dumb question - do soldiers go deaf?
- Thread starter raindog
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I just smile and nod a lot...
been working good so far.
It's good to double up with plugs and muffs, but the muffs don't work well with eyeglasses. They don't seal. Contacts would help, but what about the company required safety glasses.
No real good solutions sometimes. Best thing is to protect it from the get go.
been working good so far.
It's good to double up with plugs and muffs, but the muffs don't work well with eyeglasses. They don't seal. Contacts would help, but what about the company required safety glasses.
No real good solutions sometimes. Best thing is to protect it from the get go.
mljdeckard
Member
Like the SFC says, they give you earplugs that allow normal level of sound and cut off high intensity sound.
I've also been told that the VA is ending hearing loss disability. You are issued hearing protection, if you don't use it it's your fault.
I grew up with an old marine who was over 90% disabled. Exposure to Agent Orange, radiation, shrapnel from three wars, disabled achilles tendon in one foot. He literally set off airport metal detectors. He had about 50% hearing loss, he said a lot of it was from operating radios, but the thing that did the most damage was a LOT of M-2 firing.
I've also been told that the VA is ending hearing loss disability. You are issued hearing protection, if you don't use it it's your fault.
I grew up with an old marine who was over 90% disabled. Exposure to Agent Orange, radiation, shrapnel from three wars, disabled achilles tendon in one foot. He literally set off airport metal detectors. He had about 50% hearing loss, he said a lot of it was from operating radios, but the thing that did the most damage was a LOT of M-2 firing.
rocky branch
Member
Hearing loss is cumulative as well as incidental.
Our noise environment gets worse all the time.
It is hard to get money from the VA for hearing loss, but I get hearing aids.
In actual combat hearing protection is a hindrance-you got to know what is happening.
Flight lines and artillery are significant sources of damage.
I got tinnitis, which is a pretty much constant high piyched sound.
Gets louder in the absence of other noise.
VA gives 10% for that.
It is not testable, they go by evidence.
I like loud music, as well.
Our noise environment gets worse all the time.
It is hard to get money from the VA for hearing loss, but I get hearing aids.
In actual combat hearing protection is a hindrance-you got to know what is happening.
Flight lines and artillery are significant sources of damage.
I got tinnitis, which is a pretty much constant high piyched sound.
Gets louder in the absence of other noise.
VA gives 10% for that.
It is not testable, they go by evidence.
I like loud music, as well.
Broken11b
Member
theyre not kidding, getting money for hearing loss outta the va is like pulling teeth. It seems like they want me to admit that the hearing loss is from a concert i went to, instead of the mortars, rockets, burried 105 rounds, claymores, 240's and m4 rounds. And it seems like you answered your question in your first post.
not all vets are deaf. but war is loud enough to make alot of us deaf
i know guys who have hearing damage from training exercises and range trips, while wearing ear-pro
not all vets are deaf. but war is loud enough to make alot of us deaf
i know guys who have hearing damage from training exercises and range trips, while wearing ear-pro
leadcounsel
member
I've deployed to Iraq twice, with two different units. It always amazed me that many Soldiers take so little care of their ears. I wore electronic ear protection anytime out on patrol, on a convoy, in a helicopter or plane, etc. Many Soldiers don't, feeling that electronic earprotection is too costly and the foam type limit hearing too much.
I value my hearing so wore mine.
Yes, if you didn't wear any I know that the level of noise (steady noise from helicopters and planes and tanks) and shocking noise from gunfire, explosins, etc) would ruin your hearing over time.
I value my hearing so wore mine.
Yes, if you didn't wear any I know that the level of noise (steady noise from helicopters and planes and tanks) and shocking noise from gunfire, explosins, etc) would ruin your hearing over time.
mljdeckard
Member
Broken11b, like the name.
Leadcounsel, do you have some that fit around our helmets? I would buy some.
