1911's - are they THAT finicky?

To lighten the mood:

AK103K said:

Since the Glocks come up as a comparison with mags as well, I shoot factory Glock mags, as well as a bunch of the Korean mags, some of which are supposedly military surplus (Kahn/KCI) and some I just got, that look to be something else.

As far as function goes, they all function shooting wise. This new batch of Korean mags, dont drop free and have to be pulled from the gun. Annoying, but at least they function. They were cheap. $4 a mag

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So you've got exactly one gun manufacture and them and two others can manage to make mags for that one gun. With a 1911 you have dozens of frame manufacturers and dozens of mag manufacturers. Yeah that a completely fair comparison.
I also find it amusing that you point to a 3" Kimber 45 how does a 3" Glock 45 run?

I think it's a testament to just how not finicky the 1911 design is that for the most part a gun that's close to JMB spec will run with dozens of different mags.

I'd also point out that the Glock "design" uses several JMB patents.

AK103K said:

The only mags Ive found that seemed to work in "all" my 1911's, across the board, are a lot of USGI 7 round contract mags I bought somewhere back in the late 80's, early 90's. Im still shooting number of them today.

Even the Wilson 47D's I have didnt do that.

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I somewhat regret sticking my nose back into this thread, but for those that are new to the 1911 or are looking for information to help improve their experience with the gun, the 47D is probably the worst mag in the Wilson line-up.

JTQ said:

I somewhat regret sticking my nose back into this thread, but for those that are new to the 1911 or are looking for information to help improve their experience with the gun, the 47D is probably the worst mag in the Wilson line-up.

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Cant really say one way or the other. They are the only Wilson mags Ive owned (I have 5), and for the most part, they seem to work OK.

My biggest beef with them, besides the price, was/is, the long open slots they use for witness holes. I used to have to constantly dump and clean my spare mags that were in carriers, pretty much each week, because they would fill up with dust bunnies and various other crap from daily life, and I was always worried it would be an issue at the worst possible moment. Those big slots let a lot of stuff in.

The other weird thing was, at the time I bought them, they were new, and supposed to be the best thing since sliced light bread for the 1911 world, yet, when I got them, there was a label on the package of all the mags, that read something to the effect, "for use with hardball only". That was never mentioned anywhere in their literature or ads, and the first I saw it, was when I got the order.

Never seemed to be an issue though, and they seemed to feed all bullet types without issue. Just seemed a little strange. Unless it was a way out of them not working in "everything" using "anything", should it happen to occur.

AK103K said:

My biggest beef with them, besides the price, was/is, the long open slots they use for witness holes. I used to have to constantly dump and clean my spare mags that were in carriers, pretty much each week, because they would fill up with dust bunnies and various other crap from daily life, and I was always worried it would be an issue at the worst possible moment. Those big slots let a lot of stuff in.

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Now available, the Vickers ETM, though I suspect you won't care for the price https://shopwilsoncombat.com/1911-E...e-8-Round-Aluminum-Base-Pad/productinfo/800A/

The other weird thing was, at the time I bought them, they were new, and supposed to be the best thing since sliced light bread for the 1911 world, yet, when I got them, there was a label on the package of all the mags, that read something to the effect, "for use with hardball only". That was never mentioned anywhere in their literature or ads, and the first I saw it, was when I got the order.

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McCormick recommends ball ammo as does Ed Brown and probably most other 1911 makers/suppliers. It's the most reliable round for the gun. You can probably shoot unjacketed, lead, semi-wadcutters though your Glock, but Glock isn't going to recommend it.

JTQ said:

Now available, the Vickers ETM, though I suspect you won't care for the price https://shopwilsoncombat.com/1911-E...e-8-Round-Aluminum-Base-Pad/productinfo/800A/


McCormick recommends ball ammo as does Ed Brown and probably most other 1911 makers/suppliers. It's the most reliable round for the gun. You can probably shoot unjacketed, lead, semi-wadcutters though your Glock, but Glock isn't going to recommend it.

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I guess I wasnt the only one bitching about the slots.

At $50 a pop, I think Ill pass. Ill bet they dont work any better than my $5 GI mags either.

