“Be real easy to rob you folks…”

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Deleted by me.

NO disrespect anyone.

Concealed is Concealed - Private is Private.

Folks with my private phone information: Please do not bring this matter up to anyone that answers the phone or leave a message on recording to indicate any of this.
 
I rather liked the lack of "gear" detail; since I have never met Steve, and because the gun specifics weren't mentioned (they're not relevant, IMO), it was easier to place myself into the scenario, and to what I would have had in that situation (a Makarov, FWIW :) ). It is sometimes difficult to imagine being in a situation where the narrator is equipped with the later "tac-op" gear which costs more than my SUV. By being able to insert myself into that incident, I am better able to picture what I might have done, the mistakes I might have made, etc.

And it does clarify once again that awareness is the most important tool.

******

Now about those diapers, Steve-remember the difference between cover and concealment! A thin metal shelf with a row of Pampers would provide adequate concealment, but if you used it as cover? Well, that might be a crapshoot, SM. :D
 
Ever seen young ladies totally get pissed? I have, she earned the right to do so. I asked if she was all right, she was doing okay. I had concealed my weapon and explained to her, “I know, my parents have CCW, I didn’t see a thing, it totally <expletive> sucks I have to wait until age 21”.
Great job sm, I think this a lot of why carry practice and awareness is important.
I think that the above quote really sums up a large portion of this post, CCW
should be a right not a permit and my question is "why is 21 the age for CCW?"

sm :D
 
Just found this thread, great read. I had no problem following the debrief, the type handgun was not important as it was not seen by either the BG or LE. Based on sm's choice of shotguns though, my guess would be either a Colt GM or a S&W revo (19, 27, 29). The points that came thru for me are the increased threat awareness and non-verbal communication between sm and his two partners, and the actions they took independently. Nice.
Johnny_Yuma said:
omitted the usual paragraph-long description of his weapon, holster, ammo, and other acoutrements that too often accompanies self-defense accounts. You know, the one that reads "My strong-hand gravitated toward my BigBang Custom with the custom goncalo-alves grips by Soros Grips and tritium Stupendous Nite-Sites by Tinky-Winky. I silently drew the weapon from the custom Schumer IWB chicken-skin holster where it rides in the 4 o'clock position on a custom Feinstein Concealment Belt. It's custom Boxer Magazines were stoked with 8 rounds of 230 grain Nightstalker JHPs and my Blissninny mag carriers held two more magazines at the ready, just over my left hip at the 9 o'clock. My thumb snicked off the Kustom Kombat safety and my finger poised just outside the trigger-guard, a fraction of an inch from sliding over the custom Razzle-Dazzle combat trigger and delivering a precise 2.43632 lb stroke to unleash the 230 grains of righteous hell parked at the South end of my custom Lehd Peip hand-lapped barrel."

His keen perception of his surroundings and his level-headed tactics where what was important about his post. I don't care what he carries and I'll bet the checkout girl doesn't care, either.;)

Nice job, Steve.
LOL, too funny.
 
I know I am going to get jumped on here, since Steve is about as senior of a member here as you can get. I understand the situational awareness aspect, but where was the imminent threat? Is it ok for Joe Citizen to draw his weapon and confront people that haven't yet crossed the line from being jerks to being criminals? Were these guys loudmouth punks just being obnoxious? I would not plan on drawing my gun unless I was planning on shooting someone.

JM
 
I thought the same thing johnnymenudo. Reading the account one could come to the conclusion that he pulled a gun on a couple of snickering jerks because a christmas ornament broke.

I'm choosing to take into account the statements of others on the board who seem to be vouching for Steve's credibility/judgement and give him the benefit of the doubt.
 
Johnny_Yuma said:
omitted the usual paragraph-long description of his weapon, holster, ammo, and other acoutrements that too often accompanies self-defense accounts. You know, the one that reads "My strong-hand gravitated toward my BigBang Custom with the custom goncalo-alves grips by Soros Grips and tritium Stupendous Nite-Sites by Tinky-Winky. I silently drew the weapon from the custom Schumer IWB chicken-skin holster where it rides in the 4 o'clock position on a custom Feinstein Concealment Belt. It's custom Boxer Magazines were stoked with 8 rounds of 230 grain Nightstalker JHPs and my Blissninny mag carriers held two more magazines at the ready, just over my left hip at the 9 o'clock. My thumb snicked off the Kustom Kombat safety and my finger poised just outside the trigger-guard, a fraction of an inch from sliding over the custom Razzle-Dazzle combat trigger and delivering a precise 2.43632 lb stroke to unleash the 230 grains of righteous hell parked at the South end of my custom Lehd Peip hand-lapped barrel."

