Zimbabwe has total gun control, right?

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So what I am getting is that they decided to send violent likely racist militia (after being indocrinated to believe these evil white farmers are apartheid holdouts, responsible for all thier societies current troubles) and military armed to occupy the land of the white farmers they did not already confiscate in an effort to drive them out.
However some of these farmers and employees were well armed and therefore less intimidated by these intentionaly intimidating practices. So the government then passed laws banning the right to possess the firearms the employees at the farms possessed so that the intimidation would be successful, as well as being able to do things like dig up the land (making a farm pretty worthless, cant grow anything if the land is being ripped apart.)

So they are disarmed, now having land ripped apart constantly, surrounded by violent young racist militias allowed to patrol thier land and use heavy equipment at will. Now the government can just wait for them to default thier land because they cannot pay the taxes or business license fees because due to ongoing tearing up of the land keeping them from growing anything or making any profit tehy cannot pay thier bills. In addition arresting people left and right in an attempt to intimidate all others into abandoning such places or lines of work.

Such a government sounds just wonderful.
 
Being full of power lust, near sighted, cruel and lazy does not exclude intelligence. Certainly many intelligent leaders have been hated by their people. He was smart enough to put them in the position that they could do nothing about it.
How does a person get indicted for ''Crimes against Humanity'' and still have lefty sympathizers? Sounds smart to me. Insane likely... but yes smart also.

When I say it can't happen here I mean it most likely won't happen here in this way. Barring some major trigger this country will legislate it's way peacefully into socialism within 40 years. By then it will be too late.
 
Mobutu Sese Seko in Zaire, Idi Amin in Uganda, and Robert Mugabe in Zimbabwe are the cream of a large crop of megalomanic, venal, thuggish and despotic 'leaders' that have plagued the African continent and robbed it of it's potential.

Curbing the rise of an unlimited autocrat here in the States is precisely why the gun control and confiscation interest groups as well as their legislative and judicial puppets must be squashed at all costs!
 
Hey Titan6, could you link us to the Zimbabwean involvement in the IEDC? The "board of governors" is made up of employees of US real estate developers.
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He can't but its a good way of criticising the UN by the anti UN must get out now crowd. The IEDC is made up of americans and a brit. The UN second committee on economics and financial affairs members are Estonia, Brazil, Indonesia, Senegal and Portugal. The guy in charge of the UN Economic Commission for Africa is Abdoulie Janneh from Gambia. Zimbabwe has no one on the boards what so ever. They are not even on the board for the African Union.
 
Limey did you read the BBC article I posted? I never stated the IEDC anywhere in the thread. I should have been more clear:

Zimbabwe has been elected to head the UN's commission on Sustainable Development (CSD) despite strong objections from Western diplomats.

BTW- They are on the African board it was expanded from 15 to 20 countries. Look it up on the UN web site.
 
I will disagree with the statement that Mugabe is intelligent though. He has destroyed his economy and his people hate him.
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I've met plenty of extemely intelligent people who were just plain nuts. Exceptionally intelligent people are often also quite arrogant. Heck, Washington DC is full of them!

The US taxpayer funded every step of Mugabe's reign, from the beginning (along with that of every other dictator since WWII, including Pol Pot). Every death there is on our hands.
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Yes, the United States is surely responsible for all the evil in the world. Won't it be wonderful when the Great Satan America is defeated once and for all and the world can live in peace and harmony?:banghead:

I get real tired of hearing about how my country is the source of all the problems in the world, whether it's from Michael Moore or someone else who buys that lie. People are people where ever you go, no matter what color, race, religion, etc.. The United States is a nation of people and as such as a nation we have been responsible for many atrocities, but for all our faults the USA is still the greatest nation on earth.

I had a lively discussion with a co-worker the other day who spouted that $*@!, tried to tell me that the internment of Japanese-Americans during WWII was the same as the Nazi death camps, so "we" are as bad as the Nazis.:what:
In hindsight from our perspective now, those internment camps were wrong. The were American citizens who lost their rights and freedoms, and many lost property. From what I've read they turned out to be some of the most loyal, hard-working Americans around. Many of their young men joined the army and proved themselves in battle. At the same time, nobody was tortured in those camps. There were no gas chambers or slave labor. They were well fed and housed. It doesn't make it right but comparing their treatment with the Nazi concetration camps, or the treatment of our POWs in Japanese hands, is incredibly offensive to me.
 
