project 18 to buy handguns

Well, you already can buy handguns at 18. You just have to purchase them from an individual, in a face-to-face sale.

That aside, what do hope to accomplish by lowering the age required to purchase from 21 to 18? What is your end game, so to speak?

We'll be more able to help once you give us a little more info regarding the direction you're interested in going with this.

The best way to hone an opinion is to argue it. This being said, I'll throw you some of the curves you should expect.

The legal age is in place because people aren't mature enough to own a handgun at 18.

Yes you can buy it from an individual so why do we need to make it easier than it is?

Guns kill people. Why would you want to put a gun in the hands of a teenager?

18 is the age that kids are considering college. If you're going to college where guns aren't allowed then why would you need a gun in the first place?

Just some arguments I've run in to.

Arguments for could be: at 18 you can legally vote, and through your vote determine the direction the country goes. At 18 you can have the privilage of sacraficing your life for your country in military action. At 18 (in most states) you can sign a contract and are legally bound by it. At 18 you automatically go to adult court for any breaking of the law.

The mother hens in congress think anyone yourger then themselves just don't have enough life experience and need to be controlled an guided by those with more experience...notwithstanding that most of those same mother hens have never been shot at in combat.

One thing I've wondered: Why restrict buying from a dealer if you can go ahead and buy face to face?

Lets thing cars: Okay, you can walk up to someone, buy it from them face to face as soon as you have your license, drive it away, the same way you could walk into a dealer and buy a car from them. Would it make sense to have a restriction on you having to be 21 to buy a car from a dealer?

*assuming you have your legal paperwork good to go for the car

Yep, can already buy handguns at 18 through FTF and can even get a few carry permits (some Non-Resident) at 18 as well.

While I don't really want to pay the inflated prices at my local gun stores, I would like to be able to transfer pistols and not have every person who sees me with a pistol scream at me that I'm going to jail for illegal possession... I've even had SEVERAL FFLs tell me that I was breaking the law just owning it, and one even seized my pistol! I had to threaten to call the police to get it back! Even the ones that didn't go that far, our conversations got heated enough that I no longer use their services.

Ever try selling pistols while you're under 21? Legal - yes, but very difficult. It seems that whenever I mentioned my age, I had to also cite the legal code that said it wasn't illegal for me to own the pistol! (It actually prompted me to put it in my sig so I could just say "look at the bottom of the page, thanks")

Anyway, besides my rant about what I've had to go through with the legalities of hand guns...

Frame the debate to your points. Don't try and justify why it should be legal for adults to own handguns, they already can. Debate the fact that I can buy a handgun from quite literally anybody residing in my state EXCEPT someone who does it for a living.

Try and get them to react to your arguments and to frame the debate in your favor. Don't answer questions about "why should someone so young be able to own..." just answer flatly that we can. Then ask them why they don't know the actual laws pertaining to the subject at hand. This isn't a debate about owning a handgun, its a debate about who can buy one from a store.

Another point you might want to address is that I have been is gun shops before that wouldn't let me look at their pistols, even though I was (legally) carrying at the time. It always struck me as odd that I was trustworthy enough to carry a loaded, concealed firearm but was not trustworthy enough to look at an unloaded firearm behind the counter of a gun store.

And while I'm at it, I'll try and add some fire to the college possession area of this discussion. In my state (Alabama) it is not illegal to possess firearms on any college campus. It may be (and probably is) against school policy, but there's nothing illegal about it. The only thing would possibly be trespassing.

Here's a lawsuit going on. I don't know what stage it is in at the moment:

http://www.examiner.com/gun-rights-...-handgun-ownership-for-18-19-and-20-year-olds

You can drive a car at age 15 in most states, lower in some.
I don't know a lot of people that have the skills to shoot a football team but any idiot could hit them in a car. Saying teenagers are not mature enough to own a handgun is ridiculous if they are able to buy a truck.
The government will put a machine gun in the hands of a 17yr old but wont let him buy a single shot rifle.

You can drive a car at age 15 in most states, lower in some.

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Not on public roads, you can't.

I don't know a lot of people that have the skills to shoot a football team but any idiot could hit them in a car.

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Unless that football team is on a kid's private land when he happens to be out joyriding, this is a non-issue.

Saying teenagers are not mature enough to own a handgun is ridiculous if they are able to buy a truck.

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In most places an under-18 year old CAN'T buy a truck on their own. Minors are generally disallowed from entering into binding contracts, which would include buying trucks, houses, etc.

You might want to re-think your examples.

Not on public roads, you can't.

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Actually 15yr olds can and do... They start driving education and receive learners permits at 15. They do have to be 16 here (TX) to receive a license though...

It always struck me as strange that an18-year-old can buy a handgun from someone who is not even allowed to do an NICS background check but can't legally buy one from someone who must do one. One would think that even the most avid gun-control advocates would find that peculiar. It sometimes seems that the gun-control people just like to enact more-or-less random requirements to annoy gun people and trip them up as often as possible.

I don't understand this mysterious 'gap in maturity' between the ages of 18 and 21... I'm 21 now but when I was 18 I qualified to carry both of the handguns the Coast Guard had in service. I think if at age 18 you're considered responsible enough to join the military and carry a handgun in defense of your country, you should be allowed to have one at home without buying it secondhand.

Sounds good to me; but, I doubt it will ever happen.

http://www.ehow.com/how_2095578_hardship-drivers-license.html

When I was in junior high in WY one of my friends (13yrs old) had a single, bed ridden, mother and they lived where the school buses couldn't get so he was issued a hardship permit and drove 45 miles to school every morning.

