Officers in botched raid awarded medals

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I like this guy's take on it:

"The criteria is "the officers 'performed very bravely under gunfire and made smart decisions'"?

OK, well their victim, Mr. Khang "thought he was being robbed. Khang shot through his bedroom door at the officers until he understood who they were."

Why is his bravery and intelligence under fire any less worthy of recognition?

In accordance with Minneapolis Police Department Policy 2-306.01 CITIZEN’S AWARD OF VALOR, which states:

The Citizen’s Award of Valor may be awarded to citizens for exemplary and heroic acts that expose them to considerable danger.
I'd say Mr. Khang qualifies just as much--if not more so--than his assailants. Since the award needs to be initiated by a MPD employee, I call on Chief Timothy Dolan to nominate and approve him for the award.

Please take a moment and join me in writing to the chief: [email protected] "
 
While it is hard to comprehend the medals from a citizen's point of view, I can understand the reasoning behind it. I think.

But be that as it may, two things should be happening. First, the higher-ups who made the mistakes should be held accountable. Mistake, perhaps. But real men own up to mistakes, they don't use them as excuses.

Second, the city should be doing everything possible to help the family out. When you make mistakes, you make amends. In this case, that should include (at the very least) a profuse public apology to the family and payment of home repair and therapy bills. Perhaps that is happening, but I didn't read any mention of it. If that is not happening, the family should sue for it.

~Dale
 
I gotta wonder how the officers getting the commendations feel about all that.

I'd be embarrassed as heck.
 
I gotta wonder how the officers getting the commendations feel about all that.

I'd be embarrassed as heck.

And maybe they are. The same stories I've read about these medals for US soldiers who accidentally killed innocents in Vietnam indicated that some of the soldiers were crying as they received the medals. (Sorry, I don't have a citation to the book.)

The actual SWAT officers here may not be guilty of anything. But someone in the police department really screwed up, and should at least lose their job for this. And the SWAT officers shouldn't be getting any medals, even if they didn't do anything wrong.
 
All this just tells me that PDs need to do more reseach and surveillance before they issue a no knock warrant.
 
Boy, this whole thing stinks from beginning to end.

The ATF screws up and gives the police bad information based of the word of an scumbag (opps, sorry 'informant').

The police department then screws up and instead of doing a little bit of police work and making sure that there's even a criminal or a gang banger inside (did they run the plates on the cars that were outside or did they do any kind of surveillance at all to make sure that any of this was accurate? Did they find out who owned the property?), they kick in the door and trade gun shots with the husband who's only trying to protect his family.

Then they want to top off their mistake by giving these morons medals, boy that's rich.

A quick question on something that I'm unclear about though.

Do cops get medals for every time they get shot at or something?

They shouldn't.

Even soldiers who're serving in a combat zone against the enemies of our entire country don't get medals for getting shot at unless they do something especially heroic that greatly increases their chances of getting shot.

Does merely returning fire and getting shot at count as something heroic?

I don't think so.

You'd think that the police department higher ups would have better sense than to cap off this whole episode by rubbing salt in the wounds of the family by giving medals for a monumental screw up.
 
My cousin went thru a similar situation,cops at wrong address,kicked in door cousin at top of stairs with shotgun,after all the brouhaha cousin went to see Chief on getting new door was told to pound sand.
 
My cousin went thru a similar situation,cops at wrong address,kicked in door cousin at top of stairs with shotgun,after all the brouhaha cousin went to see Chief on getting new door was told to pound sand.
Thats why this kind of thing cannot be dealt with via the existing system. Some kind of legislation is in order. Keep in mind it got this way because legislators thought they were getting tough on crime.

Its time to limit no knock raids to those where the the police can show to a judge in advance that there is a likelihood of violence otherwise. And by likelihood, I mean near certainty. Mere loss of evidence or a chance to use neat new toys is not adequate.

Police departments should have to pay for damages like this out of their own budget, just like anyone else that damages someone elses property. That would make them think twice.
 
