dumb question - do soldiers go deaf?

Yes! Hearing loss is by far the most common basis for disability claims & payments.

Uncle Sam has provided protection to it's troops since at least the 80s, but unfortunately some are just too macho to wear it. Not me. I'm a wimp where my ears are concerned.

I spent four years in the Cold War Infantry, saw combat as a contractor, been flying piston and turbine twin aircraft part time for five years, and have been playing in loud rock bands since I was a kid. Even though I have always tried to take care of my hearing, over the years I have lost quite a bit - especially in the left - despite all the precautions. Even with protection, long-term exposure does a j-o-b on your ears. I can barely hear a cell phone in my left ear.

Thank you guys for your service, btw!

He told me they were working the gun so fast in battle they didn't have time to cover their ears.

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And the gunner, of course, can't cover his ears. He has to have one hand free to pull the lanyard.

We were issued "combat" earplugs, but it's up to each soldier to remember to put em in.

I often thought about what I'd do if I was deployed and ultimately decided that I'd always keep my right plug in and the left one out(but close) if on a mission.

Personally, if I were in charge, I'd adopt electronic ear protection, to magnify ordinary sounds and protect from dangerous levels.

Personally, if I were in charge, I'd adopt electronic ear protection, to magnify ordinary sounds and protect from dangerous levels.

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My first response was just another piece of useless equipment. But upon reflection, we should be able to improve the present electronic noise suppressors to the point that power usage would not be a major issue, and reduce the problems in extreme heat to both the equipment and the operator.

Yea, ultimately if done right it should be a good idea, and enhance our troops capability, and protect their hearing at the same time.

I joined the Corps in 1966. I remember that on the range some guys used the filters from our cigarettes (most folks smoked in those days) and some guys on the rifle range would literally stick spent brass in their ears.

I was a genius and did neither. My favorite and most used quote these days is "What did you say?"

Go figure.

Fred

I was in the Army 1953-55. Went thru infantry and artillery basic. Then was an aircraft mechanic. Hearing protection did not exist. Came home. Became a chain saw dealer/mechanic for several years. In the early years, mufflers were for sissies. My right ear is deader than canned tuna. I have bought and worn out 3 hearing aids. One day at the VA I asked about a hearing aid. She said "sure", tested my hearing and I pick up my new aid next week. They will give you the aid, maintain and repair it and furnish the batteries for free. If you are a vet this is worth checking into.

Welp, this is as good a post as any to start a post on THR. Lurkin' for a long while.

Aircraft are way loud. WAY loud, I was a UH60 Black Hawk crewchief and while it was loud it wasn't nothing like jet aircraft about the loudest thing I ever heard in my life was an F16 doing a static runup at something like full power, on the ground. A mechanic was making some adjustments, and undoubtedly wearing earplugs underneath his headphone type protectors. When I joined, they specifically said that hearing loss was excluded right off the top, I don't think they are paying out new claims for disability, I dunno. Lots of earplugs though, if ya want 'em. Hearing tested yearly. One year my hearing improved, and they asked what my occupation was. They got sorta pissy when I said crewchief.

Not military here, but I'm a birder as well as a shooter, and I can tell you that if you ever want to get into the former hobby, you'd better make sure you do everything you can to protect your hearing while enjoying the latter hobby. I'm young, but many birders I've met start at or near retirement age, so while you're young, consider that you might want to hear those high-frequency sounds MUCH later in life and protect your ears. I double up when I'm at the range (plugs AND muffs) and I don't leave with ringing ears (the classic sign of damage which has occurred). As far as I'm concerned, you can't have too much ear protection.

Yes! Hearing loss is by far the most common basis for disability claims & payments.

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Keep in mind, the OP seemed to referring to the "clinical" definition of deafness. Hence, even substantial hearing loss often does not fall within this category. Yes, repeated exposure to gunfire/ordinance fire can (and often will) obliterate aural effectiveness at various frequencies. But, again, I have yet to encounter an individual who has been rendered "clinically deaf" due to such exposure.

Either way...protect what senses you have. After all, when they are gone you just might not be able to get them back [to an effective degree.]

My old man was a cannon cocker in WWII. He couldn't hear anything above conversation level frequency. Never heard him complain once.

My grandfather is very deaf from firing rifles and machine guns in training. Some people are more resistant to it than others but there are millions of people who have lost some or all of their hearing in the military.

I spent most of 20 years on tanks. The impulse from firing tank main guns and the .50 Cal overwhelms earplugs and muffs, especially on TT V when the tanks are lined up fender to fender. You can feel the shock wave from the tanks on either side coming down through the hatches. If you're outside, you can feel it in your chest. Your ears don't have a chance. Part of my time was as a CSC XO where I got to be the OIC on 4.2 inch mortar firing points. Max charges give a nice muzzle flash as big as the M106A1 track right on top of the carrier, also overwhelming ear protection.

Tinnitus? Yep. Hearing loss? Don't know; can't tell over the ringing. <Snicker.> My wife says I do.

ECS

Played in garage bands in the 80s as loud as possible.

Been to hundreds of concerts, including AC/DC in 1982 (I remember because it was the loudest)

Had a flashbang go off right next to my head in training

Fired Dragon missile in USMC (wore earplugs, but they didn't help all that much)

Fired a couple of AT-4s (Again, had earplugs, but these things are basically right up against your grape)

Various explosives and rifle fire.





I can't hear very well at all. Some people have voices in a certain range and I just can't understand a word they say. I really have to lip read to help understand what people say to me.

Part of my time was as a CSC XO where I got to be the OIC on 4.2 inch mortar firing points. Max charges give a nice muzzle flash as big as the M106A1 track right on top of the carrier, also overwhelming ear protection.

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God help you.

