Bolt action 223

CZ 527 or Howa in whatever configuration you prefer.

js8588 said:

CZ 527 or Howa in whatever configuration you prefer.

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You can close the thread now.

What's your budget???? and beyond 100 leaves a lot of room. Are you looking for predominately a target rifle; heavy barrel, high magnification, or more of a walk-about sporter?

I've got two that I recommend, a REM M700 XCR ""Tactical" with fluted 20" barrel:



That I use for ringing steel & varmints. Pretty accurate .5-.75 MOA, about 11 lbs all up with 6.5-20X Leupold MK4.

And I've got my little REM M7 that I put together as a "walk-about" gun, with an HS Prec stock & Timney trigger that's a little over 7lbs full up with 3.4-10x40 Leupold and will hold just under 1 MOA:



The little M7 is fast becoming my favorite gun to step out back with and ring steel at 200-400. It's more of a challenge than a mil dot scope and target turrets. I spend most of my time with it practicing shooting in "field positions".

Like anything with guns it comes down to:

Task
Purpose
Budget

Specifying a "bolt action .223" is like asking which vehicle you should buy and only specifying that it should run on gasoline. The entire Universe lays before you!

For casual plinking, on a modest budget, start with a Ruger American. Add requirements for walnut, bluing, external magazines, heavy barrels, accuracy guarantees, or viking kitties, and you could end up anywhere.

Any of the Savage Model 12...
The Browning X-bolt Amax.
Ruger Precision Rifle.
Browning White Medallion.
A CeeZed.

In that order.

Mileage test conducted by the Factory under ideal conditions.
Your actual wallet mileage may vary.

I would look at the Savage model 12 or Remington 700 varmint rifle. Great out of the box accuracy.

ruger predator rifle for the newer type construction, howa or rem for traditional bolt gun construction. while I have a couple of savages floating around they are clunky in my mind.

kidneyboy said:

Looking for some feedback on bolt action 223s. I'd like to give the cartridge a try but really don't like the AR platform. Mostly for shooting at paper/steel beyond 100yds.

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OK, so but if you get the rifle in a 5.56 then it will ALSO shoot the .223 giving you a bigger choice of ammo sources, right?

The CZ and Howas both use 9 twist barrels, and I believe have somewhat oal restrictive mags. I'd be looking for an 8 or faster twist, and long oal mags in a .223 I wanted to use for long range (I'm assuming that beyond 100 yds = well beyond 100 yds).

There may be other options they fit the bill, but in a cheap-ish factory rig I'd lean towards a Tikka T3x 8 twist with these Mountain Tactical mags, which allow for OALs up to 2.6":

https://tikkaperformance.com/tikka-magazines/Tikka-T3-T3x-223-4Round

If you wanted to drop the Tikka in an aftermarket stock or chassis later on there are lots of options.

I talked to a guy at the range a few months ago who was running 80gr ELDs loaded long (~2.5"-ish) in a custom out to 1,000 yds, the results were impressive for a rifle that's so cheap to shoot.

Hokkmike said:

. . .if you get the rifle in a 5.56 then it will ALSO shoot the .223 . . . right?

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Prepare the panty-wads. . . No.

From personal experience and hundreds of threads of others experience, firing full power 5.56 in a commercial .223Rem chamber will result in nothing but disappointing accuracy because it's inaccurate ammo. The actual difference in resulting pressure is less than the effects of temperature, barrel variations, sign of the Zodiak, etc.

And now we will hear from the "bbbbut it's not marked!" contingent.

</snark>

I have a Mossberg MVP thunder ranch model that I suppressed. It is an excellent rifle, and is very accurate with heavier (77 and 75 grain) bullets. It also uses AR mags, so Pmag 20 rounders or even 10 rounders are perfect.

edwardware said:

Prepare the panty-wads. . . No.