Its all about accountability in the end. The police are no longer accountable for their actions without going through the courts at considerable expense. They are certainly not accountable to the public they are supposed to serve. The police make a mistake, cause hundreds, if not thousands of dollars in damage and its TS. (That means tough situation btw) No compensation, maybe an apology (for what that's worth) and zero concern for the why or how the mistake was made.

No knock warrants have no place in American society. They serve no purpose other than as a high profile intimidation tactic. While they were originally about preserving evidence, easily accomplished by shutting off gas, power and water before serving a warrant, they are now the method of choice for practically everything reason under the sun.

Hundreds of innocent people have now died as a result of this policy of military style attacks on homes. This is America, where people have firearms and a right to respond in self-defense when their home is invaded. To justify the use of this tactic, especially when its a given the innocent will likely respond with force, is reprehensible and heinous.
 
The homeowner had a gun. OK. The cops weren't there to take it, they were there(they thought) for a gang member. A gun being at the scene of a story doesn't make the story gun-related.

On top of everything everyone else said in response, they were also there to confiscate a gang members guns, not just the gang member. And it raises legal issues with shooting at people who are storming your home for no particular reason.
 
I Said This Once Before But It Got Deleted ( Go Figure)

It's been asked how this is related to RKBA. This incident has a direct effect on my RKBA to exactly the degree that I now have to pause and ask myself "Is this really a home invasion ( of the illegal kind) or, is it the cops kicking in the door of the wrong house?". And to just that extent I am no longer free to defend myself through the use of arms.

One of my most basic rights is the right to be secure in my person. If the police ANYWHERE ( in America) can kick down an innocent home owners door W/ impunity my security of person is lessened. I personally believe that it's the homeowner who needs to be immune from prosecution in a situation like this.
 
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Any no-knock warrant being served at my address, by anyone, for anyone, should be preceded by a phone call and asking permission to knock down the door. A certified letter to the effect that you're coming might be a good idea as well. Otherwise, anyone coming in my door uninvited, regardless of what they are wearing or yelling as they break in the door, will be presumed to be a bad guy. Afterall, bad guys have also been known to yell "police" as they break in doors during home invasions.
 
The LEO's were simply doing their usually difficult job.
The problem comes in the PR shifting medal awards.
Is their any backlash against the local PD?

Minneapolinites?
 
Its time to limit no knock raids to those where the the police can show to a judge in advance that there is a likelihood of violence otherwise. And by likelihood, I mean near certainty. Mere loss of evidence or a chance to use neat new toys is not adequate.

Well put; I agree. I would add that it is very easy to predict that there WILL be violence when any unidentified persons knock down the door of a private residence where people are lawfully armed.

SCOTUS has now made it clear that there is a right to IMMEDIATE defense in the home. Logic only follows that ANY law abiding person would be justified in IMMEDIATELY shooting ANY invaders who don't VERIFIABLY identify themselves as a a police officer IN ADVANCE.

This fact, i hope, will begin to raise the level of scrutiny with which these types of warrants are issued in the first place, and then change the way police officers are trained to serve the warrants.

Unfortunately there will likely be more fine officers and innocent homeowners unnecessarily killed because of the use of this tactic, before the need for a policy change is recognized and implemented at the administrative level.
 
Posts were deleted if they were part of either the cop-bashing, the reflexive mockery of anyone who questioned the police, or the debate over whether this thread should be here. I'd prefer not to close the entire thread. Please don't make it necessary.
 
The following from WCCOdotCOM sheds a bit more light on the matter.

In my opinion, staking out the house and waiting for the morning(as should be the case in the execution of ANY warrant) when the SWAT team would have most likely realized their info was bad, all this could have been avoided.

To award medals for this is just plain wrong. Had the SWAT team and Chief Dolan followed a more appropriate procedure, there would never have been a live fire conflict to begin with. It's not like they were after Al Capone or Pretty Boy Floyd.