I believe 4.2 "Howtars" were the noisiest of all our artillery going out. The end of 68, beginning of 69 1/3 & 3/3 3rd Marines we joined the 5th Marines in An Hoa. Got to party in a TAOR called the Arizona Territory. It was a hot party. Little did I know that this Florida boy would wind up in Arizona.

Anyway when we were in the rear at An Hoa those damned 4.2's would be firing mission after mission. Great fun, "Huh, what did you say?"

Go figure.

Fred

Keep in mind, the OP seemed to referring to the "clinical" definition of deafness.

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The OP, Raindog, used the term "long-term hearing loss", not "clinical deafness." There is, indeed a lot of long-term hearing loss among thos with military service.

When I started pistol shooting circa 1959, my ears would ring for 3 days after a match. Luckily those Clark ear protectors came along shortly afterwards and I got one of the first pair. Still have them, with replacement seals! Spent 4 yrs on the flight line pulling security in the Air Force but at least covered my ears against the noise as much as I could. Then became an LEO and firearms instructor. Thank God for ear protection--my hearing was and remains pretty good. I think I was lucky.

Almost all of my shooting is out in the open with the wind blowing and of course, ear protection. Between that and the fact that I don't shoot a lot of rounds in a session, I think that helps minimize the damage.

I always cringe at the guys in the artillery firing off the 105 howitzers without any ear protection.

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Dad is darn near deaf as a post from serving in Field Artillery for over 30years, at first with 8" self propelled howitzers then 155's

I am a Sign Language DEAF artilleryman.....Does that answer your question?

Suppressors were tested in Viet Nam. They aren't much help protecting hearing, because it's the super-sonic crack! of the shot that is most damaging to hearing, and suppressors can't suppress that.

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Ah, no. Won't even try to argue the point. No.

Korea now issues a suppressor 1 per soldier - they buy US made. Since they do engineer a lot of the stuff in your house - appliances, phones, cars, etc., it's not likely they are doing it just because they are our buddies. They do it because they work. As anyone who can buy one in Europe knows - where they are sold in hardware stores and REQUIRED for use on ranges.

It's the NFA and the stupid inclusion of suppressors by ignorant politicians that contribute to our soldiers problems now.

I started shooting without hearing protection, but quickly got on the bandwagon. Nonetheless, there are motorcycles with no mufflers - and a complete lack of enforcement. Bottle rockets, shot my share at opponents on the 4th of July along with other fireworks.

In fact, the last training I had in the military on pyrotechnics was with Less Than Lethal rounds, grenades, and etc. - and I was not informed I should bring ear plugs because no one told me squat about what I was about to attend - and the uniform policy was no earplugs at that time. After 6 hours you will have ringing ears.

Since then I have worked in a CNC shop with three large Amada rotary press machines pounding away for a ten hour shift - ear plugs required - but the impact can even be felt in your feet. They get loud punching 1/4" hot rolled plate. Now I have to ask repeatedly for customers to speak up, anyone talking behind me I can't hear them on the phone, fans running cause too much dissonance, and I get the "look" if the TV is up too loud. Which is pretty easy with the surround sound stereo.

Documented mid range hearing loss, all in the heath record jacket. Just inconvenient, not enough to get any compensation. The CNC shop had annual checks and it wasn't getting worse - or better. There is NO "compensation" for hearing noise, the body does not get over it or protect itself other that to impress on the listener that loud sounds are hurtful.

Being all macho about it is stupid. Get good plugs and muffs, write your Congressman to approve the military use of suppressors and rescind the NFA provision. It would save so much future disability it would make money for the government to give them away free to one and all.

[billywitchdoctor.com]: "ARISE, necrothread. Arise!"

Fun fact; the NFA silencer ban was passed to prevent poaching...during the Great Depression. That's right, ensuring people starved to death rather than pillage the Baron's cattle* or landed-gentry's game. All the while, federal agents were slaughtering cattle by the thousands without compensation in the name of 'stabilizing the market' and leaving the meat to rot. Burning fields, too. Very desperate times.

I also have a question; is ear protection yet a requirement for military duty/service? I understand it features in training, but does sound amplifying/limiting ear-protection make its way into the field? Seems like it would be useful in both 1) reducing VA costs for expensive-ass hearing aids enormously, and 2) potentially providing greater awareness and communication in the field or during engagements. I mean, protective eyewear/sunglasses are pretty much ubiquitous...

TCB

*poor farmers undoubtedly suffered poaching, too, but there is precious little evidence the NFA, or federal policy in general, gave even a particle of a damn about their plight. It was all about protecting massed resources of the wealthy from looting.

I wrenched on F-14D's for a while. Double hearing protection (foamies and muffs) were required any time a jet was spun up. Due to volume and pitch, it still causes hearing loss, although not nearly as bad as it would be without the ear pro.

My wife always thought I was just not paying attention when I'd say "Huh?" once in a while. Then I took her to an airshow that had an F-14D flying. Whole different animal than any other jet I've been around.

I thought my hearing loss was from wepons fire also. But when I was being fitted for hearing aids, the Dr. said most of my hearing loss was from being around the flight line! Even though I used better hearing protection than was military issue! We shared our runway with a Boeing Plant & also had a N.G. fighter squadron station there! I wore ear plugs just so I could sleep during the daytime! I was declared 100% disabled in 1988 by S.S.OFFICE! But the V.A. says hearing loss & Chemical exposure to rocket fuel don't qualify! Still fighting the V.A. after 36 years! The government has no idea how deep that problem is! Shooting the M-60 was sooo much fun! As a M-60 gunner, we had to shoot 2 times a year to qualify. Same with the M203 G.L. & S&W M15 .38spl. and 4 times a year with the M-16. Hearing aids? Ya gotta hear!