Elephant Black Powder

On eBay from time to time
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-LOT...521951?hash=item1c735c6f5f:g:gpMAAOSwgHZYC38Q

P Dawg, It may have been 10 years ago not sure now. Elephant Powder was popular. Our club in Arizona bought it 100 lbs at a time. Then the quality went down. There source of hard wood for charcoal ran out. Later testing shows it the quality dropped off.

http://www.norwestcompany.com/comparison.htm

Prairie Dawg said:

Thinking back on Elephant black powder.
It always shot well for me.
They've been out of business for a while.
Anybody know a source of cans?
Looking for one empty from them to fill out a "memory wall"
Thought I'd as a group of BP shooters.
If yer anything like me, you have lots of empties around.
Thanks
--Dawg

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Are you looking for the painted label or the paper label as I have several of each that I may part with.
Send me a PM

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This got me interested. I have Goex FFFg, Swiss FFg and ... three cans of Elephant 2Fg, Lot 006, Date Code: 03-01. Pernambuco Powder Factory, Brazil. Two are still sealed, and the third is almost 3/4 full. *blush* recently I have been shooting a lot more Pyrodex and Triple7, sorry.
Searching the Web for Elephant Powder
Portuguese Wikipedia and using Translate.Google: Herman Theodor Lundgren, (b 1835 Norrkoping, Sweden; d. 1902 Recife, Brazil) was a Swedish immigrant who settled in Brazil and became a citizen. He was a translator and honorary consul for the Nordic countries in Brazil. He noticed that Brazil had to import its gunpowder at high prices and decided to found Pernambuco Powder Factory in 1866 in the port of Recife. He made a fortune and branched out into textiles.
The current S/A Pernambuco Powder Factory was founded in 1968 and has 24 employees today. It apparently no longer exports black powder to the US.
ELEPHANT BLACK POWDER SINCE 1866 TRADE MARK
https://trademarks.justia.com/owners/s-a-pernambuco-powder-factory-1888428/

I found a test dated 2001 comparing Goex, KIK, and Elephant using patched ball with 70gr charge in .50 cal Hawkin percussion rifle, 100 gr charge in .62 cal flintlock rifle, 70 gr charge in 20ga flintlock shotgun and 85 gr in a .54 custom percussion rifle. Elephant had about 12 to 14% lower velocity and dirtier fouling. Test at http://www.norwestcompany.com/comparison.htm
At one site, I found a note that prior to year 2000 the factory did not remove the bark from wood used to make their charcoal. (????) Another site said 1999 was the best vintage for Elephant Powder, then GOEX upgraded their own nitrate sources and 2001 upgraded their charcoal, leaving Elephant way behind.
And from another site: "A man was sprinkling powder on his front yard."Whats the powder for?" asked his neighbor. "To keep the elephants off the grass," replied the first man. "But we don't have elephants around here!" "I know. Great stuff isn't it?""

I shot a pound of their ffg back in the 90's. Brings back memories of Civil War reenacting.

Howdy

I used to use Elephant brand a lot back when I first got into CAS. If I recall correctly it was slightly cheaper than Goex, but it was a fairly long time ago and I'm working from memory. I never did any chronograph work with it, but I do know it was denser than the other powders I used to use. My standard 2.2CC charge in a 45 Colt weighed 37.5 grains while the same volume of Goex weighed only 31.3 grains. This is the last can I have left, there are probably only a few charges left in the can. You can see the date code was May of 2001.

Sorry, I am keeping it for my own trophy wall.

Driftwood Johnson said:

Howdy

I used to use Elephant brand a lot back when I first got into CAS. If I recall correctly it was slightly cheaper than Goex, but it was a fairly long time ago and I'm working from memory. I never did any chronograph work with it, but I do know it was denser than the other powders I used to use. My standard 2.2CC charge in a 45 Colt weighed 37.5 grains while the same volume of Goex weighed only 31.3 grains. This is the last can I have left, there are probably only a few charges left in the can. You can see the date code was May of 2001.

Sorry, I am keeping it for my own trophy wall.

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The last case of elephant powder I bought had plastic cans. The funny thing about it is they are dated (04/01)April 01.






