Gun Law Pragmatism

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xd9fan

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Gun Law Pragmatism

By E. J. Dionne Jr.
Friday, April 20, 2007; A31

Why do we have the same futile argument every time there is a mass killing?

Advocates of gun control try to open a discussion about whether more reasonable weapons statutes might reduce the number of violent deaths. Opponents of gun control shout "No!" Guns don't kill people, people kill people, they say, and anyway, if everybody were carrying weapons, someone would have taken out the murderer and all would have been fine.

And we do nothing.

This is a stupid argument, driven by the stupid politics of gun control in the United States.

In other spheres, we act reasonably when faced with new problems. When Richard Reid showed that nasty things could be done with shoes on airplanes, airport security started examining shoes. When liquids were seen as a potential danger, we regulated the quantity of liquids we could take on flights. We barred people from carrying weapons onto airliners long ago.

If we can act pragmatically in the skies, why can't we be equally practical here on the ground?

In its zeal to defend our inviolable right to bear arms, is the National Rifle Association going to argue for concealed carry on airplanes? If not, won't the organization be violating its core principle that all of us should be free to be armed at all times?

No one pretends that smarter gun laws would prevent all violence. But it's a disgrace that we can't try to learn from tragedies such as this week's Virginia Tech massacre and figure out whether better laws might at least modestly reduce the likelihood of such horrific events happening again.

Our country is a laughingstock on the rest of the planet because of our devotion to unlimited gun rights. On Thursday, an Australian newspaper carried this headline: "America, the gun club."

John Howard, the solidly right-wing Australian prime minister closely allied with President Bush, bragged this week that when a mass killing took place in Australia in 1996, "we took action to limit the availability of guns, and we showed a national resolve that the gun culture that is such a negative in the United States would never become a negative in our country." No doubt the NRA will mount a boycott of Foster's beer.

Any reasonable measures are blocked because most Republicans are opportunists on the gun issue and Democrats have become wimps. Republicans have exploited support from the NRA for years, and Democrats, eyeing rural congressional seats, are petrified of doing anything that offends the gun lobby.

The Politico newspaper, using figures from the Center for Responsive Politics, reported that in the 2006 elections, pro-gun groups gave $962,525 in contributions and groups considered "anti-gun" gave $49,090. Republicans received 166 times as much money from pro-gun groups as from anti-gun groups. Democrats received three times as much from pro-gun as anti-gun groups. Who owns Congress?

But it's not just money. It's also how the gun issue has been "distorted and how it has been turned into a hot-button cultural issue," Rep. David Price (D-N.C.) said in an interview Wednesday.

"You're either for or against the issue, and that's kind of code for being 'one of us' or not, of being in tune culturally," he added. "And that's the end of the issue," meaning that it's difficult to deal with gun regulation "in a rational, measured way."

Price said that when he confronts voters in his district who criticize him for being "for gun control," he asks whether they favor background checks for gun buyers, a ban on assault weapons and greater efforts to trace guns used in crimes "to check out gun dealers who supply guns." In large numbers, he says, such voters agree with him and reject the positions taken by the gun lobby.

The key, Price argues, is to propose "specific and well-targeted" measures aimed at keeping guns out of the wrong hands.

Okay, let's be specific. What would the NRA's objection be to a law requiring gun dealers to establish whether a potential buyer is a student and, if so, to inform (or even get permission from) the student's high school or college before any weapons could be sold? What about raising the minimum age for purchasing a gun to 25 or 30? Why not renew the ban on the sale of assault weapons?

Why not create a national bipartisan commission that would propose ways -- including, but not limited to, sane gun laws -- to push back our culture of violence?

One more question: Why are our politicians still cowering before the gun lobby after Virginia Tech?

[email protected]


(go figure this sheep doesnt have a contact email......)
 
If you read some of his other well-reasoned op-ed pieces you would understand why they don't list his e-mail. I do read them on occasion, but then my blood-pressure gets too high. I have written a few LTE's on his columns.

I guess Soros's tens of millions don't count as contributions and I could probably spend all day countering his opinion with logic and fact, but why waste my time.
 
In other spheres, we act reasonably when faced with new problems. When Richard Reid showed that nasty things could be done with shoes on airplanes, airport security started examining shoes. When liquids were seen as a potential danger, we regulated the quantity of liquids we could take on flights. We barred people from carrying weapons onto airliners long ago.