Also kind of falls under that same, do I buy 1 Nighthawk or 5 Glocks thing.


Youre probably right about the ball thing. As I said earlier, more of a disclaimer of sorts.

All 7 of my 1911s will feed 200 grain LSWC, and 185 Match JSWC target ammo, as well as any other bullet shape.
My Glocks and HKs and my SIG P220 will choke on those same Semi Wad cutter bullets.

AK103K said:

Also kind of falls under that same, do I buy 1 Nighthawk or 5 Glocks thing

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Both is the obvious answer..

This a good example of panic marketing.

https://shopwilsoncombat.com/1911-E...e-8-Round-Aluminum-Base-Pad/productinfo/800A/

Periodically new magazines are introduced to the market many of which claim to solve issues that folks either have or are worried that they may encounter over the years. Each claims to be the best manufactured. Wilson has done this for years now.

If you read the descriptions of the new mags that Wilson supplies carefully you see a good deal of it is a type of hype that plays to people's inexperience or worry about their guns. Take the case of a fella who wants to keep a fully loaded magazine in their desk drawer for 5 or 10 years and then worries that the spring in their mag will lose it ability to do it's job as a spring. Wilson says that they now have the answer to that in a space age flat wire spring that is stronger than others. Well, if you worry about this sort of thing, that is keeping a fully loaded mag in your desk drawer for years at a time, why not just rotate the mag with another now and then?

A good many things that some folks say they have issues with magazines can be addressed by routine maintenance. Keeping things clean.
For 109 years 1911s and their mags have functioned. Modifications were made decades ago so that they function well with jhp ammo and lswc ammo.

Think on it some. If the 1911, in general as a design, was inherently flawed and "finicky" then you have no real answer to the fact that the design has not only survived but thrived over the generations. It ceased being a front line military side arm decades ago...outdated in it's design and concept for military and law enforcement use, yet it's grown in popularity and use. It's available in many different versions, calibers and sizes as a platform. In a way that is the origin of issues with the design.

AK103K said:

At $50 a pop, I think Ill pass. Ill bet they dont work any better than my $5 GI mags either.

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If you're using $5 GI mags, no wonder you've had so many problems with your 1911s over the years.

As an aside, I've been using almost exclusively Wilson 47Ds (with a few ETMs sprinkled in) with ten different 1911s for the past several years and have zero complaints. But apparently, given my awesome luck over the years with 1911s, I am an anomaly, so I'm sure all the nay-sayers will take my comments with a grain of salt.

Old Dog said:

If you're using $5 GI mags, no wonder you've had so many problems with your 1911s over the years.

As an aside, I've been using almost exclusively Wilson 47Ds (with a few ETMs sprinkled in) with ten different 1911s for the past several years and have zero complaints. But apparently, given my awesome luck over the years with 1911s, I am an anomaly, so I'm sure all the nay-sayers will take my comments with a grain of salt.

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Those $5 mags are the only ones that have worked the most reliably in all my guns over the years. Still have a number of them, and use them every time I shoot. If I were in the market, they would be the ones Id look for, but they were gone back in the late 90's. Doubt Id find any or a deal like that today.

I usually load my mags before I go so I dont have to do it at the range, and with the 1911's, I load all that I have up. Its a mishmash of things, but they all seem to work OK for the most part.

Of all that I use, the only one thats been giving me any trouble of late, is one of the factory Colt 8 rounders I have. Seems to feed OK, just doesnt always lock on empty.

I have 2, a Sig and SA A1 and neither are finicky in my view. The SA won't feed the 200gr flat point but when it comes to JHP, no issues. I have some of those $5 bulk GI Mags and those run in both well. As has been said, the variety of mags for these can make them picky. The variety of followers, spring rates, feed lip designs and it isn't easy.

That is one aspect to HK mags is that they control that and you can only buy theirs. In some respects the manufacturers that source from Mecgar are also safe choices. I try not to buy mags from third party manufacturers. I have some Promags for the Star Firestar and those at times do not lock the slide on last shot. They run well otherwise. Given the choice the Star packaged mags were the choice. I would take a guess that there are multiple manufacturers producing mags for the HiPower.

