UNIVERSAL difficult to meter?

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I never trickle up handgun loads, if they can't shoot very well with thrown charges, I don't want them. True match loads in rifle are the only ones I trickle up to. Even when shooting in registered Benchrest matches we all threw charges, no trickling up. Maybe some do these days
 
I must be a very boring shooter......I stay away from maximums, loads I have to trickle, and the worst powders that are hard to measure. I only weigh to check....to keep my measure honest. Only one exception......been shooting Unique for 50 years in my .45's. Have found it to be very easy going. Minor variations in volume caused by the Uniflow's consistency limits with that powder hasn't affected one thing. I do like how Unique fills up a case so I don't have to worry about screwing up and dumping two measures in.
 
Looks like we have established that a lot of us are just going to have to learn to live with plus/minus 0.2 grains with Universal. In the calibers I load it in, .357 Mag and .41 Mag, that is certainly no problem to me Right now I am loading HP 38 and probably have the same maximum spread but it seems more of the charges are right on target.
 
Walkalong said:
I never trickle up handgun loads, if they can't shoot very well with thrown charges, I don't want them. True match loads in rifle are the only ones I trickle up to. Even when shooting in registered Benchrest matches we all threw charges, no trickling up. Maybe some do these days
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It’s been part of my routine for so long it would feel wrong not to dip-n-drop onto the scale pan and dribble up to weight.
 
I assume this isn't specific to Universal. I know I had similar problems with Unique, another large flake powder, using the RCBS powder measure.

With fine grain powders, e.g., True Blue and H110, the Redding powder measure shines more so than the Uniflow as for as consistency.
 
jski said:
I’m having problems throwing consistent measures with Hodgdon’s Universal. I’m using the Redding powder measure.

Am I alone with this problem?
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It looks like the answer is, "No, you're not alone but it is a very small club."
 
I gave up on metering Universal a few years ago after purchasing 16 lbs of it with no previous experience. It was a horrific experience, which led to my purchase of the Frankford Arsenal Intellidropper. I wasn't about to toss 16 lbs of perfectly adequate powder...though had I known the horrors I was about to experience with it I'd have passed.
That said...I haven't found a powder yet that the Intellidropper didn't love. Stick, flake, ball, Squashed Universal disks...it powers right through without a problem. So, although I still hate Universal for what it did to me as a fairly new reloader, I have to tip my hat, as it forced me to the FA Intellidropper.
 
markr6754 said:
I gave up on metering Universal a few years ago after purchasing 16 lbs of it with no previous experience. It was a horrific experience, which led to my purchase of the Frankford Arsenal Intellidropper. I wasn't about to toss 16 lbs of perfectly adequate powder...though had I known the horrors I was about to experience with it I'd have passed.
That said...I haven't found a powder yet that the Intellidropper didn't love. Stick, flake, ball, Squashed Universal disks...it powers right through without a problem. So, although I still hate Universal for what it did to me as a fairly new reloader, I have to tip my hat, as it forced me to the FA Intellidropper.
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Which is why I'm curious why any serious loader doesn't have a machine yet. They are now relatively cheap, and the first to challenge that will likely have 5 presses and 2 sets of sies of 38/357 because adjusting them is to much effort.
 
AJC1 said:
Which is why I'm curious why any serious loader doesn't have a machine yet. They are now relatively cheap, and the first to challenge that will likely have 5 presses and 2 sets of sies of 38/357 because adjusting them is to much effort.
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I guess I'm not a serious reloader, then. Besides, no room for one on the stool. And no outlets in the swamp so it would have to be battery-powered. ;)
 
GeoDudeFlorida said:
I guess I'm not a serious reloader, then. Besides, no room for one on the stool. And no outlets in the swamp so it would have to be battery-powered. ;)
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I said curious, that was a question not a judgment. One answer I was expecting was no power outlet at deer camp. I'm just saying the prices were way down compared to high end measures before rona so they were in reach for those tired of chopping powder.
 
