The ATF is failing to properly deal with illegal gun sales by FFLs.

That was a tiresome article, and the USA Today bias was about palpable.
So, it's a "major problem" that 3% of FFL might be "bad."
And that 108 out of ±80,000 (that's 0.135%) ought be shuttered?

I'll just guess that other federaly-licensed operations are no where near that "well regulated."

I'd be incredibly skeptical of this as an authoritative source. Anti-gun lobby tends to share agenda-driven half-truths and provide solutions that don't necessarily drive to the stated objective. I'd like to see a link to the reports that have the actual data. In the end, what matters is that people aren't harmed by violent criminals. I have no idea if all of these process errors resulted in harm or not. I'd much rather look at the violent crime and assess the circumstances around violent acts to determine better solutions. What are the driving factors for more than 200 murders year to date in Chicago? Is it because FFL dealers didn't file their paperwork, didn't effectively conduct background checks, gang violence, drugs, lack of 2 parent households, mental health, global warming, etc. This article is really just propaganda that is focused on putting pressure on the ATF to reduce the number of FFL holders or stop the online sales of firearms. Less access to purchase firearms means less competition, less access, costs go up.

After "operation fast and furious" this is absolutely on the table as an option.

The article uses *violation(s)* some 2 dozen or more times.

Anyone who has ground through an ATF *compliance* check knows how easily a stack of 4473s with *violations* can stack up.

Once the compiling of these violations is complete - it is generally assumed that they are honest errors and the FFL is most often allowed to correct them.

I just spent some 15 hours auditing a pal's 4473s for only 3 years and the stack that would have been deemed *violation* was hefty. Worst case scenario is tracking down the buyer to correct the document.

Before anyone gets all holier than thou on that and threatens to ban me.... I have done this DOZENS of times under the very eye of the inspector.

Then, there is the dealer's *bound book* to contend with in relation to the in-puting and outgoing of the firearms allowing for even more opportunities to make an honest mistake.

I know it all looks straight-forward when you tricky-trot in to buy a gun but do it hundreds of times a year and then throw in the book that you never see.

Now too, when you get to a manufacturing dealer you can throw Excise-Tax into the mix for potential clerical *violations*... Does your paperwork exactly match the; platers', annodizers' and any other contractor that might handle your serialized item overnight?

So, what I see in the article is stacking correctable errors in a pile and calling them crimes for the sake of pumping up the BS surrounding the proposed ATF Director so he can come in and clean up the perceived mess - one that doesn't exist to the extent represented here.

Yeah, there'll be a new sheriff in town..... Beltway Barney Fife. Stupid and hateful is society's most dangerous form of human.


Todd.

milsurpguy said:

After "operation fast and furious" this is absolutely on the table as an option.

Click to expand...

Isn’t that like saying, “We need SWAT with guns on every customer that walks up to a teller, because the Bank Manager robbed the vault while everyone was gone last night”?

I wonder if the businesses they think should be shut down happen to be in any poorer or minority neighborhoods?
Oh! Wait. Of course not! They hate guns, they’re not racist! Ha ha! That would be silly…


“and failed to provide safety notices to handgun buyers.”
Dear Lord! No! The Horror!

“At one point, ATF records show, more than 600 firearms that should have been in stock could not be found”
Yeah, bro. Tell me about it. Where have you been? Everything is backordered…

The Trace is a publication of the gun control
lobby, funded by Michael Bloomberg and the Joyce Foundation, among others. It’s purpose is to generate chatter and sway opinion in support of gun control.

https://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_7581446

The Trace, Bloomberg-Backed Journalism Startup, Tackles Gun Violence ‘Epidemic’

NEW YORK — Gun enthusiasts have plenty of options for industry news and firearms reviews. And the National Rifle Association boasts its own media arm to amplify any perceived threats against Second Amendment.

What’s missing in the gun-media landscape, say founders of The Trace, is a news outlet devoted to the prevention of violence….

The Trace will not publish editorials supporting specific legislation or candidates. But the site will operate from the standpoint that there are “too many people being killed and injured by guns,” he said.

That perspective falls in line with Everytown for Gun Safety, the advocacy organization launched last year by Michael Bloomberg, the billionaire media mogul and former New York mayor, to challenge the NRA’s dominance in the gun debate. Bloomberg’s organization is providing seed money for The Trace, which will be run as separate, editorially independent nonprofit. Huffington Post co-founder and BuzzFeed chairman Ken Lerer, venture capitalist Nick Hanauer, and The Joyce Foundation have also signed on as backers

Click to expand...

