Outside neck Turner?

troy fairweather · Mar 7, 2020

Looking at outside neck turners, for my 7x57ai. I was going to get a neck reamer but for that I think I can get a neck turning tool.
Thinking the k&m would be best? Is it worth it for the carbine. I would think the hss could be sharpened with a diamond stone.

My dad has a forster brass trimmer, I think I could get the outside cutter for $50 anyone use it before.

Blue68f100 · Mar 7, 2020

I have the K&M neck trimmer setup. It works well. I believe I have a carbide cutter in mine. HS will work just fine. Either can be sharpened with a diamond stone, if needed. But there is a small radius with the neck angle for cutting all the way to the shoulder. So pay attention to the neck angle when you buy your cutter.

jmorris · Mar 7, 2020

The only necks I turn anymore are for rifles with smaller than normal chambers in the neck area. For the rest I have found it to be better just to use better brass to start with, than try and fix really bad brass and work the thinner necks more than normal, as far as blowing it out and sizing it down enough to hold a bullet again.

You could borrow your Dad’s Forster and get their attachment and play with it yourself though.

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1012688930

I think their 3 in 1 would be better money spent though, for most stuff and I have their turning attachment.

There was a K&M for $30 on castboolits last night but looks like it already sold, if the deal goes through.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?397465-WTS-K-amp-M-services-large-neck-turn-tool

243winxb · Mar 7, 2020

The Forster works almost like my discontinued Lyman unit i use. For $50 it would be a good buy & a useful tool. imo.

I do turn 100 % of the necks of 223 & 243. I see no good reason to turn only the high spotts off. The case walls need to be no smaller then .010" thick. With a minimum cut, i remove just a hair more then .001" Never getting close to the minimum.

Yes, the neck will have more clearance/slop in the chamber, after turning. This is where a bushing die is usefull. Sizing only 1/2 of the neck allows the unsized part of the neck to expand to the chamber. Centering the round after about 3 firings. Better accuracy in my Rem 40XB 243 win.

My 223 brass is turned and loaded using standard RCBS fl dies for a Savage Axis. Accurcy seems to remain the same between turned and unturned.
But the greatest advantage is an increase in case life. No more split neck or cracked neck separations. The expander is a lot easier to pull thru the sized necks.

Many 5.56/223 brass , even when new, will have a donut. A donut being a thicker wall diameter right at the neck/shoulder junction. See photos in my album. Outside turning removes this problem. Greatly increasing case life of Benchrest Preped brass.

The cutter on K&M types may be more usefull. The cutters can be designed to cut into the shoulder. Great after forming a wildcat cartriage & maybe a blown out AI .

My guess, no experence with cutting into a shoulder. The Lyman needs to stop at the neck/shoulder junction. To deep a cut will cause separations on the shoulder.
I believe the Forster works the same way.

Inside neck reaming - Should only be done when neck is held in a die while reaming. Imo. But if there is a LOT of brass to remove, inside neck ream first, leaving enough wall thickness to finish by outside neck turning.
*Inside reaming has a tendency to rough up the hole being reamed*

troy fairweather · Mar 7, 2020

jmorris said:
The only necks I turn anymore are for rifles with smaller than normal chambers in the neck area. For the rest I have found it to be better just to use better brass to start with, than try and fix really bad brass and work the thinner necks more than normal, as far as blowing it out and sizing it down enough to hold a bullet again.

You could borrow your Dad’s Forster and get their attachment and play with it yourself though.

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1012688930

I think their 3 in 1 would be better money spent though, for most stuff and I have their turning attachment.

There was a K&M for $30 on castboolits last night but looks like it already sold, if the deal goes through.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?397465-WTS-K-amp-M-services-large-neck-turn-tool

I do like the forster stuff, I have to see what the cost be with all I need.

troy fairweather · Mar 7, 2020

Blue68f100 said:
I have the K&M neck trimmer setup. It works well. I believe I have a carbide cutter in mine. HS will work just fine. Either can be sharpened with a diamond stone, if needed. But there is a small radius with the neck angle for cutting all the way to the shoulder. So pay attention to the neck angle when you buy your cutter.

I'd guess if the cut is not into the shoulder some there more of a donut, I know my dad has the inside neck reamers. I'll have to see if he has a 7mm tho, thanks for the info

troy fairweather · Mar 7, 2020

243winxb said:
The Forster works almost like my discontinued Lyman unit i use. For $50 it would be a good buy & a useful tool. imo.

I do turn 100 % of the necks of 223 & 243. I see no good reason to turn only the high spotts off. The case walls need to be no smaller then .010" thick. With a minimum cut, i remove just a hair more then .001" Never getting close to the minimum.

Yes, the neck will have more clearance/slop in the chamber, after turning. This is where a bushing die is usefull. Sizing only 1/2 of the neck allows the unsized part of the neck to expand to the chamber. Centering the round after about 3 firings. Better accuracy in my Rem 40XB 243 win.

My 223 brass is turned and loaded using standard RCBS fl dies for a Savage Axis. Accurcy seems to remain the same between turned and unturned.
But the greatest advantage is an increase in case life. No more split neck or cracked neck separations. The expander is a lot easier to pull thru the sized necks.

Many 5.56/223 brass , even when new, will have a donut. A donut being a thicker wall diameter right at the neck/shoulder junction. See photos in my album. Outside turning removes this problem. Greatly increasing case life of Benchrest Preped brass.

The cutter on K&M types may be more usefull. The cutters can be designed to cut into the shoulder. Great after forming a wildcat cartriage & maybe a blown out AI .

My guess, no experence with cutting into a shoulder. The Lyman needs to stop at the neck/shoulder junction. To deep a cut will cause separations on the shoulder.
I believe the Forster works the same way.

Inside neck reaming - Should only be done when neck is held in a die while reaming. Imo. But if there is a LOT of brass to remove, inside neck ream first, leaving enough wall thickness to finish by outside neck turning.
*Inside reaming has a tendency to rough up the hole being reamed*

Ya I will be close on the minimum neck thickness, I believe I need to be at .010 think to stay under the .314-.315 the neck is cut at. The neck is long so I think that may help some, I use a Lee neck collect so sizing should be fine. Thanks for the info.

Blue68f100 · Mar 7, 2020

Here is a photo of my 224V that has been neck turned to the shoulder. As you can see it gives you a smooth transition.

Walkalong · Mar 7, 2020

From my Benchrest days and turning necks for a 6 PPC .262 neck.

forrest r · Mar 8, 2020

I love the forster trimmers, have 2 of them along with the hp tooling. Don't know about using them for turning necks, I use a K&N tool for that for that.

Spade5 · Mar 8, 2020

I have the Forster case trimmer and I bought another base and the neck turning cutter and the pilot. I have no experience with any other neck turner and while the Forster in my opinion is good quality, I just cannot work the wheel control that allows the cutter to move down the neck. I do use it to set the stop point but simply turn the crank and slowly put some lateral pressure on it to move the cutter down the neck. Then I slowly move the cutter back so cut in two passes. I really don't need to do this but I am a sucker for gadgets but not the most coordinated for this process. I don't think the trimmer pilot will work for turning.

fotheringill · Mar 8, 2020

KM now has different angles for different necks instead of the standard 50 degree one that comes with the tool. Much cleaner when the neck meets the shoulder.

jmorris · Mar 8, 2020

I just cannot work the wheel control that allows the cutter to move down the neck.

I powered mine to simply the rotation and then I have better control of the cam.

As stated above I don’t do it for everything, it isn’t very graceful, just a power window motor that threads on in place of the handle.

Outside neck Turner?

troy fairweather

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