball and the job is done!

 

[Vern Humphrey]

About 30 years ago or so, a gang of men took a young girl out onto the military reservation at Fort Benning, Georgia, raped and beat her, then ran over her. A fisherman saw it all, and stayed hidden until the gang left, then got help for her. He later told the press that he always carried a gun when fishing, except on the military reservation, where it was forbidden. So all he could do was wait for them to leave.

 

[waytoofunky]

National Forests/National Parks CCW question

How about this question?

Now, I have to figure out how to carry (only for protection, of course) in a National Park area. Isn't it universally illegal??

I for one would really appreciate someone clearing this up for me!

Thanks!

 

[ZeSpectre]

The answer to the question is... yes it's illegal in national PARKS but we've been handed a situation on a silver platter to do something about it.

See this thread.

National FORESTS on the other hand are subject to the state rules (which is why I spend a lot more time in George Washington National Forest than I do at Shenandoah National Park.


Please go to the thread mentioned above and after you have the information then contact your representatives!

We need a long steady push on this one.

 

[KnifeLawGuy]

ShooterMcGavin wrote:

David, I have also read quite a bit about Glock's unsupported chamber, and KBs. Did they change the chamber design for the G20, to allow the use of the higher pressure 10mm?? I hate to admit it, but the thought of buying a Glock makes me shudder. I know their reliability is legendary, but the grip and overall feel when shooting the gun... It's just not for me. Even though, I still spend a fair amount of time reading at glocktalk.com.

The M&P40 claims to have a fully supported chamber (no semi-auto is 100% supported), but I will go back and see if there are any warnings with non-jacketed ammo.

Will I run into some serious cleaning headaches when shooting the non-jacketed WFNGC ammo??

I don't know if Glock did anything special with the G20 chamber, although the barrel seems quite beefy, to use a technical term. Some folks replace the factory Glock barrel with an aftermarket barrel with traditional lands and grooves rifling and a "fully" supported chamber in order to shoot non-jacketed ammo.

You're right, if the Glock doesn't feel right for you or fit your hand well, you probably won't shoot it well, and so you're probably better off getting something else. Having confidence in whatever you carry is important.

Since I don't shoot non-jacketed ammo in my Glocks, I can't say what cleaning with the non-jacketed ammo would be like.

Have a great day.

Stay sharp, stay safe,
david.

 

[roscoe]

By the way, if you really can't stand the Glock, EAA Witnesses are available in a compact polymer format, although I have no personal experience with them. You need to hit the 10mm forums for that.

 

[starboard]

I once had a tense hour-long bear standoff while armed, speaking euphemistically, with a pocket .25. I had that particular gun for ease of concealment, as any kind of carry was illegal there and I didn't wish to be spotted and hassled for exercising my 2a right. As the situation unfolded, I was preparing / visualizing for fighting the bear at contact distance, trying to empty the .25 into its eye somehow while trying to protect my neck. It ended peacefully, thank goodness.

Thereafter I said to hell with the legal BS and carried a Glock with FMJ - a larger but much more effective package, still concealable in a fanny pack while hiking.

Now that I have a child, I'm taking security more seriously and would like to get a 4" or 6" .44 as my wilderness sidearm. I like semiautos well enough, but the reliability, power, and load versatility of a revolver are very appealing. (<boris>And if it doesn't work, you can hit him with it</boris>). The wife can have the Glock, as she is a damn good shot with it.

 

[MillCreek]

+3 to the perceptive comments and analyses of Run and Shoot, whose opinions on this matter echoes my own. I would hike with you anytime.

 

[ShooterMcGavin]

My M&P40 can also be fitted with a new barrel, to handle the 357 SIG round. Would this be a better round to bring for wilderness carry??

 

[Run&Shoot]

Hey MillCreek, you live in some beautiful country. My sister and her family lived in Mill creek for many years and then moved to my BIL's old stomping grounds around Port Townsend for smaller town atmosphere. I did a one year project near Mill creek when AT&T wireless was putting their huge call center in that area (about 1995).

You have easy access to some incredible Cascades, with not too bad a hop over to the Olympics. Have you hiked in the north cascades yet? I discovered its beauty when I was a teenager and my dad was the Federal Highways project bridge engineer on the NC highway when it was first built (late 1960s).

At that time the road was just a one lane gravel road that had sharp hills and curves and the logging trucks and construction workers would drive it hell for leather. While Dad worked with the construction engineers a buddy an i would traipse around Ruby Creek fishing unbelievable holes for 15 lb Dolly Varden. Lots of old miner cabins between the road and the creek back then. What a summer.

I don't get back up to hike washington much anymore except I try to get to Indian bar on Mt Rainier at least once every August. Hike up to and back from the end of Ohanapecosh glacier at Indian Bar one day, then the next go swimming in the river itself (45 degrees) at the Ohanapecosh camp ground. Paradise on earth. Well 10 miles east of Paradise.

Now days it is pretty much te coast Range in Oregon for me. Not as grand, but less populate in many respects. Have not seen much wildlife down here, but the 2-legged threats are just as real and common.

 

[MillCreek]

As a matter of fact, Run and Shoot, I am about 60 minutes from Stevens Pass and 40 minutes from the Mountain Loop Highway. I spend a great deal of time hiking and snowshoeing in the Central and North Cascades. Hopefully, Congress is about to finally create the Big Sky Wilderness Area up here, and that should preserve some nice hiking terrain for a long time to come.

 

[wqbang]

I suggest carrying what you would carry any other day for two legged threats. By far most people you meet are friendly. I have run into folks that seemed pretty seedy while hiking, camping and 4wheeling in the Cascades. It's just like being in the suburbs... but different. How often do you see a Ranger/LEO while out in your local National Forest? The chances of having a violent encounter are slim while in the wilderness.... but lets make it clear *YOU ARE ON YOUR OWN*. No bystanders, no witnesses, no cellphones, and no LEO to help you.

Plan accordingly.

If you are hiking on the west side, you might get strange looks for openly carrying. Not so much on the east side.

For concealed carrying while hiking, nothing beats this:

http://thewilderness.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=2&products_id=18

You can secure it to any pack belt. it is secure, protected from the elements, accessible and concealed. Nobody looks twice.

 

[MrPeter]

If it weren't a glock I would suggest replacing the barrel with one for a .357 sig? That would make a nice autoloading hunting round, no?

I use the heaviest hunting JSP rounds I can find in .357 through a 6" barell. I figure that should give me plenty enough penetration to get to the vitals.

And you know, I haven't ever heard of someone taking an autoloader in the woods with them. I'm not sure why I discarded the idea, but it does seem a little funny to me. Maybe just the thought of "roughing it" brings up images of revolvers over semi-autos.

Good luck in your hiking endeavors, and may you never need your gun.

 

[Hokkmike]

The biggest danger in the PA woods is, sadly, other people - and not much of a threat. I sometimes do carry my .380 but I have never expected to use it!