And where cant you buy a used car as a minor?

Counter argument:

You're old enough to get drafted and go die in war, why can't you drink and own a handgun? What is so different about cigarettes and rifles from alcohol and rifles?

The main point I would bring up is that it makes no sense that it is legal for an 18 year old to buy a gun from an individual, but not a gun store because there is a chance the gun could be reported stolen or it could have been used in some crime.

Another issue I would bring up is that it is legal for an 18 year old to own a handgun, but not purchase ammunition for it. This does not make sense to me at all.

Both those laws really need to be changed, I'm 20, and I was put in a position once where I almost bought a gun from somebody but I found out there was a good chance it was stolen, so I did't buy it. I have also paid unreasonably high prices for handguns because I couldn't buy one from a store.

And needing someone else to buy ammunition for me is a pain. (though 90% of the time I don't get carded, except at Walmart) It especially bothers me because I could even legally buy a 9mm/.40/.45 carbine from a store but not buy the ammunition for it.

Good luck with your project and I'm glad you chose that topic!

can't buy a used car.

In the U.S. unless you are emancipated...you cannot enter into any kind of binding contract. You would have to have a parent or adult co-signer.

Personally, I am all about Firearm Freedom , but I don't think it's a bad idea to have the age be 21 for people to own and carry handguns. I think there is some maturity issues. The argument that is made that you can join the army...yes that's true and the army trains you and trains you and trains you and trains you... you don't just line up and get your weapon and they say..."go to it". They provide thorough training for such things. Safety courses, procedural matters, the whole nine yards. So, it probably goes against what most think here but no, the thought of an 18 year old with a handgun does not give me pleasant thoughts or feelings.

1000y if you say you are all about firearm freedom, but don't think that 18 yr olds should be allowed to own handguns, you are by definition a hypocrite.

Criminals that use guns for crime don't care about gun laws, and they wouldn't want a gun in their name. The current laws make it so there is no way to get a gun in your name if your between 18-21 and you have to buy from a third party, which is risky because of reasons I listed in my last post.

I don't buy into the military training you being a good reason you can go to war. Many people learned how to handle and care for a firearm long before they turn 18.

Also, isn't an 18 year old able to purchase a long gun? Why should there be a differentiation between the two if that is correct.

smoov biscuit

NO, I am not a hypocrite. I believe in gun rights but I also don't believe in not arming toddlers either, that does NOT make me a hypocrites.

Where I live I have not met ANY 18 year olds that I would feel comfortable about arming. I think the three years would be a good idea. Almost all 18 year olds don't know the end of a gun barrel to a hold in the ground to their own rear ends. So, all I am saying is that it most certainly doesn't bother me that the gun laws that are on the books apply to those who are not yet 21.

It's a simple difference of opinion and most certainly does not make me a hypocrite. A hypocrite is a person who says one thing and does another. I say I'm about gun rights. I am. But just as I dont' believe in arming 5 year olds with submachine guns to play at recess, I also don't believe that 21 is "too late" as an age to start having the right to carry handguns.

1000YDSOUT said:

In the U.S. unless you are emancipated...you cannot enter into any kind of binding contract. You would have to have a parent or adult co-signer.

Personally, I am all about Firearm Freedom , but I don't think it's a bad idea to have the age be 21 for people to own and carry handguns. I think there is some maturity issues. The argument that is made that you can join the army...yes that's true and the army trains you and trains you and trains you and trains you... you don't just line up and get your weapon and they say..."go to it". They provide thorough training for such things. Safety courses, procedural matters, the whole nine yards. So, it probably goes against what most think here but no, the thought of an 18 year old with a handgun does not give me pleasant thoughts or feelings.

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You are in no way shape or form in favor of firearm freedoms if you believe that adults should be denied the RKBA. Yes people 18-21 are adults, who in many cases already live entirely independently, but because it "doesn't make you feel good", they should be forbidden the right to self defense? Maybe the Brady campaign has a forum where you can discuss with them how much you all "love firearms freedoms".

and to answer the question, why should long guns be different... well, long guns you can't conceal and generally people dont' pick up a long gun in a fit of pubescent anger. however a handgun they can conceal and wield with much more emotional content. Just my perspective.

You people are pathetic. I come onto this board and say I'm a supporter of gun rights which I am. I don't want what I consider children carrying handguns and you blow a gasket and tell me to go to the gun control advocates board. You're a bunch of JERKS. You can't handle a difference of opinion. OBVIOUSLY you're a bunch of 18 year old KIDS...like I said and demonstrating my point beautifully. I have 31 years of experience with firearms starting at learning how to shoot under my father's guidance at age 10. I have been an NRA member since age 18 and a gun rights advocate. Yes 18 is legal as an adult but I see no problem waiting til 21, just as I see no problem in keeping 18 year olds from drinking until age 21. Age restrictions are there for a reason and I believe in the reasons. Acknowledging those reasons in NO WAY compromises my belief in gun rights and the 2nd amendment.

You people turn a simple matter of difference of opinion in what level a person is mature enough to own a handgun into something personal. Get over yourselves and start welcoming people instead of rejecting them because they view 18 year olds (especially these days) more as kids than adults.

It's PERFECTLY CLEAR to any THINKING INDIVIDUAL that my argument is about when a person is truly an adult and has nothing to do with gun rights.