Safe trouble round 2

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WestKentucky

WestKentucky

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I have a Cannon safe which is acting up... again. First round I had an electronic lock go kaput and the safe had me locked out for about 2 months while I was saving money for a locksmith to open the safe. It opened for a friend of mine and I was able to replace the lock and keypad. I think the same thing is happening again. Even with a fresh Duracell it is clicking and not opening the lock. I’m done fooling with electronic locks, and I’m considering putting some tax money toward a new safe. Before I do that though, is there a good way to replace the electronic lock with a dial lock? The electronic lock is a S&G if there’s a way, I would like to do it. If not I’m going to take part of the locking mechanism out and weld on a heavy shed hasp and use a heavy duty lock. I prefer not to throw the safe away but rather to move it to the garage for storing other things (reloading supplies, and my electric saws which would break into the safe mainly).

Safe is open currently.
 
Anything can be done but it doesn’t look like it would be as easy as unscrewing one and screwing another back on, according to cannon.

Can I replace the digital keypad with a mechanical lock?
Digital locks provide secure and fast access to your valuables. Safes with digital keypads cannot support a mechanical lock because they lack specific features to guarantee protection.
Click to expand...

Can I upgrade my digital keypad to EMP?
No, the wiring configuration in the digital keypad is different when compared to the EMP lock.
Click to expand...
https://www.cannonsafe.com/faqs/


This fellow thinks there are some than can be swapped though.

Wayne Winton
4 years ago
Yes look at the back of the door panel. You can send me pictures to tricountylocksmithservice@gmail.com and I'll tell you what you have
Click to expand...

 
Last edited:
That lock is a Sargent & Greenleaf.
The factory is in nicholasville, ky.
They make all kinds of locks. I use to be neighbors with the owner, when I was a kid. Maybe they might have a retro for that electronic lock.
 
Should be a pretty easy swap unless it's a non standard lock. A Phillips screwdriver ave a hacksaw or dremel is normally all it takes. 2 tips, when installing the dial you have to properly align it according to the actual lock either vertical up or down, our horizontal left or right based on the bolt. Also test out at least 5 times before closing the door. Actually worked on safes for years.

And take that current lock off before the door gets closed by mistake!
 
ttownrider said:
And take that current lock off before the door gets closed by mistake!
Click to expand...
Won’t be a mistake. The bolts are out with the door open. If it closes then it’s because I took the door apart and closed it. I will try to call Cannon again, but I’m not very excited about it. It took me a year to be comfortable with the lock last time, this time I know I will never trust it. At least I’m not locked out this time.
 
WestKentucky said:
Before I do that though, is there a good way to replace the electronic lock with a dial lock?
Click to expand...
In every safe I've owned or worked on, and every lock I've seen. . . the electronic lock footprint is exactly the same as the mechanical footprint. The only exceptions I know of are the store-brand level sheet metal shoeboxes.

A complete used S&G or Kaba mechanical lock can be had for $50 or so on ebay, or $100 for a new lock kit. Installing really isn't hard. . . if you wrench your own cars it's easy.

Drop that electronic in the trash and install a mechanical this week. Check carefully for operation and binding.
 
I'm going through a similar issue with my LaGard mechanical combination lock. I specifically went that route because I assumed a mechanical lock would be more reliable, but lately it's been taking 3-4 tries to open. Yesterday I gave up after about 15 attempts so it must be time to buy a replacement.
 
jmorris said:
Anything can be done but it doesn’t look like it would be as easy as unscrewing one and screwing another back on, according to cannon.




https://www.cannonsafe.com/faqs/


This fellow thinks there are some than can be swapped though.



Click to expand...

That quote about “specific features to guarantee protection” might be referring to something like a glass plate mechanical relocker. Personally I would rather have a working mechanical lock missing that feature than an electronic one that is waiting to fail at any moment. All of my safes have mechanical locks. For my big Rhino I had to contact the factory after I ordered it and ask them to substitute it. I knew it was going in an unheated garage and I worried about temperature and humidity fluctuations. I think the slight lack of convenience is a small price to pay for not worrying if I’m going to be able to get it open.
 
Elkins45 said:
Personally I would rather have a working mechanical lock missing that feature than an electronic one that is waiting to fail at any moment.
Click to expand...

With me, you and the OP, that makes three. :)

Call SG directly. They helped me when I replaced mine.
Click to expand...

That’s what I would do, call or with an email you could include photos of their unit you are wanting to replace.
 