Leadcounsel, do you have some that fit around our helmets? I would buy some.
chuckusaret
member
That is a lot of BS. The VA fights all disability claims to the max. I had a coronary arrest while on active duty and have had 6 heart attacks since, bypass surgery and just had three stints put in. I have been fighting the Army and the VA since August 20th 1973. My case was turned down in 1977, 1978, 1995 and again in August 2009 as not being service connected. My attorney requested copies of my military and VA medical records in October 2008 to take this thru the courts and was told there is a back log and to expect copies of the records to be made available between Sept 2009 and April 2010. We are still waiting. There are tens of thousands of people in the same situation as me. There is an estimated backlog of VA claims that exceed 250,000. You must understand that this is claims that have been received but have not been reviewed.
mljdeckard
Member
^^Sounds familiar. REMEMBER this guys, if you're young and in uniform. If your boss asks you to do something stupid. It's not HIS butt he's hanging out. It's YOURS. I try VERY hard to be the worried hen leader who nags everyone do death to wear their earplugs, use stepladders, make sure the oxy-acetelene tanks are chained, and the wheels are chocked. I hope they take away memories and talk about me in the future as the crazy safety guy.
Broken11b
Member
talk of earplugs or electronic muffs ( by the way, those are neat) on patrol is one thing. but when the 107 rocket decides to land when your in the porta-john, well, youre gonna lose hearing one way or the other.
No it doesn't. You have been grossly misinformed.
Consider that it would be nigh on to impossible to get a more adrenaline filled experience than a firefight/gun fight, but you've already seen the posts from the veterans hear saying that nothing other than hearing protection saved any part of their hearing.
The human ear does have some built-in physiology to prevent damage to the middle ear, but it's only after an inital loud noise. After a high db event, the muscles that control the auditory ossicles will remain tensed for a short period of time to reduce the effects of subsequent high db events and their effects on the tympanic membrane. That's why after an unprotected firearm report, or hammer on metal, etc you have decreased hearing ability for a few moments after the noise. Of course if the event is significant to rupture the membrane, it will be a lot longer than a few moments.
I'm not an ear doctor, but I am a doctor and that's what I recall during my training. There may be new knowledge about how it works since I learned about it 8-10 years ago.
But there is no self protection due to increased adrenaline. If anything, the senses will become more acute due to the flight-or-flight response of the central nervous system.
I'm not an ear doctor, but I am a doctor and that's what I recall during my training. There may be new knowledge about how it works since I learned about it 8-10 years ago.
But there is no self protection due to increased adrenaline. If anything, the senses will become more acute due to the flight-or-flight response of the central nervous system.
android
Member
We were tested and fitted with the soft rubber or silicon plugs by medical. We also had foam plugs available in all the shops. I always double up on the flight deck. ear plugs plus the ear muffs built into the cranial. I was pretty consistent about ear, eye and respiration gear. Some people weren't and ended up deaf from noise and stupid from breathing too many organic vapors.
At one time ear plugs in the military was unknown. In my Basic training there were no ear plugs. Even later on the flight line working on the old radial engines ( Remember the H-34 ) no head sets or plugs. Many a time I was under the clam shell doors with that damn 1800 Wasp Engine blasting full bore while I adjusted the Carb settings. Dawn of the UH-1's, no headset while working on the fuel control ( I was one of 4 enlisted in Germany trained to " twik" the turbine engine}. In Vietnam, no plugs or muffs. Later in my career Head sets became mandatory on the flight line and ear plugs on the firing line. Little late for me, I'm now rated 100%. Yes, the military does suffer hearing loss.:banghead:
True story -
I used to know a guy in NY who was an artilleryman in 'Nam. He always talked loud as hell, and couldn't hear worth a damn. And he hated going to doctors.
He finally had to go to the VA clinic for alcohol treatment, and during his physical the doc looked in his ears. The doc then took some tweezers, and pulled out big wads of cotton that Eddie had stuffed in his ears back in 'Nam, and forgot all about! After that, and a good cleaning/flushing, he could hear about 100% better. He sure felt like a dumbass, having that stuff in his ears for all those years, with no clue.
I used to know a guy in NY who was an artilleryman in 'Nam. He always talked loud as hell, and couldn't hear worth a damn. And he hated going to doctors.
He finally had to go to the VA clinic for alcohol treatment, and during his physical the doc looked in his ears. The doc then took some tweezers, and pulled out big wads of cotton that Eddie had stuffed in his ears back in 'Nam, and forgot all about! After that, and a good cleaning/flushing, he could hear about 100% better. He sure felt like a dumbass, having that stuff in his ears for all those years, with no clue.
