Which will break first: Glock 17, Sig Sauer 226 or HK USP?

Ranger30-06 said:

I'm sorry, but run the two guns over with a tank

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I seriously doubt any pistol would function properly after that kind of abuse. Not very realistic either.

I've owned all three and the Sig was the most sensitive to the lack of lube, or too much grease. I've had short stroking in two different 9mm P226s from lack of oil and too much grease. I liked the guns though.
I've never had a maintenance related failure in a Glock or HK.

No ones going to test these, and voting is purely based on subjective criticism. I voted, and wish I could take it back. Unless somebody here owns all three, new, and is willing to torture their weapons, this is mostly JUST for fun.

I applaud the effort, but there is no real answer here. Polymer, steel, alloy...all at some point will fail, and we may never see that happen in our lifetime. And that is just fine by me.

I say the Sig would go the longest! But maybe a tight match in the end!

I also volunteer to build a machine to hold all three pistols in line and by aid of mechanical device, actuate the triggers and maybe even feed ammo through the magazines at a given rate as to not overheat them!

Now if you all will kindly Donate One Each of said Firearms and aproximately 800,000 rounds of ammo(calculated possibility).........PM me and I will give address to ship components for testing!

As soon as I receive items, I will go to the drawing board on the machine!

Not sure why you would not maintain them. If you did maintain them then probably you would break before the pistols. 500 round x 3 pistols =1500 rounds daily.

Tomcat47 said:

I say the Sig would go the longest! But maybe a tight match in the end!

I also volunteer to build a machine to hold all three pistols in line and by aid of mechanical device, actuate the triggers and maybe even feed ammo through the magazines at a given rate as to not overheat them!

Now if you all will kindly Donate One Each of said Firearms and aproximately 800,000 rounds of ammo(calculated possibility).........PM me and I will give address to ship components for testing!

As soon as I receive items, I will go to the drawing board on the machine!

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Something tells me once tomcat gets his ammo we're never going to hear from him again

I don't think I have ever seen a 4046 used in USPSA or IDPA, I suppose someone could try.

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I wouldn't choose to run a 4046 being DAO and all that, however I would run a 4006 or a 5906 any day of the week over a plastic gun.

I seriously doubt any pistol would function properly after that kind of abuse. Not very realistic either

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Neither is saying a pistol can go 300,000 or even 200,000 rounds with absolutely nothing done to it. It's just impossible. C'mon. 300,000 rounds with no lube, no repairs, and no maintenance whatsoever? You buy that? Your setting off an explosion every single time that trigger goes. Newton's second law was still in play last time I checked...

Don't forget to mail the Guns too........

And not one of the choices...and not an opening to go off topic either..just a point as stated by numbers given....

BERETTA U.S.A. RELIABILITY AND DURABILITY STATISTICS FOR THE BERETTA 9mm PISTOL.
• The average reliability of all M9 pistols tested at Beretta U.S.A. is 17,500 rounds without a stoppage.
• During one test of twelve pistols fired at Beretta U.S.A. before Army supervision, Beretta-made M9 pistols shot 168,000 rounds without a single malfunction. (that equals 14k per pistol btw!)
• The Beretta 9mm pistol was the most reliable of all pistols tested in the 1984 competition which resulted in the award of the M9 contract to Beretta.
• Two-thirds of all M9 pistols endurance tested at Beretta U.S.A. fired 5,000 rounds without a single mal function or, at most, with only one malfunction.
• The average durability of Beretta M9 slides is over 35,000 rounds, the point at which U.S. Army testing ceases.
• The average durability of M9 frames is over 30,000 rounds. The average durability of M9 locking blocks is 22,000 rounds.

I don't think NO pistol is going to go 250k rounds without cleaning and or repair....springs for sure! And I also believe you would get similar results from all 3 contenders!

I should not have posted this until after I recieved the firearms and 800k rounds of ammo.....:banghead:

Glock

Someone in this thread said they had a Glock 19 that jammed more than they liked. In my experience, if you have a Glock 19 that jams AT ALL, I suggest you get it looked at. As it definitely is not right and is in some manner broken. I've owned Glock 17,19,22,23 (actually several of each, all Gen 3) and I'd bet I have 20k rounds (perhaps MUCH more) through the batch. I currently have 3 Glock's. Not once have I had a malfunction of any kind by a Glock pistol. Also for the last several weeks. I've been shooting about 400 rounds a week rapid fire (approx. 6-7 rounds a second). After seeing The S&W Shooter McCuleck (spelling) fire 11 rounds a second accurately. I thought I'd give it a try. I'm sure not him, but I am having fun (but am going broke buying ammo! grin). I've had not one jam, nada, zip.


