Wildcats in Kansas

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BigBlue 94

BigBlue 94

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So this has been a long debated topic here in KS. It's been known for 25+ years that we have mountain lions roaming the plains. However the KDWP has denied their existence until recently, due to the advent of game cameras.

My pops saw one yesterday afternoon bout 6 miles north of Topeka off US75. He also saw a black one many years ago down by the Kaw, where 75 crosses into Topeka. I saw one about 5 years ago run out of our pasture, not 500 yards from a grade school near Meriden. My mom has seen one too, about 20 years ago. Maybe 15 years ago, there were lots of reports of mangled or missing dogs in my area, attributed to the big cats roaming the area.

Just a few days ago, one was found shot up by a shotgun with one paw cut off. That was out west in Rooks county.

Just wondering how many of you fellow prairie dwellers have seen one of these big cats, and where.
 
When I lived in SW Kansas 08-14 I saw one run from a irrigation well into a corn field. A friend of mine had pics that were pretty clear of one on a trail camera.
 
BigBlue 94 said:
So this has been a long debated topic here in KS. It's been known for 25+ years that we have mountain lions roaming the plains. However the KDWP has denied their existence until recently, due to the advent of game cameras.

My pops saw one yesterday afternoon bout 6 miles north of Topeka off US75. He also saw a black one many years ago down by the Kaw, where 75 crosses into Topeka. I saw one about 5 years ago run out of our pasture, not 500 yards from a grade school near Meriden. My mom has seen one too, about 20 years ago. Maybe 15 years ago, there were lots of reports of mangled or missing dogs in my area, attributed to the big cats roaming the area.

Just a few days ago, one was found shot up by a shotgun with one paw cut off. That was out west in Rooks county.

Just wondering how many of you fellow prairie dwellers have seen one of these big cats, and where.
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I have no doubt that there are Mt Lions in Western Ks. However there has never been a verified black Mt lion kill or found dead black Mt Lion, ever.
 
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We have the same debate here in GA. People claim to have seen them, even black ones. Even a few alleged photos. But the DNR says no big cats in GA. The photos are all grainy, from a distance, and with nothing else in the photos to use as perspective it is impossible to tell if it is a 5 lb house cat or a 150 lb lion.

We refer to bob cats as Wildcats here and those are plentiful. I've seen several over the years.
 
I saw the post on Face Book about the Mt Lion in Ks. There was a picture of a fairly good sized dead cat on the tailgate of a truck.

Some of the comments on that story were so ignorant it was humorous.To include;

“I’ve seen dozens of Mt Lions and even a few panthers in my county.”

“Of course the game wardens deny the existence of these big cats, they are the ones who are bringing them here!”
 
Wisconsin is very hesitant to verify the existence of cougars here also, even tho there are many verified sightings and trail-cam pictures of them. I think part of it is because they are worried if they admit they are around, poachers will actively hunt for them. Even with all the trail cam pics of them lately, I've yet to see any of cubs, even tho they stay with mom for two years.
 
Some cougars are very dark; the melanin thing. But, dark brown, not black. I saw a cougar in south Brewster County, Texas, with dark paws, mask and tail very much like a seal-point Siamese.

My wife once saw a cougar not far out of Thomasville, Georgia, on her way into town. In conversation about it, a guy sneeringly asked how she could tell what it was. She went into full southern-lady mode and cooed, "It looked just like the skin we have draped over the couch at home."
 
H&Hhunter said:
I have no doubt that there are Mt Lions in Western Ks. However there has never been a verified black Mt lion kill or found dead black Mt Lion, ever.
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I'm in NE Kansas...

Otherwise I'm not sure what you are talking about? Any mammal can have an odd gene giving them black fur. And there are black big cats. Maybe mountain lion was too general of a term? And I obviously didnt see it myself but it was in the middle of a 1sq mile field cut corn field at a dead sprint. I know when I saw my big cat the discernible features were huge legs and paws with a distinctive gait and a tail that was a mile long. The exact address were I saw that, was crossing the road from our 3 acre pasture at 4125 NE Croco rd, Topeka KS, 66617. It was midnight and I had my brights on at about 15 yards away.


I've also heard a couple tales of black bears down by Galena. The native black bear population of SE KS was killed off with the bison.

I have to imagine most of the big cats here are males who roamed too far. With zero predators here, they have pretty free reign. While I realize they are a different species, lions in Africa are grassland animals: something eastern Kansas has lots of, as well as deer, possum, rabbits, etc. for them to eat. Theres plenty of woods in the eastern 75 miles of KS for them to hide in too. My 80 acres is thick enough to hide a native tribe.

I've been seeing more and more armadillos over the last few years. They are plentiful down in the southern half of the state, but I have yet to see one north of the Kaw. Northernmost was on i70 between Topeka and Lawrence. Not much north of where I saw a wild tarantula too.
 
BigBlue 94 said:
I'm in NE Kansas...

