LaPierre asked to resign

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rpenmanparker said:
I don’t know how you can say that. He is written in the show to be so far right, he is in danger of falling off the edge of the flat Earth.
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I'm not going to derail this thread any more than this, but his role on the BB show overall seems kind of middle ground, but when it comes to citizens with guns he plays right along to the NY anti gun script.

Although it is a show and I'm sure he doesn't write the script. Still, he plays it out.
 
Good Ol' Boy said:
I'm not going to derail this thread any more than this, but his role on the BB show overall seems kind of middle ground, but when it comes to citizens with guns he plays right along to the NY anti gun script.

Although it is a show and I'm sure he doesn't write the script. Still, he plays it out.
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I hear you and understand where you are coming from. Just remember that in a LEO role he will naturally be against full firearm freedom. Even the most conservative LEOs don’t want any guns on the street except their own. So in that sense he is not a good case study. But if you look at all his other attitudes you see that they are rigidly right wing. Now they do write him into compromise situations routinely, but only after be is depicted as starting out staunchly on the right. In other words his natural place is on the right. He is just amenable to occasional persuasion to move toward the middle.
 
rpenmanparker said:
I hear you and understand where you are coming from. Just remember that in a LEO role he will naturally be against full firearm freedom. Even the most conservative LEOs don’t want any guns on the street except their own. So in that sense he is not a good case study. But if you look at all his other attitudes you see that they are rigidly right wing. Now they do write him into compromise situations routinely, but only after be is depicted as starting out staunchly on the right. In other words his natural place is on the right. He is just amenable to occasional persuasion to move toward the middle.
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I agree and the fact that his role being specifically anti 2A for civilians isn't exactly overly positive on that show and isnt exactly screaming "nominate me for NRA president".

Howverever other videos and research I've done on him in the last couple hours seems to indicate is more pro 2A rather than anti.
 
For the life of me I will never understand the infighting of hunters, shooters, and members (like me) of gun organizations.

Let's just trash out the NRA. After all what's 148 years of representing gun owners rights worth? Nothing because of a leader or two. Criticize our politicians we do because they represent our whole country. Let's just doom the whole country because of a bad leader or two.

We are throwing the baby out with the bath water.

Is the GOA going to save us? Probably not because they will have to deal with the same infighting the NRA is dealing with now.
 
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I would bet that most gun owners are like me, not single issue voters. Furthermore, if they are single issue voters, then I would be willing to guess that gun rights isn't that the top of their needs.
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This is more or less what's important to voters.

Extremely/Very important %

Healthcare 80
The economy 78
Immigration 78
Way women are treated in U.S. society 74
Gun policy 72
Taxes 70

I'm not a single issue voter either and I have my priorities, not necessarily in this order, as gun policy is higher on my list.

If the NRA folds as so many folks (including some on THR) are hoping will happen what organization will fill their shoes and represent conservative gun owners in Washington, D.C. that believe the 2A should not be restricted?
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What's wrong with representing yourself in DC with your vote and financial support of the candidate of your choice? Only half of the eligible voters in this country vote. Politicians have to spend half of their time begging PAC's (NRA) for contributions to get reelected because most people don't vote and won't contribute to someones campaign. They set on their buts and let PAC's contribute money to candidates that may or may not represent their priorities. All the while people like LaPierre take a 5M salary. Taking money from the NRA is becoming the kiss of death for many politicians these days any way. I'm guessing if the NRA keeps playing politics and gun owners don't take more of an interest in their elected state and federal officials we're doomed.
 
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A lot of folks might not understand this but due to non-profit laws and the original charter of the NRA, it is required to have an auxiliary operation such as the ILA in order to actually contribute to candidates and engage in political lobbying as these activities are not tax-exempt. NRA dues DO NOT GO to the ILA at all, these are separate contributions by those members who want to do so. So, the NRA does not take your membership dues and spend it on contributions to politicians nor for lobbying.
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Maybe the NRA should go back to it's original charter of advancing rifle marksmanship and firearms safety. Most people see the NRA as a political action organization (lobbyists) and know nothing of their original charter. The ILA has in effect hijacked the original organization for profit. Why else would they be selling insurance and branding merchandise. The NRA was originally a non-profit. It wouldn't surprise me if they lose their non profit status and the original charter was dissolved. I think if they were audited that would probably happen.
 
Good Ol' Boy said:
I agree and the fact that his role being specifically anti 2A for civilians isn't exactly overly positive on that show and isnt exactly screaming "nominate me for NRA president".

Howverever other videos and research I've done on him in the last couple hours seems to indicate is more pro 2A rather than anti.
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Here's a couple of interesting facts to dispel some rumors floating around the internet today.