I have had exactly 2 mag related jams with a Glock in my life. I did buy a very very well used Police mag (gun show junk table) that miss-fed once and I threw it in the trash. I also purchased a Korean extended mag that after stored loaded for 6-7 months jammed. I threw it in the trash too. The point is, Glock's with Glock mags, the jam rate would have to be almost infinitesimal . At least for the Gen 3's I have owned. I'd bet your 19 is broken in some way if it jams anywhere near regularly.

Tomcat47 said:

Don't forget to mail the Guns too........

And not one of the choices...and not an opening to go off topic either..just a point as stated by numbers given....

BERETTA U.S.A. RELIABILITY AND DURABILITY STATISTICS FOR THE BERETTA 9mm PISTOL.
• The average reliability of all M9 pistols tested at Beretta U.S.A. is 17,500 rounds without a stoppage.
• During one test of twelve pistols fired at Beretta U.S.A. before Army supervision, Beretta-made M9 pistols shot 168,000 rounds without a single malfunction. (that equals 14k per pistol btw!)
• The Beretta 9mm pistol was the most reliable of all pistols tested in the 1984 competition which resulted in the award of the M9 contract to Beretta.
• Two-thirds of all M9 pistols endurance tested at Beretta U.S.A. fired 5,000 rounds without a single mal function or, at most, with only one malfunction.
• The average durability of Beretta M9 slides is over 35,000 rounds, the point at which U.S. Army testing ceases.
• The average durability of M9 frames is over 30,000 rounds. The average durability of M9 locking blocks is 22,000 rounds.

I don't think NO pistol is going to go 250k rounds without cleaning and or repair....springs for sure! And I also believe you would get similar results from all 3 contenders!

I should not have posted this until after I recieved the firearms and 800k rounds of ammo.....:banghead:

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As I recall, wasn't the Sig 226 the only other gun that beat the M9, but it was a little bit more expensive?


Says a lot if my memory serves me correctly...

Nobody's opinion is going to have any bearing on this little experiment.

All three will keep going longer than the shooter's patience holds out.

As I recall, wasn't the Sig 226 the only other gun that beat the M9, but it was a little bit more expensive?

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Yup...and some say that Beretta was tipped of as to the price that Sig offered the US govt so that they could go slightly lower and thus win the contract.

I have less faith in current production Sigs than the HK or Glock listed. That said, it's pretty much moot for most shooters and the gun will outlast them. Interesting the Glock 17 even made it to 20% though.

p.s. I've actually owned the Glock, the HK and the Sig for what that's worth... which is very little I'm sure.

I did not vote.If i absolutely had to then i would not vote against the glock.

No ones going to test these, and voting is purely based on subjective criticism. I voted, and wish I could take it back. Unless somebody here owns all three, new, and is willing to torture their weapons, this is mostly JUST for fun.

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And what's wrong with that? LOL... It encourages critical thinking and the sharing of ideas. Lots of interesting things have been shared, speculated, etc... I've enjoyed it! So what if we'll never know for sure? Even if someone bought all three and tried this, the result would NOT be generalizable to additional tests. It's just fun.

Because it is purely that, speculation. I agree, it's fun as I said. But, none of this bantering and comparison will come to fruition. Fanboys will fight, babies will cry, and feelings may get hurt. I hope not, but it may happen.

Continue the game, boys. But watch the score board. No points will be accumulated, and no one will win. :banghead:

As I recall, wasn't the Sig 226 the only other gun that beat the M9, but it was a little bit more expensive?

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Neither gun 'beat' the other, they were both competitors in the same trial. They both met the required standard, which no other competitors did, and the Sig had a slightly lower cost per unit than the Beretta. The Beretta won out on parts and accessories cost, which made the total cost per weapon lower than the Sig bid.

I think the rumor that Beretta was tipped off has been debunked as best it could.

im not sure which would break first, but if i had to bet which was gonna break LAST, itd be the Glock.

I've never had a Glock, but I had a couple XD's. The XD .45 felt useless compared to my 1911s, so I sold it fairly soon. The XD.40 was showing signs of wear after a few thousand rounds. My Sig 229, with a few thousand rounds through it doesn't seem worn at all. Not that this means anything, as I clean thoroughly after shooting, and wipe down my carry gun daily. The plastic guns seem to get sloppy, to me. Maybe that doesn't mean it will break, or become unreliable, but I don't like it.