From personal experience and hundreds of threads of others experience, firing full power 5.56 in a commercial .223Rem chamber will result in nothing but disappointing accuracy because it's inaccurate ammo. The actual difference in resulting pressure is less than the effects of temperature, barrel variations, sign of the Zodiak, etc.

And now we will hear from the "bbbbut it's not marked!" contingent.

</snark>

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Sorry - what I have always understood is this:

The .223s are loaded to lower pressures and velocities compared to 5.56mm. Due to its lower pressure, you can safely fire .223 Rem. ammunition in a 5.56mm chambered gun; however, the same cannot be said in reverse.

My prettiest .223 boltgun, a CZ527 fullstock, NEGC iron sights, 3-shot mag inserted with 5-shot spares:

With bolt action .223s you really have to pay attention to the barrel twist. Some of the manufacturers use 1-12, some 1-9. If it is 1-12 then it will shoot the 50-55 grain bullets accurately while the 1-9 will be able to shoot the heavier 62 grain bullets well. If you are just going to shoot inexpensive 55 grain bullets it probably doesn't matter but if you want to deer hunt with 68 grain bullets twist is a real concern.

The worst thing that will happen when firing 5.56 ammo in a 223 chamber is that the action may not cycle them reliably in a semiauto. In a manually operated action there won't be any issues. Yes, technically 5.56 CAN be loaded a little hotter than 223. But the difference is tiny and in the real world there is a LOT of overlap. You'll find some 223 ammo loaded hotter than some 5.56 ammo and some 5.56 will be loaded hotter than some 223. Plus, no manufacturer loads ammo right to the limits. If you're handloading EITHER 5.56 or 223 right to the maximum limits you might run into some minor issues.

And FWIW you are far, far more likely to run into issues like this with 30-06 ammo than you are with 223/5.56. Over the last 100+ years 30-06 loads have changed drastically and modern ammo can cause far more problems with semi-autos and even some bolt actions. We could easily have 3 different designations for 30-06.

As to which rifle, my top 2 picks if you want accuracy are either a Tikka, or Ruger Predator. Both of these are twisted to take advantage of good target loads.

My Ruger at 200 yards. I've shot it out to 600 with 3/4 MOA groups. My brother has a Tikka that is at least as accurate, maybe more so.

I have two bolt guns in 223. A Winchester Model 70 Featherweight that I picked up in 91 after coming home from Desert Storm. I load some smoking hot hand loads for it for groundhog hunting.
The other is a Savage Axis II XP Predator. I can’t say how the Savage shoots because I haven’t shot it yet.

I've been on the look out for a 223 bolt, only gun I've given much though was the cz, there are a bunch of old rifles in 223 that would be nice. I miss my sako in 222.

I despise savage rifles and have since my first model 99 in high school. On a bolt gun I prefer nicer wood and fit/finish (and no ugly barrel nut) That said, I got a savage 12fv for almost nothing but a few cabelas points at cabelas on black Friday weekend a few years back. I believe it was 350 on sale and a 100 dollar rebate. It is more accurate than any other 223 I own. As long as a cheap feeling stock (very cheap, very synthetic and very flexible) and a heavy and long for caliber 26 inch barrel arent an issue for your use. I have far more expensive (and considerably nicer) 223 rifles that do not perform as well. I put an EGW mount and scope on it and im impressed. I shoot cheap factory 55 grain vmax and can touch bullets at 100 yards consistently. With 40s I still shoot well under moa. Tikka and CZ or a used 788 are my next choices in 223. But out of the box the savage is a great value. I've heard good things about the new Rugers as well. In my opinion The mossberg patriot is the nicest looking budget gun but myself and my uncle (300wm and 243) have them and both shoot pretty poorly.

I picked up one of those package deal Savage model 11 Trophy predator Hunter rifles a few years back and it has proven to be very accurate.

kidneyboy said:

... I take it that you guys that actually shoot 223 bolt guns are pleased with them?

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Yes ...
I have a Howa 1500 heavy barrel in .223. It is my most precise rifle.

