Wisconsin co-ed dials 911; dies anyway

[SSN Vet]

Most 911 dispatchers in Florida dispatch police if you call and then don't respond.

and just exactly where do they dispatch to when it's a cell phone call??

I'm sure the dispatcher feels terrible....but...he made a judgement call and took the waiting 911 call. Maybe they saved someones life by hanging up and taking that call. Maybe the reason the girl never spoke is because she died the second her finger hit the third digit on the touch pad.

IMHO it's this kind of whiney, blame casting, ambulance chasing lawyer attitude, that expects LE to save everyone from everything that is at the root of the anti 2A nanny-state problem.

Please don't say "people can't depend on 911 and need to be more self sufficient" in one breath and then say "911 be cursed for not saving everyone that calls them" in the next.

 

[The Tourist]

Jefmad, that's my thinking, as well.

My wife can draw a pension and SS from any state in which she resides.

The job I have does not depend on physical strength, hence I can easily work into my seventies.

My wife and I were born and raised in Wisconsin (the Milwaukee area), and we would leave begrudgingly for all of the mismanagement this state has endured.

 

[Mainsail]

I listen to the scanner here in Tacoma Washington and hear dozens of 911 calls that were made by Phase2 Wireless that are routinely ignored. These go out as “information only” and no officer is dispatched. I have even heard police sergeants reply to dispatch to ignore the calls for their shift. There is apparently some issue with this company’s cell phones that they dial 911 automatically. If the dispatcher tries to call back it doesn’t work.

It’s sort of the modern day “boy who cried wolf”.

 

[Rachen]

Norwick said he was investigating the incident and reviewing whether policies should be changed and employees should be disciplined. But he also said, "I don't think there's anything to apologize for at this time."

May a terrible tragedy just like that happen to someone in your own family, Norwick!
And may you NEVER be able to fall asleep again, while the spirits of all wrongful death victims surround you and torment you to eternal madness!

 

[BruceRDucer]

Hey MikeSaysHi!

/

Do you have to be 21 to own a firearm or just to get a concealed carry permit?

Yes Mike. "Legal Age" is important at law. Let me give an example. Even a chess club, has a requirement that its Executive Board be 21 years of age, because they must be legally responsible for other people. If someone "sues" a club over an accident, if I'm a 19 year old officer, they cannot hold me legally liable. Same thing with gun ownership.

Being 21 means that you are legally "liable" and can be held accountable for what you do with a gun.

Being 18, or 19, is not the age of a responsible "adult".

/

 

[RustyShackelford]

911/training-supervision

In my area, I feel some of the 911/public safety dispatchers are extemely lacking, . As a security officer, I've called 911 many times in different places and about 80% time it's a major hassle :banghead:. 911/dispatchers have been rude, insulting and arguementative with me in emergency situations. My biggest problem has been telling the 911 operator what and where an event or person is then they ask me for the address( ). When they send LE to the location, they go to the exact address rather than where I TOLD the 911 dispatch to go, . When I've explained this to them in the past, LEOs and 911 dispatchers make lame excuses and dodge the problems.
Poor training and a lack of supervision are the sources of many of the 911 call center problems. I worked as a 911/desk clerk when I was a US Army MP. I know how frantic and upset callers are. I also know they may not be safe or able to say their names or addresses quickly.
Rusty S

 

[The Tourist]

I have felt a palpable shift in politics, personal responsibility and crime in Wisconsin during the last five years.

You used to be able to walk anywhere in Madison after dark. Now aggressive panhandlers walk right into peoples' homes. The murders here have occurred within weeks of each other.

The second rate bangers who get displaced from Chicago by the really dangerous ones flock to Madison to earn their bones and street creds. There has been a rash of gang tagging, especially during the last two years--and it's by gangs who were never here before.

After one attack of a patron leaving a bar, our Police Chief Noble Wray, on camera, actually appeared confused on the next step his department should take. I believe "walk in pairs" was the only substantive remark he made.