I wouldn't base too much on this article. I don't find it to be all that credible as it used quite a bit of flowery, arbitrary language and really didn't provide all that much in terms of factual base.

That said, when the GF was working compliance for a shop a few years back the ATF was a common sight. The owner could not be bothered to renew their FFL in a timely manor (resulting in multi-month gaps), keep track of their inventory on a regular basis, and had a habit of sitting on and losing suppressor paperwork.

Such 'mistakes' in the aero industry would result in severe fines, if not jail time depending on the offence.

Yep, need more Ruby Ridge and Waco events...repeated leniency, I would ask where these people come from but I already know.

"There is a very real possibility that I have just overlooked this, but I was unaware that FFLs were required to provide safety notices to handgun buyers, at least beyond what is included with new handguns from the manufacturer. Owner's manuals and the like, but I'm not even certain that handing those over to the buyer is required by law."

Every firearm I have bought in the last 20 years or so a "Safety Notice" (4 page pamphlet) has been given to me along with a copy of the receipt. Nothing new or unusual.

Not sure if this has change remarkably, but when the idea of Federal Firearms Licensee (FFL) was begun (Gun Control Act of 1968 - GCA 68) any error in record keeping was a federal felony violation. The penalty was loss of license, FOLLOWING conviction.
With that sort of basis, most FFL dealers would be out of business, I think. Perhaps the wording has become a bit more sensible.

One notes very few firearms are traced to legal sales by FFL dealers. The information in the article sounds questionable.

ApacheCoTodd said:

So, what I see in the article is stacking correctable errors in a pile and calling them crimes for the sake of pumping up the BS surrounding the proposed ATF Director so he can come in and clean up the perceived mess - one that doesn't exist to the extent represented here.

Yeah, there'll be a new sheriff in town..... Beltway Barney Fife. Stupid and hateful is society's most dangerous form of human.

Click to expand...

Chipman formerly worked at BATF for almost 25 years, the last few in a senior position at their HQ in DC,, what was he doing there while all these alleged crimes were being perpetrated?

Making a sale with a technical rule violation in the paperwork is being conflated with making illegal sales to prohibited persons.

I seriously doubt ATF would guide an FFL into making his paperwork comply with ATF rules and regulations if the FFL was actually making illegal sales to prohibited persons.

Speedo66 said:

Chipman formerly worked at BATF for almost 25 years, the last few in a senior position at their HQ in DC,, what was he doing there while all these alleged crimes were being perpetrated?

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Waiting patiently for his chance to be in a position to; "make a difference" I should think.

Todd.

CapnMac said:

That was a tiresome article, and the USA Today bias was about palpable.
So, it's a "major problem" that 3% of FFL might be "bad."
And that 108 out of ±80,000 (that's 0.135%) ought be shuttered?

I'll just guess that other federaly-licensed operations are no where near that "well regulated."

Click to expand...

ATF's compliance process is outlined here: https://www.atf.gov/firearms/compliance-inspections
For ATF to revoke a dealers FFL requires more than a few paperwork or bookkeeping errors. Missing guns is more of a problem but even then ATF will give the dealer an opportunity to correct his problems, train employees, or devise procedures to keep it from happening again.

Willful actions such as knowingly transferring guns to persons who are prohibited persons is cause for revocation.

ApacheCoTodd said:

I just spent some 15 hours auditing a pal's 4473s for only 3 years

Click to expand...

Why? ATF doesn't audit any record older than a year.

Before anyone gets all holier than thou on that and threatens to ban me.... I have done this DOZENS of times under the very eye of the inspector.

Click to expand...

Done what?

Spats McGee said:

... I was unaware that FFLs were required to provide safety notices to handgun buyers,

Click to expand...

Is a licensee required to provide written notification regarding handguns and juveniles?
Yes. The requirement to give written notification applies when the licensee delivers a handgun to a nonlicensee. [27 CFR 478.103]

Based on what I know about operating rules for FFLs (Tom and other FFL holders can clarify) it takes quite a bit to have a license revoked. An infraction can be logging improperly in the A&D record up to willingly let a prohibited person walk out with a firearm they aren't allowed to own. TheTrace (Bloomberg's own mouthpiece) is lumping infractions in with each other, minor and major, to sound more scary for their misinformed audience.