I've never experienced that and I have 3. I don't run anything but 230 ball in them so probably not the guy to ask.

I don't carry a 1911 either. I have a Sig and a revolver for that. My feeling is it's a pretty old design and there are better ones out there if you want an absolutely reliable pistol. As Larry Vickers says, it's an enthusiasts pistol.

Spats McGee said:

What is that one at about 10 o'clock, with the light? I like the looks of that one

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Colt M45A1from the Custom Shop. While the gun its self runs good and is accurate. Colt didn't learn their lesson with Cerakote.

tarosean said:

Both is the obvious answer..

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Will a Baer n XDm work lol

Not the five that I've had. In the gun world, people love to repeat some nonsense they heard somewhere at some point in time. Usually in a gun shop.

AK103K said:

Those $5 mags are the only ones that have worked the most reliably in all my guns over the years. Still have a number of them, and use them every time I shoot. If I were in the market, they would be the ones Id look for, but they were gone back in the late 90's. Doubt Id find any or a deal like that today.

I usually load my mags before I go so I dont have to do it at the range, and with the 1911's, I load all that I have up. Its a mishmash of things, but they all seem to work OK for the most part.

Of all that I use, the only one thats been giving me any trouble of late, is one of the factory Colt 8 rounders I have. Seems to feed OK, just doesnt always lock on empty.

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Not being argumentative here, just sharing my experience of shooting many different 1911s for 35 years.

I have found the opposite to be true with mags.

I avoid those $5, now $10-$15 GI mags like the plaque.

My first 1911 was a Gold Cup and I didn’t fully comprehend the importance of mags and bought a lot of GI mags here and there. I habitually had issues of feeding, lack of slide lock and such. The final straw was when a weld broke while I was shooting and the mag dumped the Ammo, spring, and base plate on the range floor. I immediately trashed every GI mag right there.

Ever since then I only used OEM Colt, Shooting Star, Wilson, Kimber, Cobra/Tripp, and SA mags- most of them 8 rounders. I’ve rarely had issues, even with extreme use in competitions.

Maybe your GI mags were made by an employee who took pride in his work and had great materials on hand, but I will never trust another one.

Reinz said:

Not being argumentative here, just sharing my experience of shooting many different 1911s for 35 years.

I have found the opposite to be true with mags.

I avoid those $5, now $10-$15 GI mags like the plaque.

My first 1911 was a Gold Cup and I didn’t fully comprehend the importance of mags and bought a lot of GI mags here and there. I habitually had issues of feeding, lack of slide lock and such. The final straw was when a weld broke while I was shooting and the mag dumped the Ammo, spring, and base plate on the range floor. I immediately trashed every GI mag right there.

Ever since then I only used OEM Colt, Shooting Star, Wilson, Kimber, Cobra/Tripp, and SA mags- most of them 8 rounders. I’ve rarely had issues, even with extreme use in competitions.

Maybe your GI mags were made by an employee who took pride in his work and had great materials on hand, but I will never trust another one.

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For a while there back in the later 90's, there were a few batches of "contract mags" that were either counterfeit or just reject surplus, maybe both, that were junk. I had some of those as well, and they didnt work very well.

Not everything "surplus" was accepted, and there has always been stuff sold as such, that was more likely rejected and ended back on the market labeled as such. Went through that with 5.56 and .30 caliber bullets a few times too.

The way I always distinguished them was, the "good mags" came in the anti rust paper wraps, were blued, had larger witness holes (about 3/16"), and this contract #....ASSY 19200-5508694 MFR 30745.

The others came loose (not wrapped), were parkerized, had smaller witness holes (about 1/8"), and a different contract #.

Id stay away from these too should you ever come across them. The mag on the left is a factory Colt mag.





Got the three on the right, and a few others like them off eBay back in the late 90's. They were being sold as "Colt" mags. About the only truth there was, was they fit in a Colt, sorta. Not all of them did, nor did most of them work.

The only way to know if youve got good mags for your gun(s), is to buy them and vet them. I dont care who made them or what they say on them, the only way to know, is vet them, and that goes for each and every gun you use them in.

