IMO the Grendel is a neither fish-nor fowl round, not versatile.I'm thinking about building or buying one of these. Some factors to consider here:
- I can reload .308, and COULD reload 6.5G if I wanted (just need the dies). I already have all the stuff for .308 reloading though, and have another gun in that caliber already.
- No AR-10 will be as modular as any AR-15. I doubt I could just slap a new barrel and mag into an AR-10 and have a new caliber.
- Given the way runs on ammo happen these days, I'd like to avoid 5.56/.223 altogether, along with any components that caliber uses (.224 bullets, small rifle primers, which I suppose 6.5G also uses).
- Is anyone going to care about 6.5 Grendel in 10 years?
- I hear 6.5G has "half the recoil" of .308 in a lot of places. True?
True, that.That word switch changes quite a lot. Versatility and practicality are two very (often vastly) different things.
Not versatile??? It fits into ~2lb lighter platforms. Even in boltguns it comes in lighter guns, for example the Ruger Ranch compared to the Predator. It also works very well on the TC Contender pistol, as compared to the much heavier Encore. Where it basically mimics the 6.5JDJ that has been used on deer and antelope all over the world. It can cover varmints to all medium game out to 300yds using bullets up to 140gr. The .243's "versatility" is never questioned and the Grendel is much more capable than it is.IMO the Grendel is a neither fish-nor fowl round, not versatile.
Excellent arguments.Not versatile??? It fits into ~2lb lighter platforms. Even in boltguns it comes in lighter guns, for example the Ruger Ranch compared to the Predator. It also works very well on the TC Contender pistol, as compared to the much heavier Encore. Where it basically mimics the 6.5JDJ that has been used on deer and antelope all over the world. It can cover varmints to all medium game out to 300yds using bullets up to 140gr. The .243's "versatility" is never questioned and the Grendel is much more capable than it is.
No, they are not, this is literally the opposite of what happens. 556 is the first to go, other calibers are often not even affected as we have just seen with the Lake City happening..
When runs on ammo occur, less predominant cartridges are the first to disappear and the last to come back..
When you make it about versatility there isn't anything a 6.5G will kill that you couldn't with a 308.Okay, a lot of people are asking exactly what I plan to use it for. This would be my do-everything gun, the gun I just pick up if I need a centerfire rifle for almost any purpose. This would include shooting varmints from crows to groundhogs through coyote to feral pigs; camp defense against a bear, SHTF, zombie apocalypse, long(ish) range target shooting, etc.
I am not much of a rifle shooter, so even all added up I don't do most of these things combined all that often. I already own a lot of .22s, shotguns, and air rifles, so I just need one versatile rifle for all the above. I don't care if either the cartridge or the gun is the best at anything, it just has to be good enough to get the job done passably well.
Sounds to me like the Grendel or even 5.56/.223 is really all you need unless your bear is a charging grizzly.Okay, a lot of people are asking exactly what I plan to use it for. This would be my do-everything gun, the gun I just pick up if I need a centerfire rifle for almost any purpose. This would include shooting varmints from crows to groundhogs through coyote to feral pigs; camp defense against a bear, SHTF, zombie apocalypse, long(ish) range target shooting, etc.
I am not much of a rifle shooter, so even all added up I don't do most of these things combined all that often. I already own a lot of .22s, shotguns, and air rifles, so I just need one versatile rifle for all the above. I don't care if either the cartridge or the gun is the best at anything, it just has to be good enough to get the job done passably well.
No, they are not, this is literally the opposite of what happens. 556 is the first to go, other calibers are often not even affected as we have just seen with the Lake City happening.
You mean old school like the 6.5x54MS? Because that's essentially what it duplicates and part of why it appeals to me.Excellent arguments.
I'm too old school in an era when the 30-06 ruled.