Tom Selleck has served on NRA board of directors and very supportive of NRA. He was thought to have been in line for the (Unpaid) position of NRA President at one time.

"Political views
Selleck has been a member of the Board of Directors of the National Rifle Association (NRA) and served as a spokesman for the organization.[43][44] He resigned from the board on September 18, 2018.[45] After his close friend Charlton Heston stepped down from his role as an NRA spokesman in 2003, Selleck succeeded him.[46][47] In 2002, Selleck donated the rifle he used in Quigley Down Under (a custom 13-pound [6 kg], single-shot, 1874 Sharps Rifle, with a 34-inch [86-cm] barrel),[48] along with six other firearms from his other films, to the NRA; the firearms are part of the NRA's exhibit "Real Guns of Reel Heroes" at the National Firearms Museum in Fairfax, Virginia.[43] To promote his film The Love Letter, Selleck was invited to be on The Rosie O'Donnell Show on May 19, 1999. Unexpectedly, he found himself defending his position on gun ownership and an ad in which he appeared supporting the NRA. Following questions from O'Donnell, Selleck said, "It's your show, and you can talk about it after I leave."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tom_Selleck "

Wayne LaPierre holds the (Paid*) position of Executive Vice President. (WLaP's salary, often quoted as being as much as $5 million; while he is not quite on welfare it is considerably less than that.) *
d9ee6726-e9c6-45e4-90fa-44cbb3678e1d.png

NRA is far from perfect, but is by far the most influential force, by sheer numbers alone, in the struggle to maintain our 2A rights.

Regards,
hps
 
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As an independent, I was really dismayed by the NRAs clenched fist of freedom bologna.

While I do think it makes sense to give money to conservative candidates that are pro 2a, I think it’s a mistake to double down too hard on bipartisanship, because governmental control seems to go in cycles.

I think effort should be spent winning people in blue states over to being more pro gun or at least less anti.

NRA should be pro gun and approachable by anyone.
 
Interesting to see who are the Liberals on this forum and anti NRA. People looking for every excuse to disparage the one organization that are in fights every single day in everysingle state to protect the 2nd amendment rights. Yes, we all would love to see the NRA just promote safety and family outing etc. But that is not the real world. The Real world is Bloomberg and ILK. The real world is the fact that the NRA is huge organization and like any will have some bad apples, it is part of nature. Yes, you weed these out just like you weed out your own garden.
There are some folks on this very forum that want to own and enjoy this fine sport, want to protect their families and enjoy all the rights of the 2nd Amendments. But like the liberals they are, they want someone else to do their dirty work, someone else to do the fighting and they try and shoot down the ones that do. They feel some entitlement in all areas of life. I support the NRA and if you do not, or not ready to fight, and support, then just get the hell out of the way.
 
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Jeb Stuart said:
Interesting to see who are the Liberals on this forum and anti NRA. People looking for every excuse to disparage the one organization that are in fights every single day in everysingle state to protect the 2nd amendment rights. Yes, we all would love to see the NRA just promote safety and family outing etc. But that is not the real world. The Real world is Bloomberg and ILK. The real world is the fact that the NRA is huge organization and like any will have some bad apples, it is part of nature. Yes, you weed these out just like you weed out your own garden.
There are some folks on this very forum that want to own and enjoy this fine sport, want to protect their families and enjoy all the rights of the 2nd Amendments. But like the liberals they are, they want someone else to do their dirty work, someone else to do the fighting and they try and shoot down the ones that do. They feel some entitlement in all areas of life. I support the NRA and if you do not, or not ready to fight, and support, then just get the hell out of the way.
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Jeb, the NRA just being on the right side of the 2A fight is not enough to justify the ugliness of its message, the pandering to gun manufacturers, and its unwillingness to take up the issue of gun violence as a blight on the American society in order to find a constitutionally-consistent program to attack it. And your stereotypes are horribly flawed and offensive to the patriotic and caring individuals you are defaming. Why is there a need for name calling just because you disagree with someone’s politics? Perhaps more importantly than expressing your feelings, why is there a even a need have those feelings, to hate people just because you disagree with them on political issues. This is a form of tribalism that will destroy the USA if allowed to.
 