WestKentucky said:
I have a Cannon safe which is acting up... again. First round I had an electronic lock go kaput and the safe had me locked out for about 2 months while I was saving money for a locksmith to open the safe. It opened for a friend of mine and I was able to replace the lock and keypad. I think the same thing is happening again. Even with a fresh Duracell it is clicking and not opening the lock. I’m done fooling with electronic locks, and I’m considering putting some tax money toward a new safe. Before I do that though, is there a good way to replace the electronic lock with a dial lock? The electronic lock is a S&G if there’s a way, I would like to do it. If not I’m going to take part of the locking mechanism out and weld on a heavy shed hasp and use a heavy duty lock. I prefer not to throw the safe away but rather to move it to the garage for storing other things (reloading supplies, and my electric saws which would break into the safe mainly).

Safe is open currently.
Click to expand...
My Liberty, under warranty, had an electronic dial issue - mine WOULDN'T lock; they sent a bonded locksmith a new dial (my insistence) and he came out and installed it in 20 minutes or less at no cost to me; cheaper than a new safe
 
WestKentucky said:
Won’t be a mistake. The bolts are out with the door open. If it closes then it’s because I took the door apart and closed it. I will try to call Cannon again, but I’m not very excited about it. It took me a year to be comfortable with the lock last time, this time I know I will never trust it. At least I’m not locked out this time.
Click to expand...

I personally won't put a electronic lock on anything I own. Working for diebold, I replaced probably 1 a month on average. In all the years I worked there I never had a mechanical one fail. I have a few safes and my cannon was given to me because the relocker fired during transport, after getting it open i Installed a mechanical because I have zero faith in electronic. I would just make the switch and never look back
 
I got a double dial lock when I bought a safe for the new house.
Kind of a primitive system, it has a regular combination dial that works as usual.
The separate keypad apparently frees the dial, enter the combination and turn the dial to a stop just like the last step in the mechanical combination. Then crank the bolts back.
When my battery went flat the other day, I dialed the dial and opened it right up. I normally open manually on Sunday just to keep the right four, left three fresh in my mind.
 
ttownrider said:
I personally won't put a electronic lock on anything I own. Working for diebold, I replaced probably 1 a month on average. In all the years I worked there I never had a mechanical one fail. I have a few safes and my cannon was given to me because the relocker fired during transport, after getting it open i Installed a mechanical because I have zero faith in electronic. I would just make the switch and never look back
Click to expand...
One thing the locksmith told me about mechanicals is that they can be somewhat delicate inside so do not spin the dial, especially quickly, when closing and locking the safe as that can wear some parts out making the combination "walk" a few numbers either way.
 
bassjam said:
I'm going through a similar issue with my LaGard mechanical combination lock. I specifically went that route because I assumed a mechanical lock would be more reliable, but lately it's been taking 3-4 tries to open. Yesterday I gave up after about 15 attempts so it must be time to buy a replacement.
Click to expand...

One thing about a mechanical lock is that it will usually warn you that it needs service before you get locked out. Unfortunately, most of us will put it off like you did until it locks you out. A service, lube and adjustment might be all that's needed still if you get it opened.
 
FAS1 said:
One thing about a mechanical lock is that it will usually warn you that it needs service before you get locked out. Unfortunately, most of us will put it off like you did until it locks you out. A service, lube and adjustment might be all that's needed still if you get it opened.
Click to expand...

I've been meaning to pop it open and take a look, it just is something I haven't set aside time for. Months ago I tried lubing it through the dial, but in hindsight that was a mistake. I used a light oil and while it helped initially, I think the oil caused it to get gummy which in the end made it worse. I've since read graphite is better.
 
I'd look at polishing and *PROPERLY* lubricating the servo-bolt.

I've had to do it to a couple-three electro-lock safes. Can't speak to your exact model without seeing it first, though.



Todd.
 
Jim Watson said:
I got a double dial lock when I bought a safe for the new house.
Kind of a primitive system, it has a regular combination dial that works as usual.
The separate keypad apparently frees the dial, enter the combination and turn the dial to a stop just like the last step in the mechanical combination. Then crank the bolts back.
When my battery went flat the other day, I dialed the dial and opened it right up. I normally open manually on Sunday just to keep the right four, left three fresh in my mind.
Click to expand...

Sounds like this one.

 
gnappi said:
Sorry for your woes with the safe. I was unaware till this post that an electronic safe without a key override was even made.

Mine is purely mechanical with rotary dial and a key which locks the dial. Sometimes it's good to be old fashioned :)
Click to expand...

I want to buy a safe that does not depend on electronic/digital keypads to open. I HOPE they are still available.
 
Hokkmike said:
I want to buy a safe that does not depend on electronic/digital keypads to open. I HOPE they are still available.
Click to expand...
They are, but you might have to have a shop order one in. Electronic chinese-made locks are cheap so they get used. When mine worked it WAS faster and easier; but then it crapped out for no reason
 
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