AK103K said:

The mag on the left is a factory Colt mag.

Got the three on the right, and a few others like them off eBay back in the late 90's. They were being sold as "Colt" mags.

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Another point for those new to the 1911, or for those that simply weren't aware, Colt hasn't made magazines since probably the 1970's.

Your Colt mag was made by Metalform, note the "M" on the baseplate. Also note your Colt mag is a 7 rounder using a GI follower, while the other three are 8 rounders and use the Devel follower.

Currently, Colt sources their mags from CheckMate, but that could change at any time. CheckMate makes some fine mags, but they have a nearly endless list of options, and some work better than others. The point being, ordering a Colt magazine, even if it is from Colt, or Brownell's, or MidwayUSA, or any other trusted retailer is no guarantee of what will show up at your door, whether it is actual manufacturer, feed lips, follower, spring, and in some cases capacity.

Typetwelve said:

I haven't owned a 1911 since 2009...but I owned it for years and shot many rounds through it. Functionality was never an issue. My father had many different 1911's throughout my childhood and he experienced varying results.

I might have to dawn my flame suit for this next part...we'll see.

I think it has to do with tolerances. I've found the same with AR's where guys will have one so tight, that they don't function properly or are super ammo picky. My actual Army issue AR was so loose, you could have fed your DD214 between the upper and lower, it never caused me any issues and god only knows how many rounds had gone down the barrel of that thing.

Older 1911's aren't bank vault tight...and most will cycle quality ammo just fine, just like mine did. Get a boutique 1911, one that is fit tight like a Swiss watch, and you may find it is rather picky with ammo.

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Back in the day gunsmiths would accurize 1911’s by tightening the slide and frame fit. Bullseye shooting was much more popular than today.

Even today some people still want guns that can shoot 1” groups at 25 yards. Maybe that has something to do with reliability.

I bought an old mixmaster GI 1911 back in the 70's that had a Colt frame and a Remington Rand slide. The barrel was the standard GI barrel throat of the era, nothing like the gaping throats of today. That pistol was probably loose as a can of rocks but fed FMJ with 100% reliability and fed cast SWC pretty good too as I recall, even with the GI bbl throat.

I sold it to an uncle of mine a few years later and he made it his truck pistol, and actually used it to fire some warning shots in the vicinity of trespassers on his property some months after I sold it to him, and when he showed me the mag from the pistol it was loaded with lead SWC I had loaded and gave him.

JTQ said:

Another point for those new to the 1911, or for those that simply weren't aware, Colt hasn't made magazines since probably the 1970's.

Your Colt mag was made by Metalform, note the "M" on the baseplate. Also note your Colt mag is a 7 rounder using a GI follower, while the other three are 8 rounders and use the Devel follower.

Currently, Colt sources their mags from CheckMate, but that could change at any time. CheckMate makes some fine mags, but they have a nearly endless list of options, and some work better than others. The point being, ordering a Colt magazine, even if it is from Colt, or Brownell's, or MidwayUSA, or any other trusted retailer is no guarantee of what will show up at your door, whether it is actual manufacturer, feed lips, follower, spring, and in some cases capacity.

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The gospel right there.

I have a dozen Checkmate mags. They all work in all three of my Colts. 1991 A1, GC Trophy and Gov't model. Wilson even put their name on some Checkmate mags awhile back. I have a few of those also. Best $20 mag out there.

CM won't tell you what companies use their mags as OEM but Kimber is another one.

Triggernosis said:

I mentioned to a friend of mine, who is a pistol and CC instructor, that I was interested in getting myself a 1911. He proceeded to tell me how finicky they are and how most need some work in order to be reliable with hollow-point ammo.
Are 1911's generally that persnickety?

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I have four two kimbers one colt. one rem r11 hunter, I love all four no trouble

bikerdoc said:

I have had and used various 1911`s for 50 years.
The best is my current Rock Island and ATI full size and officer models.
Like others said use good mags. For me, chip McCormack and Kimber mags work the best.
The worst one I had was issued to me in 67, an old rattling, Colt, never worked and I got it replaced most rickey tick!

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I think I got the rattler after you surveyed it.