9x18 sub for 9x19

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hedrok

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Due to the extreme shortage of 9mm ammo, one of my fellow shooters has been substituting Makarov ammo 9x18 for his usual Blazer 9mm. We both shoot revolvers a lot more than our semi-autos, but they do see action. He says he's saving the 9mm for the semis.
I really couldn't tell him whether it was a good idea or not. It LOOKS like it'd be OK...but I know there's a snake in there somewhere :eek:
Any ideas????
 
Yes there is.

The 9x18 is NOT 9mm. It's 9.2 mm.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9×18mm_Makarov

See the 9x19 (Luger) is a .355 diameter slug while the 9x18 is a .365.

That makes it hard to go down the bore and raises pressures alot.

And the problem is compounded by the fact the 9x18, while having a head diameter about the same, the brass thickness is far less than the 9x19 Luger.

It defiantly is not a wise idea as the case might blow where the feed ramp is.

Deaf
 
Not a good idea.

I am a bit confused by the OP and post location. Are you talking about running 9X18 in say a Ruger Convertible 9X19 cylinder, with the .357 barrel?

Not saying this is a good idea, but let us know how that works out.
 
seen a few 9x18s go into 9mm guns due to lots of people shooting out of the same bag, and someone not knowing the difference by look. Never seen one go into battery, not even close. Usually really difficult to get the slide unlocked too. 9x17 on the other hand will chamber, will allow the slide to close, will fire, and often will cycle the weopon. But 9x17 is more expensive, and as hard to find, as well as being a bad idea.--
 
Thanks for the "ammunition" to go back to the discussion with.
He had mentioned...38/357 then .32 s&w, .32 long, .32 H&R, .327 then he went into .45acp, .45gap, and something else that I don't remember with the point being that "lots of things were interchangeable."
I said I'd ask 'cause I didn't feel quite as confident. I'm glad I did.:)
Thanks for the guidance.
 
45 acp and 45 gap are also very different cartridges.
357 mag was developed from the 38 spl. Same with the
32 family. Glock developed their own parameters for
The GAP unrelated to Colt's design.
 
In these hard times I find that by using .22 in a 9mm provides much needed practice at little cost.. when the .22 shell drops out of your barrel, you pick it up and repeat.
If you do this enough, you'll be in fine shape when you finally see an unguarded piece of brass on the range.. swoop!
 
You can shoot 45 GAP in any revolver chambered in 45 ACP using moon clips. The 45 GAP was based on the 45 ACP the only difference is that the GAP is shorter, bore diameter is the same.
 
I really couldn't tell him whether it was a good idea or not.
Click to expand...
NOT.
He had mentioned...38/357 then .32 s&w, .32 long, .32 H&R, .327 then he went into .45acp, .45gap, and something else that I don't remember with the point being that "lots of things were interchangeable."
Click to expand...
It is really never a good idea to shoot anything in an autopistol other than the specific round that the pistol is chambered for. The exceptions are rounds that are identically or essentially identically dimensioned (i.e. .30Mauser/.30Tokarev, .38ACP/.38Super, assuming that the pistol can tolerate the pressure difference if there is a difference.

Otherwise, shooting anything other than the native chambering requires, at a minimum, a conversion barrel for safety.

In a revolver, things are different, and as long as the round will chamber AND it is the same pressure or lower as the native chambering, it should be safe to fire. All of the chamberings and "interchangeable" rounds he mentions are primarily revolver cartridges. The .45ACP and .45GAP can be interchangeable, but only in a revolver, and only in a revolver that is rated for .45ACP+P.

There are three reasons that it is a bad idea to mix chamberings in an autopistol.

1. The round headspaces off the extractor which stresses the extractor since the extractor is not designed for that purpose.
2. The round headspaces off the extractor which can result in excessive headspace since the extractor is not designed to control headspace.
3. The sharp lip at the front of an autopistol chamber can shave material and retain it. If enough material builds up on the lip, it can act as a partial obstruction and blow the chamber when the gun fires. In a revolver, the chamber is tapered and there is no sharp lip to shave and retain material.

In the particular case under discussion, the bore size mismatch makes it an even worse idea since the larger bullet is bound to shave material at the front of the chamber.

In addition to stopping his practice, he needs to THOROUGHLY clean the barrel, taking special care to make sure that the chamber is completely free of any buildup before he shoots the gun again.
 
Seriously bad and dangerous idea. The bullet diameters are not the same, Makarov being bigger. This putting the wrong ammo in guns is Darwin Award material...
 