I've always wondered the same thing. So I won't say it's a dumb question - heck, I didn't even want to ask for that reason, but someone else did for me.
Oh and as for this...
And one other question:
If cleaning out earwax buildup can cause people to hear better, would it make a difference as to damaging hearing loss? Say, for example, you had a bunch of earwax built up, and were firing a gun with no hearing protection. Would it make any difference as to the damage that's being done, be it lessening or increasing it?
Oh and as for this...
I always stock up on those little individually-wrapped foam ear plugs for 25 cents each or whatever they are and carry a bunch to the range with me. Then if I see someone covering their ears, I just walk up and hand them a set.
And one other question:
If cleaning out earwax buildup can cause people to hear better, would it make a difference as to damaging hearing loss? Say, for example, you had a bunch of earwax built up, and were firing a gun with no hearing protection. Would it make any difference as to the damage that's being done, be it lessening or increasing it?
C-grunt
Member
Thats funny, almost the same exact thing happened to me. Luckily I just left the porta-john as the rocket shrapnel kinda turned it into swiss cheese. That was my favorite porta-john too!!
Tim the student
Member
I'm pretty sure that Peltor makes some that will fit without the electronics package in it, but I'm not positive.
mljdeckard
Member
Ron James-
That was then, not now. Cases like you are the reason that the new policy is; "Give them earplugs, and blame the soldier if he doesn't use them." You have to PROVE that the event that cause your hearing loss wasn't preventable.
That was then, not now. Cases like you are the reason that the new policy is; "Give them earplugs, and blame the soldier if he doesn't use them." You have to PROVE that the event that cause your hearing loss wasn't preventable.
Sleeping next to an 81mm popping illumination rounds all night long can do a number on your hearing from the close concussion. Wearing earphones and having an troglodite walk up and max the gain on your receiver can do it too. Basically any concussive or continuous high decible level, expecially the lowest and highest frequencies will deteriorate your hearing over a short of long period, depending on the how loud it is and for how long. Most never realize how much damage shooting or driving for years with windows open etc., has done to their hearing until it is too late.
ktd
Member
hso, I also said that this seems to be good for only a shot or two, and I also said that it seems to apply while hunting, I never said this would protect you in military situations, which in my experience usually last longer than a couple of rounds. I also mentioned from my experience how even that won't protect you from unusually loud firearms, and that even hearing protection won't necessarily provide complete protection either.
I am pretty certain, as Dentite also mentioned, that the ear has some limited built in protection, and I am pretty sure I read about that in an American Rifleman article a long time ago (although I might have the actual description of how it works wrong), but I never meant to imply that this would save your hearing in any way during military service. And it certainly won't help you for the high duration noise that one is often exposed to in daily service.
I am pretty certain, as Dentite also mentioned, that the ear has some limited built in protection, and I am pretty sure I read about that in an American Rifleman article a long time ago (although I might have the actual description of how it works wrong), but I never meant to imply that this would save your hearing in any way during military service. And it certainly won't help you for the high duration noise that one is often exposed to in daily service.
StuntHeavy
Member
Thats one of my favorite, simple pleasures in life.
With all the technology of electronic hearing protection, I'm surprised that the military doesn't issue them. My cheap 45$ set can be turned up high enough that I can hear things more clearly than without them..and still provide protection. Seems like this would be an advantage.
Reading these posts, I noticed a lot of guys mention their hearing in the left ear is worse than that in the right ear. My audiologist was fitting me with hearing aids a few years ago (no combat, but a lot of time spent with things that go "boom"), and she mentioned that it was common for people that shoot a lot to have worse hearing on the left side - apparently it has to do with how sound waves travel and reflect off of nearby surfaces. Having a gun stock close to your right ear could actually provide a tiny bit of protection.
If your local military installation has an audiology clinic, ask them about a program that provides hearing aids at cost (REAL cost, not MSRP) to veterans - I forget the name of the program, and it only gets funded every few years, but it can save you some $$ if you're interested in hearing aids. Of course, I still don't wear them like I should....
If your local military installation has an audiology clinic, ask them about a program that provides hearing aids at cost (REAL cost, not MSRP) to veterans - I forget the name of the program, and it only gets funded every few years, but it can save you some $$ if you're interested in hearing aids. Of course, I still don't wear them like I should....
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