MINNEAPOLIS (WCCO) ― Two months ago, a terrified mother called 911 to report strangers breaking into her North Minneapolis home. The intruders were not violent criminals but members of the Minneapolis Police Department's SWAT team. They were raiding the wrong house after an informant gave investigators bad information.

The I-TEAM tracked the 17 hours that led up to the raid.

Shortly after seven in the morning on Saturday, Dec. 15, a young woman walked into the downtown police precinct and said her boyfriend had threatened her. She told police Jermaine Brown belongs to the Rolling 60's Crips street gang, and she claims he pointed a gun at her inside his home where they live together at 1321 Logan Avenue North.

Officers from the department's Violent Offender Task Force (VOTF) had been targeting the gang's drug dealings for months. They are brought in to check out her information.

By dinner time, the investigation put the VOTF officers outside a house on Oak Park Avenue North. Police had heard members use it to store guns and drugs.

As VOTF officers watch the house, Jermaine Brown walks out. The officers, including their supervisor Lt. Andy Smith, arrest Brown and take him to jail. Then they decide to go after guns his girlfriend has told them about.

Several hours later, VOTF officers meet with Hennepin County Judge Herb Lefler at his home. They convince him it is urgent to move fast before someone ditches the guns since Brown is now behind bars.

The judge agrees to allow them to conduct two high-risk search warrants. One is for the house where they found Brown. The other is for the Logan Avenue address his girlfriend said is their residence and where, she said, he has hidden more guns. That includes the gun he allegedly used the night before to threaten her.

The SWAT team is called in to conduct the raids. Less than 90 minutes later, the SWAT officers raid that first house on Oak Park Avenue. Police find three guns in the home along with mail addressed to Brown.

Despite clues that this was actually Brown's home, the SWAT team is still sent to its next stop.

It is now just after midnight on Dec. 16. Yee Moua is watching television while her husband and six kids are safe in their beds.

Strange sounds, including breaking glass, frighten her. She thinks it is violent criminals so she calls 911 while her husband wakes up and grabs his shotgun.

Vang Khang, Moua's husband, fires three shots from the second floor bedroom. The intruders fire back more than 20 rounds through the door. It's recorded on a 911 phone call tape.

On the same tape, men can be heard yelling "Get to the floor!" and "Where's the gun?"

It turns out that the intruders are not criminals. They are members of the MPD's SWAT team hunting for Jermaine Brown's guns at the wrong house. Officers take Khang into custody and search his bullet-riddled home for weapons.

His wife, Moua, can be heard pleading with the officers to tell her what happened.

Police see lots of family photos and Hmong decorations in the Khang home. However, the only gun they find is the shotgun Khang used to protect his family.

That night a police spokesman defends the raid in which two officers were hit. Their protective gear prevented them from getting hurt.

"I don't think it was a mistake on our part, we did everything correctly," said Sgt. Jesse Garcia on that Sunday night in December.

Two days later, Minneapolis Police Chief Tim Dolan meets with the Khang family. He admits mistakes were made and promises Khang that he won't be charged with shooting at the SWAT officers.

He also hugs one of the young children who went through the shootout in their own home.

"The fact that nobody was very seriously injured or killed, we were very lucky," said Dolan

He promised a full investigation of what went wrong and to find out who dropped the ball on the front of the case.

"I don't blame the SWAT team. I do take into consideration whether to consequences were the mistake was made intentionally," said Dolan.

The I-TEAM has looked into what could have prevented the mistaken raid. It's standard in cases like this to do surveillance outside a house and check for any police calls to the address.

Investigators also could have run a simple property search online and learned that the Khang family owned the house on Logan Avenue since moving there four years ago.

So far, the I-TEAM has found no evidence that any of those steps were taken on the Logan Avenue house to confirm the information provided by Brown's girlfriend.

Brown has been charged with assault and as a felon possessing firearms. By then police had confirmed his real address is on Oak Park Avenue where they arrested him. Brown denies the guns found there are his, and claims they belong to his girlfriend.