Same type thread came up on another board and I went and tried to chamber a 9x18 in my Kel Tec. It wouldn't go into battery. The case is considerably fatter and not tapered. I trim 9x19 brass and fire form it for my P64, case head size being the ONLY thing that's the same. I would never force that bullet down a 9mm bore, could bulge the barrel or burst it even though it works at lower pressures.
 
has been substituting Makarov ammo 9x18
Click to expand...
I can't imagine 9mm MAK even fitting in the chambers of a 9x19 Luger chambered revolver cylinder.

What brand of gun is it??

And is it a 9mm Luger revolver, or a .38 Spl??

rc
 
9x18

I carry my CZ82 as a substitute for my 9x19 M & P. I would NEVER use or attempt to use 9x18 ammunition in my M & P.They may chamber but not correctly and if it should fire a dangerous situation could occure.As someone has said there is a difference in the bore,with the 9x18 being a larger diameter.I like the CZ82 because it is the most accurate handgun I own,at least in my hands.:banghead:
 
We were discussing revolvers and specifically his Taurus 9mm.
I emailed him the link to this discussion....and...
Apparently, and thankfully, he's convinced it won't be such a good idea.

Thanks for the help...Much appreciated. :)
 
Just because you can does not mean should....

I have a Webley Mark IV revolver that was orginally .455 Webley, cut to take .45 AutoRim revolver cartridges or the .45 ACP in moonclips.

The cylinder has both first and second BP (black powder) proofs, both crown over VR (Victoria Regina). Victoria was Queen of England in the decades up to 1902. That's OLD revolver. When cordite and nitro powder were introduced for the .455 Webley cartridge, Webley introduced the Mark V then the Mark VI revolvers with thicker cylinders.

I CAN and HAVE shot .45 ACP in my revolver. It will substitute. But I DON'T anymore because I can load .45 Auto rim and .45 ACP cases with .454" 255gr Colt bullets and BP substitute loads to approximate the original .455 260gr BP loads Webley designed the gun for.

.380 in 9mm Mak is another emergency-only substitution. I have racked the slide of a Makarov loaded with .380 and found the .380 round slipped off the extractor and remained in the barrel. Don't want to do that no more either.
 
Personally, Even though the factory says it's OK, I didn't even like the idea of putting a .45 Long Colt in a Judge because of the distance from the end of the loaded cartridge to the forcing cone...especially in the magnums. It just doesn't seem like a good idea to me. Now I hear from a couple of Judge owners that there are having problems with LColt ammo.
I'm with the "right ammo for the gun" rule all the way...but until this thread, I couldn't actually debate the details of "why."
 
There is a guy down the block from you that knows all about "substituting" one cartridge for the correct one.

Ask for "Lefty".
 
Could full moon clips allow the 9mm Mak to work in the Webley?
Click to expand...

It would not work in a .455 Webley for sure.

In the years after WWI and before WWII, Webley and Enfield produced revolvers for .38-200, a British military cartridged based on the .38S&W.

Those revolvers were all relatively new production proofed for smokeless powder. Bullet diameter was .361" or 9.2mm similar to the 9x18 Makarov.

All I will say, it seems it would be more feasible than 9x18 in 9x19, <b>but</b> I am not sure I would test it even if I had a .38 Webley, 9mm Makarov. I do have at least one 9mm full moon clip and a 10mm/.40 S&W moon clip in my parts box.
 
Well maybe instead just pull Chinese Mak bullets and reload on the .38 S&W case for the Webley!

Funny thing is I have maybe 400 Hornady 9.2mm XP JHPs made for the Mak (and dies and Winchester brass.) I can load up either .38 S&W or Mak ammo with that stuff.

Deaf
 
.45" Colt in the Taurus Judge is what it's designed for. Now this .45" Long Colt you speak of sounds like a super magnum cartridge that might blow up a Judge ; )

9x18mm in a modern Taurus 9x19mm revolver? I'd try it @ least once - especially if it was someone else's revolver.
 
Which just shows another reason that, personally, I don't give advice on ammunition.
I always thought that .45 Long Colt was the same as .45 Colt, especially since I've never had a gun that fired either one until very recently when I picked up a Ruger Alaskan.
 
hedrok said:
Due to the extreme shortage of 9mm ammo, one of my fellow shooters has been substituting Makarov ammo 9x18 for his usual Blazer 9mm. We both shoot revolvers a lot more than our semi-autos, but they do see action. He says he's saving the 9mm for the semis.
I really couldn't tell him whether it was a good idea or not. It LOOKS like it'd be OK...but I know there's a snake in there somewhere :eek:
Any ideas????
Click to expand...
Ignorance and stupidity of some folks never ceases to amaze me. I would tell him not to make substitutions and stay away from him when he goes shooting if he paid you no mind.
 
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