Well, hello, my first post, but have done some reading here, and I like the info. Thanks.

http://www.theprepared.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=90

'Nuff said.

fromthehills said:

I've never had a Glock, but I had a couple XD's. The XD .45 felt useless compared to my 1911s, so I sold it fairly soon. The XD.40 was showing signs of wear after a few thousand rounds. My Sig 229, with a few thousand rounds through it doesn't seem worn at all. Not that this means anything, as I clean thoroughly after shooting, and wipe down my carry gun daily. The plastic guns seem to get sloppy, to me. Maybe that doesn't mean it will break, or become unreliable, but I don't like it.

Well, hello, my first post, but have done some reading here, and I like the info. Thanks.

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Welcome to THR fromthehills!

Sounds like you have a couple of nice handguns. Certainly nothing wrong with having a 1911 and a 229 in ones collection. I have an old Glock 23 from 1992 or so and a new Gen 4 Glock 17. The 17 feels very solid. The G23 feels slightly less solid but It does have a few years and rounds through it. I have no experiences with XD's but they do have their fans as well. Hard to beat a 1911 when it comes to .45 though.

Not that any of us will have a closed environment to test all 3, but I would bet my house note that the Glock will last the longest.

I carry a Glock 19... You can carry what you like,
Opinions are like belly buttons.

Thanks for the welcome. I should get a hold of a Glock 17 to see. Not sure why I have an aversion to them with no experience with them. I was a dedicated 1911 guy, am still. But wanted a cheaper carry gun, and got the XD. Still carried the 1911. Now I carry the 229. I'll get on topic in other threads about it. Don't know the hijack policy, here.

Because it is purely that, speculation. I agree, it's fun as I said. But, none of this bantering and comparison will come to fruition.

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Well, you could think of this as the odds line.

Not that any of us will have a closed environment to test all 3, but I would bet my house note that the Glock will last the longest.

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And there's at least one taker!

Anyways, the speculation isn't all based on subjective criticism, at all. There are plenty of objective observations and common sense at work, here.

Sig has full length guide rails. Full length steel on alum alloy guide rails, no less. Steel on aluminum means friction. I dunno how you expect that to keep on working indefinitely without cleaning and lube. Or how you expect an alum alloy frame to outlast modern polymer and steel when it comes to the barrel repeatedly smacking into the locking block.

A Glock CAN work indefinitely without lube or cleaning, since the slide rails are self-cleaning. And the polymer frames last a hecka long time. This test has already been done. Some famous guy did this with his Glock like 15 years ago. The name "Chuck"- something, a G17, and 100,000 rds seems to ring a bell.

^ Please, don't kid a kidder. Done with THIS thread in particular. Later, guys.

Ranger30-06

"This is because the 1911 was originally a loose gun." The originals were not loose. They were tighter than what you think. They were not Les Baer tight but they did not rattle until the military got a hold of them.

Of the three I am willing to bet the average shooter is not going to wear out any of the three pistols. The gun forums tend to be the exception to the rule in the gun owner market. Most people in the US buy a pistol that sees maybe 100-200 rounds per year. If you think about how many rounds you put down range with ammo prices the way they are you will understand the gun owners (that fall into the 100-200) see ammo as waaaaay to expensive. Ask yourself this questions "How many rounds do I shoot through one pistol in a year?" I fall into the 3000 to 5000 range. But I rotate between other pistols I do not shoot as much to keep proficient.

Every pistol will break if you shoot it enough and dont take care of it. For example if you dont replace the springs. They will; batter a steel framed pistol, peen an aluminum frame and weaken the plastic frame.

Of the three choices I said the HK will break first. I have seen the others "Unmodified" go for tens of thousands of rounds. My experience with the HK is not great with their tight chambers and terrible trigger on the USP models.

I have owned all of them and here is my take on the question. Sigs are reliable with whatever ammo I used, but the decocker threw off my grip. So I sold them to get weapons my hand likes better. Glocks do not provide the grip texture I need for the sweat my hands distribute. I have no problems with them that are not related to me. I can shoot them well but they are not my first choice. The HK is a expensive glock with a horrible trigger installed and a finish that is ok. I am not talking about the P30 just the usp.

That is my take on your question.