Otherwise I'm not sure what you are talking about? Any mammal can have an odd gene giving them black fur. And there are black big cats. Maybe mountain lion was too general of a term? And I obviously didnt see it myself but it was in the middle of a 1sq mile field cut corn field at a dead sprint. I know when I saw my big cat the discernible features were huge legs and paws with a distinctive gait and a tail that was a mile long. The exact address were I saw that, was crossing the road from our 3 acre pasture at 4125 NE Croco rd, Topeka KS, 66617. It was midnight and I had my brights on at about 15 yards away.


I've also heard a couple tales of black bears down by Galena. The native black bear population of SE KS was killed off with the bison.

I have to imagine most of the big cats here are males who roamed too far. With zero predators here, they have pretty free reign. While I realize they are a different species, lions in Africa are grassland animals: something eastern Kansas has lots of, as well as deer, possum, rabbits, etc. for them to eat. Theres plenty of woods in the eastern 75 miles of KS for them to hide in too. My 80 acres is thick enough to hide a native tribe.

I've been seeing more and more armadillos over the last few years. They are plentiful down in the southern half of the state, but I have yet to see one north of the Kaw. Northernmost was on i70 between Topeka and Lawrence. Not much north of where I saw a wild tarantula too.
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Yes big cats can be melanistic. And as I stated there has never been a black Mt Lion recoreded or verified in any region that the Mt Lion live throughout North, Central or South America. There was one claimed in Costa Rica but if you look at it, the cat is rusty brown not black.

There is some confusion on the various colloquial terms for a Mt Lion. Puma, painter, panther, catamount, cougar, and probably others are all names for the same animal. Outside of the occasional jaguar that passes through the southern border of N.M. and Az and possibly Tx there is only one species of long tailed big cat that is native to the United States. And that is the Mt Lion.

I am not in any way doubting that there is a transient or possibly even a small resident population of Mt Lion in KS. But a pure black one is extrodanairly unlikely as the the biological data would indicate.

https://www.lifesongadventures.com/2015/12/mountain-lion-facts/
 
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The generally accepted range for cougars is close enough to the western plains I would assume there's some bleedover into those states. Further east would probably be a lot less common.

There are quite a few of them in my neck of the woods and they're probably the most worrisome 4 legged predator we have in Idaho or the PNW more generally. They're not that big and probably wouldn't be too hard to kill, but they can be deadly for sure. I live in the Boise area and we seem to get them coming into town a few times a year, which is mostly a problem for pets.
 
IdaD said:
The generally accepted range for cougars is close enough to the western plains I would assume there's some bleedover into those states. Further east would probably be a lot less common.

There are quite a few of them in my neck of the woods and they're probably the most worrisome 4 legged predator we have in Idaho or the PNW more generally. They're not that big and probably wouldn't be too hard to kill, but they can be deadly for sure. I live in the Boise area and we seem to get them coming into town a few times a year, which is mostly a problem for pets.
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My neighbor about a mile away had one kill a doe in his backyard last week. There are more of them around than people think. Nothing seems to cause panic and rile up folks more than a lion sighting around here. It’s kind of humorous to see the reaction.
 
H&Hhunter said:
However there has never been a verified black Mt lion kill or found dead black Mt Lion, ever.
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This...

Too many of a certain generation got caught up and confused by the "black panther" in Jungle Book and thought mountain lions were the same thing because some uncle said mountain lions have a black color phase...

Ironic timing on this thread? Since KDWPT has the photos of the dead mt. lion on their facebook page this week... No telling where it was killed yet, just that it was found by some bird hunters in Rooks County...

Sadly, the reality is a lot less exciting than the lore passed around by KS residents. Some guys act like there's some huge conspiracy and State secret cover-up denying the fact mt. lions are occasionally found within Kansas borders... For some reason it's hard for Kansans to understand plain English, or biology... A few mt. lions have made KS their home, whether long term or temporarily, but there's no steady population reproducing here. The fact we find people at a hotel doesn't mean they live there full time, raising their family for generations... Unlike Bigfoot, there ARE occasionally mountain lions in Kansas, but unfortunately, guys really like pretending Deep Sunflower is covering up some mythical population of 300lb, 7ft long cats...
 
H&Hhunter said:
Yes big cats can be melanistic. And as I stated there has never been a black Mt Lion recoreded or verified in any region that the Mt Lion live throughout North, Central or South America. There was one claimed in Costa Rica but if you look at it, the cat is rusty brown not black.

There is some confusion on the various colloquial terms for a Mt Lion. Puma, painter, panther, catamount, cougar, and probably others are all names for the same animal. Outside of the occasional jaguar that passes through the southern border of N.M. and Az and possibly Tx there is only one species of long tailed big cat that is native to the United States. And that is the Mt Lion.

I am not in any way doubting that there is a transient or possibly even a small resident population of Mt Lion in KS. But a pure black one is extrodanairly unlikely as the the biological data would indicate.

https://www.lifesongadventures.com/2015/12/mountain-lion-facts/
Click to expand...