His keen perception of his surroundings and his level-headed tactics where what was important about his post. I don't care what he carries and I'll bet the checkout girl doesn't care, either.;)

Nice job, Steve.
Johnny, you just made a fairly long day amusing with that statement. Thanks...
 
Larry Ashcraft said:
Here:Quote:
but where was the imminent threat?

Here:

Quote:
“Be real easy to rob you folks…”
Was spoken by the second fellow to enter – you could have heard a pin drop.


And here:

Quote:
well in explicit terms he said how much he liked what he saw in the blue jeans and logo T-shirt the young female checker was wearing


And here:

Again I ask you where the imminent threat lies? I did not know that making a stupid and irresponsible comment or harassing a woman warranted a deadly force response. Theatrical presentation aside, this scenario to me sounds like an over reaction to a couple of foul mouthed idiots who were certainly very stupid, but not imminently threatening. Just because a guy says how easy it would be to rob someone, or says he would like to **** a girl does not give you the green light to apply deadly force. Are you contending that his actions constituted a robbery or rape in progress??

JM
 
Are you contending that his actions constituted a robbery or rape in progress??
Not contending anything. I wasn't there.

BUT, I'm one of the few on here who have actually met and spent time with Steve, and I've also spent many hours talking with him on the phone, so when he states something, I tend to believe him. Believe me, he isn't someone who would make something out of nothing. Also, I know for a fact that he wouldn't draw his gun unless he felt he had to.
 
Steve,
No elephants, but you stired up some ghosts and an ol' dog that won't hunt.

The car accident reference doesn't really come all that close. Having to call upon training that you hope you'll never have to use is rarely a good thing.
The questions that follow as you analyze your decisions after the fact can do nasty things to your wellbeing.

For what its worth, you might not think you did, but you did enough.

Thanks for being on our side.
Sorry I don't have more to offer.

Chris
 
but where was the imminent threat?
Two suspicious-acting characters amble up, block the main exit, take on dominating roles, express their intent to rob, begin terrorizing the sheeple, and make it clear they are in charge and that the customers will obey.

Ability: two healthy males. They may be outnumbered, but they can cause grave harm bare-handed. Anyone that challenges them can be "disposed of" very quickly. While no weapons shown, behavior exhibits confidence that they have the means to cause grave harm.

Opportunity: physically right there, entrance dominated. Crowd is self-limiting for movement. Cashier has limited movement behind counter. Almost nobody there would have thought of the back exit had sm not mentioned it. If capable of causing harm, they sure had the opportunity to cause it.

Jeopardy: overt expressions of dominance, intent to rob, and thinly-veiled expressions of "comply or suffer". These guys were not shoppers, they were plainly there to cause trouble with an easy segway (sp?) into violence if anyone crossed them. Sometimes, you just know - and everybody there, sm, anonymous helpers, customers, and clerk, KNEW.

Ability + Opportunity + Jeopardy = seriously bad situation.

Yes, it's not as overt as "they ran in shooting randomly".
The real world is often not that easy to articulate in stark black-and-white terms.
Streetwise people will recognize a developing "situation" long before it reaches clinical clarity.
By the time a lethal situation DOES reach total stark clarity, it may be too late.
Our heros recognized what was developing, took action, controlled the situation, and gave an excellent subtle-but-clear response: "don't go there".
 
ctdonath,

Thank You. Nice summary.

Note: though Steve drew, nobody knew he drew. he was merely "one step ahead" of the BGs. Nobody knew, before, during or after that he had drawn his weapon.

That, folks, is good tactics. :)

Hats off to you Steve.

Edit:
Streetwise people will recognize a developing "situation" long before it reaches clinical clarity.
That, sir, is a very wise observation, thank you.
 
ct,

Well said.

For your edification. Myself? I used to pronounce it seh-gew, you at least got the phonetics correct.

segue \SEG-way; SAYG-way\, verb:
To proceed without interruption; to make a smooth transition.

Daylight segued into dusk.
--Susan Dworski

Segue is Italian, meaning "it follows," from seguire, to follow, from Latin sequi. It is also used as a noun, signifying the act or any instance of segueing.
 
Dang, Steve. Glad nothing worse happened, it could have been a real furball. Hope the local gendarmes round up the two bad actors based on the descriptions, chances are they already have a passing acquaintance with them anyway.

Stay safe, my friend-

lpl/finally back in NC
 
Good job- and those who may be unwilling to admit a threat exsisted- if it looks like a dog, smells like a dog, and barks like a dog, are you going to wait till it bites? More to the point, and perhaps more important than any qualifiable behavior , is the "sixth sense" that something is wrong.
 
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