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SC45-70 said:

The last case of elephant powder I bought had plastic cans. The funny thing about it is they are dated (04/01)April 01.






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e

The date code may be the Julian date. In other words, the fourth day of the year 2001. That may be why it is written with three places.

I shot my last State 100 yd match with Elephant Powder in Texas. It was like a vintage wine. The early production was very good. Later production was terrible.

satexas said:

e

The date code may be the Julian date. In other words, the fourth day of the year 2001. That may be why it is written with three places.

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I agree,
a DATE CODE is just as likely to indicate a day or week of the year as it is a month. Given the 3 digits allowed my first assumption would be day of the year as well, but only someone with inside information can be certain. 3 digits isn't very logical for a month code though.

Oh, the things we ponder....

satexas said:

e

The date code may be the Julian date. In other words, the fourth day of the year 2001. That may be why it is written with three places.

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You are probably right, I didn't think of that.

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A code or code date should be information that has meaning to the manufacturing or packing plant for tracking purposes of a product, specifically, a means of identification of product slaughtered, prepared, processed, or packaged on a certain date in the case of a recall. If the code links to a production date, that is sufficient; that is actually the purpose of the code to identify the date of production or a lot from a specific date. However, codes should not have meaning that is misleading to a consumer. If a plant is using "codes" that appear to be dates, it should revise its coding system or apply the proper use of calendar dating in accordance with 9 CFR 381.129(c). For example, we believe that “051305” and “May1305” do not represent codes but calendar dates that should be identified properly. A Julian date of “13305” (133rd day of the year 2005) would be considered to be an acceptable code since most consumers would not immediately associate such numbers with a calendar date.

Did I miss something? The thread started with seeking a powder can. And became a study about the Julian Calendar.

I think interest here in the date code on an old powder can is to be expected.
There is a lot of interest and discussion on identifying markings and determining manufacture date of original and reproduction guns and gear among those who frequent the BP forums

I haven't seen any Elephant brand since the late 60s. At the time I thought it didn't have as much energy as Goex.

I have several Elephant cans if you still want one.
i never really cared for it compared to Goex but it was cheaper and I still have a fair quantity of it. Elephant cans were bad about rusting from the inside out but I still have a few good ones. PM an address if you want one

72coupe said:

I haven't seen any Elephant brand since the late 60s. At the time I thought it didn't have as much energy as Goex.

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Shooting mortars and cannons Elephant always got less range than the same amount of Goex.
i personally thought it was Elephant having more graphite in it, no proof though.

I have several pounds of it on hand. I bought it from Graf & Sons when it was about $6 a pound. IIRC Goex was around $9 a pound. I never noticed any real difference in power. All I used it for was plinking. It worked just fine for that. I think mine was bought around 1998 or so.

I don't have any of the empty cans left. Sorry.

some people used to say that it was very dirty to shoot and clean up. but what real black isn,t? i find the substitutes aren,t much better.

TOOT44 said:

some people used to say that it was very dirty to shoot and clean up. but what real black isn,t?

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Old Eynsford, Swiss

TOOT44 said:

some people used to say that it was very dirty to shoot and clean up. but what real black isn,t? i find the substitutes aren,t much better.

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Not all Black Powder is the same. Some are made with a better grade of charcoal, some have other attributes. Some simply burn better and leave less fouling behind than others.

It has been a long time since I used any Elephant, so I don't remember how much fouling it left behind. I have never used Swiss because I did not want to spend that much money. I can tell you that Schuetzen leaves a bit less fouling behind than Goex. I have used both extensively.

TOOT44 said:

some people used to say that it was very dirty to shoot and clean up. but what real black isn,t?

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Ain't no sayin'..., by the time my group bought Elephant, it was some of the dirtiest stuff we'd ever worked with. It was a good deal cheaper than GOEX, which is why we bought it, as our members would normally burn a can over a weekend. Diamondback powder was made the same way (Im told in the very same plant) and it too was uber dirty. Standard GOEX is much better. Currently I am trying Graf & Sons powder which is made in Germany. I can look around for a metal can for you.....I doubt I will have one but you never know.

LD