His attorney, Hennepin County public defender Mary Moriarty, told the I-TEAM that Brown will give police a DNA sample on Wednesday to prove he has no connection to the guns police found during the raid at the Oak Park Avenue home.

Meanwhile, the Khang family has hired two lawyers to represent them. The lawyers include includes former U.S. Attorney Tom Heffelfinger.

"The police were the ones there illegally and they started this problem," said Heffelfinger.

The legal team also includes Sia Lo, a prominent Hmong American attorney. Lo said the raid shook trust between police and the Hmong community.

"They fought so hard to make sure they that are going to be respected and see this happen is a tremendous blow to the sacrifices they made," said Lo.

The attorneys say it will take a lot more than patching up bullet holes and replacing glass to heal an innocent family's pain.

Dolan said he wants to make them feel safe at home again.

"To come out of this event successfully for me would be having this family back in the city of Minneapolis and feeling comfortable being there. Anything beyond that is going to be a horrible loss for us," he said.

Woody
 
Interesting.

One thing comes to mind right away: the quote says that the husband fired from a second floor window, but the police returned fire through the door. Now, was that the front door, or the second floor room door? It would seem that it was the front door, otherwise the husband wouldn't have been shooting out of the window in the first place. Which begs the question, why the heck were the police shooting the door instead of returning fire through the window?!

~Dale
 
Mr. D

Vang Khang did not shoot from a second floor window. The article does not say that. It could be construed to say that(bad reporting) but it doesn't say that at all.

Vang Khang shot through the bedroom door at the perceived threat.

I wonder if they gave the shotgun back to Vang....

Woody
 
What I find interesting is that the same folks who promote shooting first and asking questions later, who believe a guest at a motel who shoots the maid who entered his room by mistake should be exonerated, and who believes that you should not be held liable for shooting the 15 year old neighbor kid who got drunk and accidently tried to get into your house thinking it was his own, want heads to roll when any governmental agency, person of authority, or someone with more power or status than them, does something similar.

IMO, those officers under fire deserve medals for valor, but those who planned and coordinated the activity need reprimanded and policies for such undertakings need reviewed and changed. Mistakes were made, however, the intentions were good and their actions under fire merit recognition.

There is a problem with alot of folks here not looking at things objectively and rationally. Some are outright cop bashers, which is usually attributed to one of the following scenarios: 1. A cop took their wife, 2. A cop busted them doing something wrong, 3. They desperately want to be a cop and have authority, but cannot make the cut, or 4. They were once a cop who washed out and was fired. Now they hold a grudge.

I am glad the moderators are finally deleting the cop bashing threads, I hope it is a trend that continues and some fat gets trimmed in the process.
 
Isn't the road to hell paved with good intentions? The officers went to raid a home on the word of someone whose reputation is less than stellar. If one of the LEOs were killed by Vang Khang he'd be looking at a murder charge right now. He'd probably would beat the charge at a very high cost emotionally and financially.
 
Don't you know cops can do anything to anyone at anytime, because they're cops...........and don't you dare try to protect yourself lest you get shot and the cop gets a nice shiny medal.....
 
Isn't the road to hell paved with good intentions?

I'll let you know when I get there.

The officers went to raid a home on the word of someone whose reputation is less than stellar

I don't expect you to know this or understand why, but some of the best info a LEO will ever get is from some pretty shady folks. Do you think Grandma Moses has ever provided some good raid info?

I would be curious to know what procedures were followed: if policy was violated, if the house was clearly identified, if the house in question was similar to the one they intended to raid, if the raided house had a house number on it.

I have been involved in a raid where the wrong house was hit. Fortunately the person inside was cooperative because we weren't there to play games. Only the commander and team leader had detailed info on the house, we were briefed on the layout and transported there in a van knowing only the general location. Does that make it my fault that the wrong house was hit? Hardly.
 
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