The US pretty much cut off all funding except for some disaster relief when the real craziness started in 2000. They were not getting much before that anyway mostly just a little corporate welfare to Caterpillar and a few others. North Korea was providing as well. One would think that would be a danger sign ;) .
 
I get real tired of hearing about how my country is the source of all the problems in the world,
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So do I. Until we quit subsidizing every single dictator on the planet, however, it will be true. Don't you feel a little bad that your tax dollars paid for Castro, Pol Pot, Nyerere, et al? Don't you find it a little strange that YOU paid for the North Korean nuclear reactors?

I certainly agree that people would still make trouble if we weren't supporting them. But people that destroyed their own nations' economies would be selected against, and be weaker than their more-capitalist neighbors. Nowadays, foreign-aid socialism is the quickest path to President-for-life... just wreck your own country so they can't revolt, then live off "loans" that the US taxpayer submissively pays off.

And if our economy wasn't drained of trillions of dollars for "Crusades II: The Never-Ending Sequel", Aid To Dependent Dictators, etc., then we'd be rich. We'd have an economic growth rate. There would be American colonies on Mars getting ready to throw tea in the harbor (well, into Olympus Mons or something). Our medical technology would actually work.

Instead, our real wages stagnated in 1975. We have no economic growth. Some of our technology is actually going backwards.
 
Thanks for the link, Titan6. Apparently the UN has so many councils, commissions, and committees it's hard to keep track of them.

North Korea was providing as well. One would think that would be a danger sign
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Yeah, that's for sure. Especially since they were just passing on money they got from the US...

Actually, though, Mugabe is probably still getting "loans" from private banks. Remember that most foreign aid works like that; "private" loans which are actually pre-approved by the Fed. Then when the kleptocrats don't pay, the Fed conveniently prints up the money and hands it to the bank. Just like when Clinton "found" 35 billion to give to Mexico's bankers when Mexico defaulted.
 
The situation in Zimbabwe is complex and is a result of many things. Colonialism, the Cold War, involvement in wars, Mugabe himself, amongst other factors are why Zimbabwe is in the situation it is currently in. I have very few good things, if any, to say about Robert Mugabe, but like it or not Mugabe shows a fair amount of intelligence. Being intelligent does not preclude a lust for power, or any other self-interested actions however.

Zimbabwe has been elected to the chair the UN Commission on Sustainable Development, but it is not like the entire UN voted for Mugabe or that it even came to a vote in the General Assembly. The chair of that commission rotates regionally and Africa was the region that got to vote for the next chair. So only those African countries on the commission voted for Zimbabwe. This is not a case of malign intent on the part of the UN, but of bureaucratic silliness. The Vice Chairs for the next session are Guatemala and Isreal. Why did the African countries on the commission select Zimbabwe? I don't know, but it would probably be good to find some substantive evidence before one posits a theory.

Thin Black Line said:
Wouldn't most countries have developed an armed resistance movement to such a tyrant by now? I really don't know much about Z's internal politics or laws (especially gun laws), but it seems that the only thing holding Z together right now is a tyrannical regime that has a total monopoly on arms and force.
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Rebellions and resistance movements are very hard to undertake and the right conditions are needed for them to flourish. Generally speaking when a population is at the brink of starvation or in severe economic straits resistance movements are difficult to muster. The logic being that most people are just trying to survive and do not have the time to worry about who is in charge. When the economic tide turns good however and the country is in recovery, rebellions are more likely to happen. There are other factors as well. Political indoctrination, effective use of violence, access to weaponry, external funding, etc all can play a role in whether or not a resistance can be fielded.
 
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Rebellions and resistance movements are very hard to undertake and the right conditions are needed for them to flourish. Generally speaking when a population is at the brink of starvation or in severe economic straits resistance movements are difficult to muster. The logic being that most people are just trying to survive and do not have the time to worry about who is in charge. When the economic tide turns good however and the country is in recovery, rebellions are more likely to happen. There are other factors as well. Political indoctrination, effective use of violence, access to weaponry, external funding, etc all can play a role in whether or not a resistance can be fielded.
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I agree with all of the above and would add just one more factor, CULTURE. Certain cultures are rebellious in nature and difficult to control either for an internal dictator or an outside power. Look at Afghan tribal culture for example. They fought the British to the death during colonial times, the Soviets during the 80's and now the troops from NATO. And when they weren't fighting each other different regions and tribes fought each other. Even the Taliban failed to fully control the national territorry.