AJC1 said:
I said curious, that was a question not a judgment. One answer I was expecting was no power outlet at deer camp. I'm just saying the prices were way down compared to high end measures before rona so they were in reach for those tired of chopping powder.
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I took no offense. I'm not a serious reloader compared to many - perhaps even most - here on this forum. I don't load military calibers in the billions, don't compete professionally or on a national circuit, or supply a large club shooting community, and I'm not shooting fly-sized groups at a thousand yards. I just hunt and plink around using safe, time-tested, published loads in well-established manuals. I don't even follow the smartest kids on the block and load way over max just to see when the action blows up. A man's got to know his limitations. :)
If I can help out somebody looking for the same level of performance and at the same level of production, I will. Otherwise, I'm happy to leave the discussion to the brighter bulbs. :)
But I too contend that Universal just isn't that difficult a powder to deal with. It's one of the powders I typically recommend for beginners because it is so well documented and is so forgiving at moderate pressures.
 
GeoDudeFlorida said:
I took no offense. I'm not a serious reloader compared to many - perhaps even most - here on this forum. I don't load military calibers in the billions, don't compete professionally or on a national circuit, or supply a large club shooting community, and I'm not shooting fly-sized groups at a thousand yards. I just hunt and plink around using safe, time-tested, published loads in well-established manuals. I don't even follow the smartest kids on the block and load way over max just to see when the action blows up. A man's got to know his limitations. :)
If I can help out somebody looking for the same level of performance and at the same level of production, I will. Otherwise, I'm happy to leave the discussion to the brighter bulbs. :)
But I too contend that Universal just isn't that difficult a powder to deal with. It's one of the powders I typically recommend for beginners because it is so well documented and is so forgiving at moderate pressures.
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I thought it was going to be closer in br to unique than it is. Being a single base it still interests me, and the rumor is, it burns cleaner. I store them right next to each other and a fight hasn't broken out yet.... 16637690434803308871515716657192.jpg
 
I was convinced by a long time reloader to abandon Unique and go with Universal because it burns cleaner and has better performance in short barrel handguns. And I own a few snubbies.
 
Universal meters well thru my Lee disk measure, not as well thru my Hornady LNL measure.
Flake powders just won't meter as well as ball/flattened ball powders.
If the swing is not to bad just load for the swing.

AS Walkalong said, if you have a .2gr swing just make sure you are attempting to throw .2 under MAX.
 
Bfh_auto said:
Agree. I've found dippers and a business card to be the best thing for flake powders. I never found universal to be disagreeable. But I bought it after I burned up my first pound of 700X. So it was a stub your toe or get a paper cut comparison.
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Now there’s a powder worth getting to know. I think if I ran out of Bullseye and Red Dot I could switch to 700X pretty easily and just as happily. Don’t know nor care how it “meters.” It dips and throws easily and doesn’t bind up my trickler. All good :thumbup:
 
Universal meters great in my Lee auto disk for handgun ammo and great in my mec Jr. and 650 16 ga loaders. I do check for density changes in new jugs. I really like how clean it burns, I can shoot 100 clays and barrel is still shiny
 
In my RCBS Uniflow Universal could be a bit of a pain being off by .1 grains plus or minus, sometimes a little more, but Unique? What a PITA sometimes.
Then I decided to buy a new powder measure and looking through RCBS’ site I found the Micro Adjustment Screws that take the place of the Uniflow adjustable measure.
I use the “small” for handgun powders. What a difference. The loads are still off a little on occasion by .05 grain but it’s much better than it was.
It measures my new favorite powder W244 wonderfully.
 
Universal always meters well for me on my Lee Turret press using a Lee Auto Disk. The drops stay within + 0.1 grain for me.

As others have mentioned.
  • cycle the press several times to get the powder to settle
  • be consistent on how you cycle the press, IE make sure you are pulling the handle the same each and every time.
I can tell when I am NOT being consistent with how I cycle the press with the handle on my Lee Turret. If I get into a hurry and my throws are inconsistent, then I will see more variance with the powder drop. And this goes for most powders that I have tried.
 
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