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rpenmanparker said:
Jeb, the NRA just being on the right side of the 2A fight is not enough to justify the ugliness of its message, the pandering to gun manufacturers, and its unwillingness to take up the issue of gun violence as a blight on the American society in order to find a constitutionally-consistent program to attack it. And your stereotypes are horribly flawed and offensive to the patriotic and caring individuals you are defaming. Why is there a need for name calling just because you disagree with someone’s politics? Perhaps more importantly than expressing your feelings, why is there a even a need have those feelings, to hate people just because you disagree with them on political issues. This is a form of tribalism that will destroy the USA if allowed to.
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Could not disagree more. The NRA is not the one destroying America. And please quite with the word "Tribalism". My stereotypes are flawed? I think the actuall voters and agenda's are obvious and not a stereotype. Maybe Bloomberg and Ilk is a flawed stereotype, but not in my book. And yes, I do despise him, because of his politics. Sorry, just being honest. And Please do not label me and I will not label you. To say I am offending patriotic Americans is hardly the case and so far from the Truth. There are so many things going on in America right now that the Liberals are doing that is just downright unpatriotic, Unless you are blind you can see it happening every day.
Sorry, Robert, I support the NRA. If you want to disparage them fine that is your right and I respect that right. Or if you have a better solution, I would love to here it. And I beg your pardon Sir, I did NOT call any one a name so please stop with that. Unless of course saying the word Liberal is name calling. Which yes offends many people. Do not know why, but Please feel free to call me a Conservative. I am proud of it.
 
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Jeb Stuart said:
Interesting to see who are the Liberals on this forum and anti NRA. People looking for every excuse to disparage the one organization that are in fights every single day in everysingle state to protect the 2nd amendment rights.
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You're just plain wrong if you're painting everyone who has a problem with the current behavior of the NRA as a liberal or an anti. I'm as conservative as they come and I am not anti-NRA. What I am is really turned off by the 'clinched fist of BS' that NRATV keeps pumping out. The NRA ISN'T acting like a gun rights organization, it's acting like a conservative PAC. They have strayed from their core mission of defending the Second Amendment and have become entangled in social issues that are only tangentially related to gun rights.

I have a better solution: the NRA should focus on gun stuff and stop trying to carry the water for a bunch of social justice causes.
 
Jeb Stuart said:
Could not disagree more. The NRA is not the one destroying America. And please quite with the word "Tribalism". My stereotypes are flawed? I think the actuall voters and agenda's are obvious and not a stereotype. Maybe Bloomberg and Ilk is a flawed stereotype, but not in my book. And yes, I do despise him, because of his politics. Sorry, just being honest. And Please do not label me and I will not label you. To say I am offending patriotic Americans is hardly the case and so far from the Truth. There are so many things going on in America right now that the Liberals are doing that is just downright unpatriotic, Unless you are blind you can see it happening every day.
Sorry, Robert, I support the NRA. If you want to disparage them fine that is your right and I respect that right. Or if you have a better solution, I would love to here it. And I beg your pardon Sir, I did NOT call any one a name so please stop with that. Unless of course saying the word Liberal is name calling. Which yes offends many people. Do not know why, but Please feel free to call me a Conservative. I am proud of it.
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The word liberal is not itself a defamatory name until you characterize it this way, "...like the liberals they are, they want someone else to do their dirty work, someone else to do the fighting and they try and shoot down the ones that do. They feel some entitlement in all areas of life." So correct, saying the name Liberal is not name calling until you make it so by telling us how you define it. You wouldn't be proud to be called a Conservative if it were generally believed to mean racist, sexist, predatory, fascist, and so on. Do you see how that works? You can't have it both ways.
 
Elkins45 said:
You're just plain wrong if you're painting everyone who has a problem with the current behavior of the NRA as a liberal or an anti. I'm as conservative as they come and I am not anti-NRA. What I am is really turned off by the 'clinched fist of BS' that NRATV keeps pumping out. The NRA ISN'T acting like a gun rights organization, it's acting like a conservative PAC. They have strayed from their core mission of defending the Second Amendment and have become entangled in social issues that are only tangentially related to gun rights.

I have a better solution: the NRA should focus on gun stuff and stop trying to carry the water for a bunch of social justice causes.
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And if they just focus on "gun stuff" who will do the fighting in the Courts? Lol, without the NRA our 2A rights would not last 6 more months. I find it amazing that some folks just cannot see our understand that this a battle and a Political battle. So again Elkins, who will do the fighting in the courts across the country?
 
Kaybee said:
As an independent, I was really dismayed by the NRAs clenched fist of freedom bologna.

While I do think it makes sense to give money to conservative candidates that are pro 2a, I think it’s a mistake to double down too hard on bipartisanship, because governmental control seems to go in cycles.

I think effort should be spent winning people in blue states over to being more pro gun or at least less anti.

NRA should be pro gun and approachable by anyone.
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Amen! IMHO, the NRA has turned into a far right poltical group more so than a firearm rights group. Most of their ads and speaking appearances center around politics and insulting the left instead of just focusing on gun safety and getting more Americans, Conservatives and Liberals alike, into firearm ownership.