See also the Scots, the Irish, the Basque in Spain, all groups that were very difficult to subjugate due to a warrior culture and a culture of resistance. In the Balkans the Montenegrins were one of the few peoples never fully conquered by the Muslim Turks.

Of course in addition to culture you need plenty of guns which is why the
2nd A is so important.




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looter goverments do these things

Just wait till Hillary is President and the socialist have control of both houses. We are in for a treat!
This is where it all leads.
Good luck!
 
Gonese, a lawyer and a senior member of the main opposition Movement for Democratic Change (MDC) party, had trouble trying to calm down the residents who wanted him to say whether his party was prepared to lead an armed resistance against the government. “Going to the bush (to wage a guerrilla war against Mugabe) is not the solution,” the legislator tried to explain. “Of course we have a wicked government but we should seek legal recourse. That is the best solution,”
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Idiot. There is no legal recourse when there is no rule of law. :barf:
Put down that brief, worthless lawyer, and pick up a gun.
 
Quote: The US taxpayer funded every step of Mugabe's reign, from the beginning (along with that of every other dictator since WWII, including Pol Pot). Every death there is on our hands.
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Yes, the United States is surely responsible for all the evil in the world. Won't it be wonderful when the Great Satan America is defeated once and for all and the world can live in peace and harmony?
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No the USA is most assuredly not responsible for all, or even most, of the world's misery. Overall, the world is far, far better off with us then it would be without us.

But we WERE involved in Mugabe's rise to power. Back when Zimbabwe was still Rhodesia, there was a U.N. embargo on Rhodesian goods . . . which, under Nixon and Ford, we ignored.

Enter Jimmy Carter.

He decided that Rhodesia was violating human rights, so he declared the US would kowtow to the UN embargo, and cut off US purchases of Rhodesian chrome . . . forcing us to buy it at 4x the price from that great defender of human rights, the Soviet Union. (BTW, Jimmy was OK with our buying coffee from Idi Amin's Uganda . . . showing that human rights were irrelevant. I mean, Idi was a cannibal - how much more thoroughly can you violate someone's rights than by eating them?)

But I digress . . . Jimmy's embargo bankrupted Rhodesia and allowed the terrs to win, and Mugabe was the head terr. Jimmy visited and praised him.

So yes, Virginia, we do bear some responsibility for Zimbabwe's sad state of affairs.
 
Africa is called the "dark continent" for many reasons. Some countries brought civilization there in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. They have since relinquished the reins to the indigenous folks, with expected results. I feel no guilt or sympathy, we got plenty to worry about here. Joe
 
Joe- The issue is not sympathy. Honestly I could care less about any country in all of Africa the issue is here is we have a modern day road map of how to destroy a country. All we need now is a brave enough leader to follow it.
 
Thin Black Line said:
I'm not sure there's anyone left to wage a resistance movement and many of the young are apparently Mugabe thugs. Seems the country has been a bit de-populated:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle2042133.ece
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This is one of the tactics that Charles Taylor used in Liberia and I believe was used in Sierra Leone and Cote d'Ivoir. It has also shown up in a less organized fashion in Somalia and in Rwanda during the genocide. It is a pretty effective way of controlling the population, but it does not mean that they can maintain this control indefinitely. In the Liberian case and to a lesser extent the Rwandan case these groups were not able to ensure the success of their political patrons.

Demographers have been looking at these types of groups recently and have deemed them "the savage youth." They certainly are not exclusive to Africa, and have shown up in other parts of the world.

pharmer said:
Africa is called the "dark continent" for many reasons. Some countries brought civilization there in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. They have since relinquished the reins to the indigenous folks, with expected results. I feel no guilt or sympathy, we got plenty to worry about here. Joe
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These types of sentiments seem to show up often when discussing Africa. The problems in Africa are much more complex than any ideology of civilization. Colonialism, the Cold War, global economics, domestic economics, corruption, amongst many other factors are why Africa has the problems that it does. The Europeans did not bring civilization to the Africans in the same way that the British did not bring civilization to the Irish. All things being equal the people of Africa are just as able to govern themselves as any other culture or country.
 
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Let's take a moment to thank Britain for deposing the legitimately elected gov't of the newly established Free Zimbabwe, and installing the known communist (it's no co-incidence he's acting like Stalin) dictator.

Hooray for Britain yet again, may they burn in hell for the next 10 centuries.
 
Thugs like Mugabe are the reason I wish it was still legal to raise a private army.
 
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