And much like England, Madison has adopted sort of a "shoot the victim" mentality in dealingwith crime. I actually had a client buy a replacement knife because his original knife was confiscated by police because he successfully cut a mugger.

Oh, come to our Mifflin Sreet Block Party. Those kids the police will arrest...

 

[dmazur]

Do you have to be 21 to own a firearm or just to get a concealed carry permit?

As far as I can tell, the Commonwealth of Virginia allows sales of handguns to persons 18 yrs or older, and you have to be 21 to apply for a concealed carry permit.

Lots of information on Google...

(Also, while you said "firearm", I assumed you meant handgun. Virginia has no restrictions on 18 yr olds buying rifles / shotguns, as far as I can tell from reading. Best thing to do is check with a responsible authority, like maybe the State Patrol. They probably won't get upset at a reasonable question.)

 

[32winspl]

My understanding of cell phone/911 use, is that the only calls that will automaticly get an officer sent are those that have gps capabilities built in.
To whom it was that asked about the "age to ccw here", well, this is Wisconsin; THERE IS NO LEGAL CCW HERE.

 

[dmazur]

The "age of majority" is a whole 'nuther can of worms, which probably doesn't need to be reopened.

I've heard "Drive a motor vehicle at 18, vote at 18, serve in military at 18, get married at 18, execute contracts at 18, consume alcohol at 18 (some states), why not CCW at 18?"

Don't know the answer. It seems an awful lot of the list requires maturity and judgement, which may / may not exist at 18. Of course, 21 is no guarantee, either.

So, if citizens have the right to protect themselves, and if it is generally agreed that the police aren't required to perform that duty, is there a "disenfranchised" gap of 3 years for citizens who are 18?

President Bush was supposed to have reviewed a proposal to raise the age for ownership of handguns nationwide to 21 yrs. Don't know the outcome of that, but that would seem to be going backwards in this area...

If someone asked me, or if it ever came to a vote, I suppose I would be in favor of uniform "18 you're an adult and will be treated as such" laws, but that would have to be across the board. (No "lesser penalties" for under 21 offenses.) And I'd vote for severe punishment for criminal offenses.

IMO, it's time to quit punishing the innocent.

 

[The Tourist]

this is Wisconsin; THERE IS NO LEGAL CCW HERE

No, but it is legal to carry "off body" in a legal gun case. This is my old one from my white collar days. As you'll notice, the top half is a day-planner. No one knew, except one employer, and it solves the legal issues.

 

[freakshow10mm]

Police protect the public. That is their job. They have no obligation to protect the individual.

 

[The Tourist]

Police protect the public. That is their job. They have no obligation to protect the individual.

I understand that. However, I am part of the "public."

BTW, that attitude stems from a Supreme Court case of similar CYA in nature. A woman was killed in Washington D.C., for much the same reason. I believe this case set the tone for all police departments where "individuals" are killed.

Edit: The case was Castle Rock vs. Gonzales

http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewCommentary.asp?Page=/Commentary/archive/200609/COM20060922d.html

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

Police believe someone broke into her apartment before killing her.

Boy that is a crack police squad, to figure out that they didn't kill her THROUGH the apartment walls with some sort of remote electrocution device. They must have been watching a lot of CSI, and maybe all that blood gave it away.

Yet another 911 victim. When oh when will then antis learn?.....

Just a beautiful girl, too, very sad.

Authorities refused to release the content of the phone call,

And the authority responsible for that refusal should be fired, tarred and feathered, and charge with a crime of dereliction of public duty.

 

[frogomatic]

What I do not understand, is the rationale behind the law abiding citizen's willingness to be a victim, and their willingness to live in a "Magic Thought Bubble".

Because this is the kind of "citizen", overbearing governments and corporations want to have. It's easier to take advantage of those that are willing to be victimized. Companies can squeeze more money out of them. Governments can manipulate them easier. There is a great deal of money and power to be made on the backs of the weak minded. The motive to induce simple mindedness on a large scale exists, and so long as the motive exists the means will evolve. A side effect of creating such a society is that the criminal element will have more to prey upon, and will be more successful.