This has carried over into most firearm forums and into the firearm community in general. Many firearm related forums that have a political section as well as firearm related social media continuously insult and attack the left as a whole. I've even seen this even during firearm training courses, depicted at a few LGS, and even within the mailing list for the Virginia Citizens Defense League (VCDL), a Virginia gun rights organizations.

I personally know many minorities and Liberals who own firearms who would not be welcomed, or at least feel welcomed, on these forums and even the NRA because of their other left leaning political beliefs despite the fact that they too are gun owners.

But I digress... Nothing will change, and we'll continue going down the same path. Gun ownership and the perception of guns and those who carry/own them have been on a steady decline, and there's no indication that things will ever reverse course.
 
Jeb Stuart said:
And if they just focus on "gun stuff" who will do the fighting in the Courts? Lol, without the NRA our 2A rights would not last 6 more months. I find it amazing that some folks just cannot see our understand that this a battle and a Political battle. So again Elkins, who will do the fighting in the courts across the country?
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Fighting for 2A rights in court would be "gun stuff" no? Inserting themselves into non firearm related politics and other social issues is the problem.
 
Casting the gun issue as between two tribes them and us, is a must-fail approach. That is what the NRA is doing. Instead of trying to enlarge its tent, it is fortifying it, populating the moat with alligators and drawing up the bridge. IMO many non-gun people who could be persuaded to live amicably in a pro-gun society cannot deal with the ugliness of the NRA message. The NRA is actually driving down support for guns by insulting the middle and left, not increasing it.
 
Jeb Stuart said:
Interesting to see who are the Liberals on this forum and anti NRA. People looking for every excuse to disparage the one organization that are in fights every single day in everysingle state to protect the 2nd amendment rights. Yes, we all would love to see the NRA just promote safety and family outing etc. But that is not the real world. The Real world is Bloomberg and ILK. The real world is the fact that the NRA is huge organization and like any will have some bad apples, it is part of nature. Yes, you weed these out just like you weed out your own garden.
There are some folks on this very forum that want to own and enjoy this fine sport, want to protect their families and enjoy all the rights of the 2nd Amendments. But like the liberals they are, they want someone else to do their dirty work, someone else to do the fighting and they try and shoot down the ones that do. They feel some entitlement in all areas of life. I support the NRA and if you do not, or not ready to fight, and support, then just get the hell out of the way.
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I don’t support anti gun or anti science organizations like Moms Demand Action or the NRA. Even if I wanted to, I don’t see how my donations paying for WLP’s golden retirement helps the second amendment. If that makes me a liberal to a complete stranger on the internet, I’m not at all bothered.
 
rpenmanparker said:
Casting the gun issue as between two tribes them and us, is a must-fail approach. That is what the NRA is doing. Instead of trying to enlarge its tent, it is fortifying it, populating the moat with alligators and drawing up the bridge. IMO many non-gun people who could be persuaded to live amicably in a pro-gun society cannot deal with the ugliness of the NRA message. The NRA is actually driving down support for guns by insulting the middle and left, not increasing it.
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Exactly... It's just not the NRA. It's the majority or maybe an EXTREMELY vocal minority in the gun community who are the same way... Many of them are displeased with the NRA because they feel the NRA isn't being "ugly" enough...
 
Jeb Stuart said:
Just curious, How many liberal Politicians are for protecting the 2a rights? Just give me a estimate.
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I don't care... What the NRA should be worried about is how many liberal voters are or could be gun owners. If they focused on that, there would be more liberal politicians on our side voted into office. The politicians are a reflection of the majority of their constituents. Win the hearts and minds of their constituents, and we'll get more politicians on the left who are less likely to support gun control.
 
Fox News reports what may have happened - https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/john-lott-second-amendment-nra-oliver-north

"What happened to force North out?

It turns out that North and longtime NRA Executive Vice President and CEO Wayne LaPierre got into a power struggle. LaPierre came out on top.

LaPierre claims North extorted him by threatening to release “damaging” information if he did not resign. North’s supporters say that North was merely offering LaPierre a way out that wouldn’t require a messy battle about his handling of NRA finances.

... Meanwhile, the NRA is suing media company Ackerman McQueen, which pays North for hosting a TV program. LaPierre alleges that North’s accusations against him were motivated by personal financial interests."
 
Styx said:
Exactly... It's just not the NRA. It's the majority or maybe an EXTREMELY vocal minority in the gun community who are the same way... Many of them are displeased with the NRA because they feel the NRA isn't being "ugly" enough...
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Wow, never heard that one before. I believe the NRA welcomes anyone who is supportive of the 2NA. At least in the area I live in. Sounds like something I would hear if I were to tune into CNN.
 
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