I understand what you're saying now. As I said I wasnt there and it was probably 25 years ago. It was at a distance and while doing 55mph. Black probably meant dark.
 
Man am I glad the only thing we have to worry about is coyotes and now the occasional bobcat!! I'd quit hunting if mountain lions came around here. I get all freaked out about coyotes let alone a lion.
 
H&Hhunter said:
There are more of them around than people think. Nothing seems to cause panic and rile up folks more than a lion sighting around here. It’s kind of humorous to see the reaction.
Click to expand...

Another reason I think the Wisconsin DNR is so hesitant to admit they are around. A coupla years back there was a Turkey hunter verified an attack on a dairy cow on the farm next door to my DILs family farm. The Turkey hunter actually shot and slightly wounded the lion. Blood samples taken proved it was a Mountain Lion. The cow actually had to be put down due to it's injuries. Later as the DNR was investigating the attack, they found cougar tracks in my DIL's mother's garden. When her dad asked about shooting the Mountain Lion, he was told by the Warden that unless he, members of his family or one of their domestic animals had evidence of a cougar attack on their bodies, it would be considered poaching.....period. For months after the attack, every dirtball in the township was out at night, driving town and county roads, with loaded rifles and spotlights hoping to see the animal. Facebook posts ranted about moms afraid to let their kids outdoors to play with the "killer cat" in the area. A local tavern even openly advertised a bounty on the animal, even tho they are a protected species. Thru DNA evidence it was later discovered the cat was hit by a vehicle and killed almost a thousand miles east of here.

As for black cougars, 20 years ago a good frined of mine had several pictures of a large black, long tailed cat on his farm. Since true black cougars in the wild are rare, while the DNR admitted it was a large cat of some type, they claimed it had to be a once captive animal(Cougar, leopard, etc.) that escaped, even tho there were never any reported. Seems jus as much as the DNR hates to admit we have big cats around, folks don't like it advertised when their big kitty gets loose.
 
I have never studied the different large cats and keep them mostly confused.

But, just looking found that there are no native Wild Cats in the Americas. Appears to be little more that a domestic cat on steroids.

I have heard people talk about seeing wildcats for years. Probably just throwing the name in with a Bob Cat.
 
ZeroJunk said:
I have never studied the different large cats and keep them mostly confused.

But, just looking found that there are no native Wild Cats in the Americas. Appears to be little more that a domestic cat on steroids.

I have heard people talk about seeing wildcats for years. Probably just throwing the name in with a Bob Cat.
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Few miles south of me is Wildcat Mountain. Beautiful area, within the Driftless Area itself, witch includes the gorgeous Kickapoo Valley. Got it's name here....

How Wildcat Mountain got its name
In the 1800s, local farmers were upset because a bobcat, also called wildcat, killed several of their sheep. So the farmers formed a hunting party to find the wildcat. They tracked and killed it to prevent the loss of anymore of their livestock. The farmers shot it nearby the area that is now the park's main overlook and gave it the name Wildcat Hill. The name was later changed to Wildcat Mountain.
Click to expand...
 
ZeroJunk said:
I have never studied the different large cats and keep them mostly confused.

But, just looking found that there are no native Wild Cats in the Americas. Appears to be little more that a domestic cat on steroids.

I have heard people talk about seeing wildcats for years. Probably just throwing the name in with a Bob Cat.
Click to expand...

I've seen Bobcats. Know why they are called Bobcats? They have a bobbed tail of no more than 6 inches. And they dont weigh more than about 75 lbs, many much smaller than that. The cat I saw had a tail the length of an entire bobcat, and was total about 2/3s the width of the 2 lane road. It was sprinting with a very smooth slinky motion. It was tan with a very blocky head and strong shoulders. This cat was easily 100 lbs heavier than me. I have seen a 180 pound dog, and it was a dwarf in comparison.
 
Never said it was a bobcat... wildcat can mean anything around here, that isn't a housecat. It was most certainly a mountain lion (panther, puma, cougar).

I'm also familiar with lynx, having seen one in the Sandia Mountains of NM.
 
BigBlue 94 said:
The cat I saw had a tail the length of an entire bobcat, and was total about 2/3s the width of the 2 lane road.
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The average width of a two lane road is 24 feet....that makes for your cat to be about 16 feet long. Maybe you meant one lane? That would be about 8 feet.......still a really big cougar.

Cats for the average person are hard to judge. They are generally on the move and generally only caught as a glimpse. Bobcats look pretty big alive and moving, but once the same cat is dead and layin' at your feet, it's not very big at all. Being from Wisconsin, I always thought of a "wildcat" as a Bobcat. Just what folks around here referred them as. I suspect folks around here also refer to Lynx as "wildcats" too, even tho there aren't many of them here. Lots of folks around here still call Ruffed Grouse "partridge", even tho most everyone knows there's a difference. My grandpa also called small Northern Pike "Pickerel" altho they were a completely different fish. Regional terminology at work, I suspect.
 
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