As others have said, a bit more information would help the gang. Shooting paper and steel is a good start. Do you have a budget? Does it include the cost of optics, a rail and scope rings? What distance will you mostly be shooting at? Compete at all, or just a fun gun? Do you want it to be detachable magazine fed vs. fed from an internal magazine? Does barrel weight matter (shooting paper, I'd assume you'd be ok with a heavy barrel vs. a lightweight hunting barrel?). Do you reload? Etc.

A .223 bolt gun is a great rifle to have. Will make you a better shot with all larger calibers as there is almost no recoil to deal with, ammo is inexpensive and plentiful, wind does have an affect on a .223 bullet which will make you better at wind calls, etc.

As far as which rifle, you have a wealth of good choices, many of which have been mentioned already. As you're shooting paper and steel, I'll assume a heavy barrel .223 is in your future. Some options include:
Remington 700 - most popular bolt action rifle. Remington makes lots of models in .223 to choose from. The 700 has the most aftermarket parts of any rifle platform that allow you to make it your own. You could buy a SPS Tac model inexpensively and throw modifications at it as wants and money allows. I have one of these that I've put a Timney trigger on and mounted to a KRG Bravo chassis so I could have a detachable magazine and an adjustable comb. It has a 1:9 twist barrel, so you can't use much more than 75 gr. bullets. Usually, heavier bullets have higher ballistic coefficients. I reload 68 gr. and 75 gr. Hornady BTHP's and have gotten .25MOA groups out to 200 yds and 1/3 MOA groups at 300 yds.
Tikka T3x Varmint or CTR - very smooth actions and accurate barrels. 1:8 twist barrel will allow you to use heavier, longer bullets. Cost a bit more than Rem. 700's. Not as much aftermarket support, but enough.
Howa - Another great rifle for the dollar. A Rem 700 based platform.
Ruger Precision Rifle - a complete package. A precision rifle that comes from the factory with an adjustable stock, railed receiver and forend (no scope rail to buy), a heavy 1:7 twist barrel (can use the heaviest, highest BC bullets available) and muzzle brake and a good amt. of aftermarket support. Not shown on Rugers site anymore, but previously made one's are still available new.
Savages (lots of models to choose from) - typically good triggers (Savages Accutrigger) and accurate barrels, with good aftermarket support (again, that means stocks, triggers, rails, barrels, etc.).
CZ's
Mossberg
Kimber
Winchester
etc.
Not a dog in the bunch

If you're looking to spend more into the thousands of dollars, you have all sorts of choices around the $2K mark all the way up to a full custom (e.g. GA Precision) costing $3K+ dollars. You can then specify exactly what you want.

As a do-it-all rifle, the Ruger American Predator is hard to beat. Has what most would call a "medium" weight barrel, heavier than a sporter but not quite a heavy barrel. Light enough to carry around if you want to but stiffer than your standard sporter.

If the green polymer stock on them is a turn off, Boyd's does offer laminates for both the standard mag and AR mag versions now. I know you said you're not really into ARs, but the mags are pretty cheap (especially compared to the OEM mags) so I'd personally opt for the AR mag version.

Tell us what you think after shooting the Browning (also a solid choice). If you like the T1x, you will really like the T3x in a larger caliber!

You asked if we shoot .223's. I have the Remington 700 SPS Tac in .223 I describe above. I've put between 700-800 rounds through it and it has made me a better shot. I also have a Rem. 700 I bought last year in 6.5 Creedmoor (too cheap to pass up) that I built up similar to the .223 (a Bravo stock, Trigger Tech trigger, Vortex optics) I'm still working on loads for. Even with the 6.5CM, I would certainly never get rid of the .223. It's a great training tool. I still like putting .223 rounds downrange even with the 6.5CM. I also have a precision .22 I use as a trainer (your T1x could serve a similar purpose, its a great gun). A .22 at 100 or 200 yds certainly makes you pay attention to wind. I also have an AR, but to me the AR and bolt gun are different animals. I have and like both.