Agreed. The .308 is no doubt a more capable cartridge, with controlled expansion 180gr bullets, elk and moose are on the table without raising an eyebrow. But if I was going to hunt those critters with a .308, it would not be an AR10. The platform just offers no benefit to justify the weight.The downside of the "more power" approach is that the bigger gun becomes less optimum for the uses you actually listed. Yes you can use a 308 for crows but an AR-15 gun is just way better for this end of the spectrum. The extra weight of the AR-10 also puts it at risk of you eventually deciding that it is just to much to tote around for uses where carrying an AR-15 is not a problem.
I've never been a fan of the old MS round, and technology back at the beginning of the 20th century passed it by. I DO love the old DT MS rifles, especially the full stocks.You mean old school like the 6.5x54MS? Because that's essentially what it duplicates and part of why it appeals to me.
Agreed. The .308 is no doubt a more capable cartridge, with controlled expansion 180gr bullets, elk and moose are on the table without raising an eyebrow. But if I was going to hunt those critters with a .308, it would not be an AR10. The platform just offers no benefit to justify the weight.
Agreed. The .308 is no doubt a more capable cartridge, with controlled expansion 180gr bullets, elk and moose are on the table without raising an eyebrow. But if I was going to hunt those critters with a .308, it would not be an AR10. The platform just offers no benefit to justify the weight.
I handled an SFAR when they first came out. If they offer a 6.5CM version, I may just have to bite.Another SFAR owner here.
Absolutely true. The standard frame AR10 is far too heavy compared to an AR15 in 6.5G for the benefits it offers, if you even needed the capacity of a magazine fed semi auto over a bolt gun.
If I were hunting elk and moose with a .308 I would be doing it with a bolt gun. You only get one tag here, and I favor using one big well placed round over multiple rounds in quick succession.
If I were hunting game that might present the opportunity for multiple shots on multiple animals in quick succession, like coyote or hog hunting, an AR15 6.5G is a great option.
I have a PA10, and an SFAR. The PA10 weighs about 14lbs with just a scope and bipod and is just ridiculous as a "hunting" rifle. Its a range toy.
The SFAR is a 16" rifle that weighs and handles the same as the average AR15. It destroys the weight arguments around a .308AR.
But again. What are you going to be hunting that requires multiple (5+) shots of .308 power in quick semi auto succession that can't easily be handled by a 6.5G?
Yeah but the Grendel is not going to be shot in the quantity that 5.56 is. Even with four guns, at the rate I'm going, I'll never need more than the 500rds of Starline brass I have now. If I thought it might be an issue, I'd buy an extra BCG and another 500rds of brass and never think about it again.Besides the uncommon to obtain cartridge case this is the reason I'd never own a 6.5 Grendel. I have been shooting a 6.5 cartridge 50 years and love my 6.5 Creedmore in AR10 and other . I shot 6.5 Ugalde in IMSA in a T/C Contender. The bolt head in the AR 15 is a crucial part and actually a wearing and possible first to go part. Look whats left in a 6.5 Grendel and tell me you want to get performance loads out of it ! Also Remington did a lot of work for the Govt. with how big a reliable case could be in the AR15 format and came up with the 6.8 as the max for normal reliability. Of course there are now other weird formats for bigger cartridges in AR 15 size guns but for military , common interchange ability check out the comparsion. In a AR .450 B for instance pressures are held down for such reduction in bolt face and yes locking lugs.
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Besides the uncommon to obtain cartridge case this is the reason I'd never own a 6.5 Grendel. I have been shooting a 6.5 cartridge 50 years and love my 6.5 Creedmore in AR10 and other . I shot 6.5 Ugalde in IMSA in a T/C Contender. The bolt head in the AR 15 is a crucial part and actually a wearing and possible first to go part. Look whats left in a 6.5 Grendel and tell me you want to get performance loads out of it ! Also Remington did a lot of work for the Govt. with how big a reliable case could be in the AR15 format and came up with the 6.8 as the max for normal reliability. Of course there are now other weird formats for bigger cartridges in AR 15 size guns but for military , common interchange ability check out the comparsion. In a AR .450 B for instance pressures are held down for such reduction in bolt face and yes locking lugs.
View attachment 1179377