They are willing to live this way because it has been ingrained from birth. Fortunately for us, it only takes root in a minority of the population, it can be combated, and anyone with a mildly functioning brain can connect the dots if they can be shown the truth.

 

[1911Tuner]

Sad...but in this case, any further attempts to find out where the cell call originated would probably have been for naught. Not excusing the dispatcher for not trying...but by the time the girl had been located and police arrived on the scene...she'd have been dead.

Damn sad. Moreso to think that an inexpensive single-shot 20 gauge and 35 cents worth of ammunition could have brought a different ending to this tale.

 

[Deanimator]

Please don't say "people can't depend on 911 and need to be more self sufficient" in one breath and then say "911 be cursed for not saving everyone that calls them" in the next.

There's a difference between being UNABLE to "save" someone and not being COMPETENT.

Would you agree that the cases where 911 blew off the little boy who called because his mother was dying, and the case where 911 demanded that the woman shot by her husband put HIM on, demand redress?

Or do you believe that even though your tax dollars pay for these services, a minimum level of diligence doesn't need to be enforced?

 

[callgood]

I have wondered if you wouldn't be better off stating........

"FIRE! FIRE at 123 Apple Road- I think it's ARSON!"

They may be more concerned about property than you. Any type of approaching sirens would be better than none.

 

[Harley Quinn]

Tourist,
That is a great picture and one that is very revealing.

1) The weapon appears to be loaded and the hammer is in position to be fired.

2) No way to tell if the weapon is in a safe mode, cannot see it because of the way the firearm is laying.

I agree with what you are saying, I am a person who believes all should be allowed to carry if they are willing to be responsible, and follow the rules.

That particular situation (picture) is something I would not carry it that manner maybe the filler can be reversed so the weapon is sitting in a way to observe the safety

These are small things that many don't notice. I on the other hand do Why I advocate no bullet in the chamber for civilian carry.

Regards

 

[The Tourist]

I would be willing to scrap the entire 911 system, if the Wisconsin CCW licensing was passed and a "selective GPS" system was available on cell phones.

The reason I say "selective" is that once my truck battery failed, so I called the On-Star style system I have on my cell phone.

The operator pin-pointed my position my a matter of feet, not yards, and clearly told me that I was in the parking lot, not in the building of the parking lot nor on the road.

If a private company has that expertise, it's just a matter of time before government agencies use our phones--even if shut off.

When I ride, I want privacy, even if it means removing my cell phone's battery.

 

[romma]

All I know is here in CT, the only legislation they keep bringing up is stiffer sentences for the criminals, which is a good thing.

But not one piece of legislation has been written with regards to breaking the victim mentality; such as a Castle Doctrine, or similar Stand Your Ground type of law.

And that is where this mindset is bred. Even after repeated high publicity home invasions.

 

[plexreticle]

Dispatcher should be charged with negligent homicide.

 

[Kino74]

You know I strongly believe that women especially younger women in the early 20s seriously need to learn how to properly use a defensive firearm. How many college girls can you think of off the top of your head being killed either at an atm machine or in their home? I can think of a few high profile ones within the last few months.

 

[scrat]

first of all to the tourist thats one nice day planner. As for 911 depends on where you live. In the city of Los Angeles. its a joke. a friggen joke. I called 911 one time. I was driving on the freeway on got side swiped. Anyhow the guy tried to get away. he was driving a minivan. I was in my BMW. Needless he did not get far nor could he ever out run me. I called 911 several times got busy signals or was placed on hold for several minutes. In all it almost took 10 minutes to get through and talk to someone. Amazing friggen amazing.

 

[Harley Quinn]

Dispatcher should be charged with negligent homicide.

Boy is that a thought or what Who is the dispatcher and why would that be your reply The receiver of the call hung up accidently or on purpose, right or wrong. What happened did happen and someone died. Now they need to fix the system that caused this tragic incident. The lawyers will get this and try to collect some money I am thinking for better or worse its going to happen