If we can act pragmatically in the skies, why can't we be equally practical here on the ground?

Because the rules of the skies don't stop criminals, either. :banghead:

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/03/08/cbsnews_investigates/main2551129.shtml
 
Smart Gun Laws

Okay, let's be specific. What would the NRA's objection be to a law requiring gun dealers to establish whether a potential buyer is a student and, if so, to inform (or even get permission from) the student's high school or college before any weapons could be sold?

So obtaining an education means you've got to amplify your vulnerability to predation. This is the level of thinking that counts as smart in the US nowadays?

No wonder half the country wants to give Iraq to al-Qaeda...
 
Politics is called "the art of the possible" because that's what the real world is all about. In order to get most of what you want, you have to give up some of what you want. Again, right, wrong or indifferent, that's the way it was, is and will be. Live with it--as we always have. There ain't no perfect world.

Our opponents in this gunrights squabble believe as strongly that they're correct as we do. It doesn't matter if we have the facts and their views are based on emotion. They believe.

You don't change people's views by insulting them. That's why I get fed up with bashing of any group. You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar--which has been known for thousands of years. Some folks are just plain slow learners.

You don't change their views overnight. It takes time and effort and patience and holding onto your temper. Self-control.

As near as I can tell after forty years, now, in this squabble, the numbers are slowly shifting toward our side.

Art
 
Politics is called "the art of the possible" because that's what the real world is all about. In order to get most of what you want, you have to give up some of what you want.

And what is it, exactly, Art, that the anti's are giving up? What is it exactly that they are compromising? As far as I see it, they seem to be saying "we'll let you keep some of your guns; after all, we should just take them all away."

And it really makes me stare in amazement when I read about all of the "reasonable" gun control measures or all of the "sane" gun laws or more "common sense" gun legislation, as if the twenty some odd thousand current laws are unreasonable, insane, and insensible. Weren't ALL of these laws passed by our government, the same government this author seeks to have impose more laws upon us all? It's very clever to state something illogical and emotional as fact, then argue from that premise.

And, regarding Australia -- who cares? I apologize to our Aussie friends for this comment, but it's a country of around 18 million as opposed to the US's 300 million. No one seems to think that matters? Also, I'm sure we could point to the amazingly racist policies that their government has in dealing with the Aboriginies, for example, behaving as if they are such an enlightened progressive government that they sneer at us condescendingly.

Or how about the fact that the United States has enshrined the freedoms of humanity moreso than any other culture or government that has ever existed on the planet and Australia has not. Or how about the fact that the United States, for better or for worse, has shown by example how a free people can live and prosper. How about because of our Constitution, we as a common people have seen what oppression in every form can do, and have sought to change it. First, we changed it here because of the simple fact that we COULD change it here.

Sorry for my rant.
 
The Politico newspaper, using figures from the Center for Responsive Politics, reported that in the 2006 elections, pro-gun groups gave $962,525 in contributions and groups considered "anti-gun" gave $49,090. Republicans received 166 times as much money from pro-gun groups as from anti-gun groups. Democrats received three times as much from pro-gun as anti-gun groups. Who owns Congress?

Hah, because a majority of Americans believe in firearms ownership and contributions reflect that. Its mostly a vocal minority that continues to chirp their tales about how things are constantly getting more violent and the world is somehow a more dangerous place to live in than any other period in history.
 
What about raising the minimum age for purchasing a gun to 25 or 30? Why not renew the ban on the sale of assault weapons?

1) Militia=all able bodied male between 18 and 45 years of age!

2) Long guns are used less often than sharp edged weapons in crime.
 
Umm, since when does pragmatism mean putting your fingers in your ears and humming, then going with the first knee-jerk reaction which comes to mind regardless of it will work? Last I checked, pragmatism is defined by balancing all views (even ones from the other side..), and finding a practical solution.

Of his examples, banning liquid on planes was far from practical, as the threat of someone manufacturing TATP on a plane was virtually non-existent. And what exactly would banning "assault weapons" accomplish? The shooter did not use an "assault weapon.":scrutiny:
 
Our opponents in this gunrights squabble believe as strongly that they're correct as we do. It doesn't matter if we have the facts and their views are based on emotion. They believe.

Not to sidetrack but IMHO the gunownership issue is alot like abortion......Both sides will not move on the issue.
Just wish "common sense" republican voters/Congresspeople would understand this.
 
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